The Next Military Step...Stealth Weapons?

On Apr 12, 5:45*am, "Jonathan" wrote:
Lasers will not give away the position of the weapon
or leave behind any physical evidence showing who
is responsible for the attack.

Things will just seem to suddenly explode
for no apparent reason with laser strikes.

Whether placed in Hummers, or a C-130 [1]
where its laser already can pop a tire at five miles.
Or mounted on a naval vessel [2].

Or whether the attack is from a ground based
laser, such as the Starfire Optical Range [3]
where the beam might be directed globally using a
constellation of mirrors [4] *in low earth orbit.

Or whether some laser is mounted in a future version
of our military space plane [5], which is set to launch
this month.

They will all have one common element. Which is that
the target will explode without any warning, and without
leaving behind any evidence of who or what was
responsible for the attack.

Is this the future of modern warfare?

In any event, I feel very fortunate to be on the ...same side
of the folks building this stuff.

Jonathan

[1] Advanced Tactical Laserhttp://www.boeing.com/defense-space/ic/des/index.html

[2] Maritime Laser Demonstrationhttp://www.armybase.us/2010/01/maritime-laser-demonstration-mld-passe...

[3] Starfirehttp://www.engadget.com/2006/06/28/starfire-optical-range-a-death-ray...

[4] Advanced Relay Mirror Systemhttp://www.globalsecurity.org/space/systems/arms.htm

[5] Military Space plane X-37bhttp://news.cnet.com/military-tech/?keyword=Boeing

s

It just makes makes murder, mayhem, and misuse more likely.

"lorad" wrote in message
...



It just makes murder, mayhem, and misuse more likely.

That's what bothers me also, as our ability to reduce civilian casualties
increases, it might make the use of those weapons more likely.
Maybe even leading to essentially a constant state or war, which
the war on terror seems to be. Wouldn't that scenario, where our
military is zapping some evil-doer on a daily basis, turn our
military into more of an international police force?

If we build the capability which allows us to be the policemen
of the world, do we then have a moral obligation to become
just that?



Jonathan


s

On Apr 11, 9:32*am, "Jonathan" wrote:


If we build the capability which allows us to be the policemen
of the world, do we then have a moral obligation to become
just that?

Jonathan

The US is relatively short on secret-police experience, we never had
an OAS or IRA or ETA or Red Army Faction to suppress. And it's a
necessary GloboCop skill I hope we don't have to acquire.

In article ,
says...

Lasers will not give away the position of the weapon
or leave behind any physical evidence showing who
is responsible for the attack.

Things will just seem to suddenly explode
for no apparent reason with laser strikes.

Whether placed in Hummers, or a C-130 [1]
where its laser already can pop a tire at five miles.
Or mounted on a naval vessel [2].

Or whether the attack is from a ground based
laser, such as the Starfire Optical Range [3]
where the beam might be directed globally using a
constellation of mirrors [4] in low earth orbit.

Or whether some laser is mounted in a future version
of our military space plane [5], which is set to launch
this month.

They will all have one common element. Which is that
the target will explode without any warning, and without
leaving behind any evidence of who or what was
responsible for the attack.

Is this the future of modern warfare?

In any event, I feel very fortunate to be on the ...same side
of the folks building this stuff.


Jonathan

[1] Advanced Tactical Laser
http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/ic/des/index.html

[2] Maritime Laser Demonstration
http://www.armybase.us/2010/01/marit...aval-research/

[3] Starfire
http://www.engadget.com/2006/06/28/s...sciences-sake/

[4] Advanced Relay Mirror System
http://www.globalsecurity.org/space/systems/arms.htm

[5] Military Space plane X-37b
http://news.cnet.com/military-tech/?keyword=Boeing


Perhaps it's the future of warfare on clear and sunny days. That
just means the grunts, as usual, will have to fight in the rain,
dust storms, and snow.

Mark Borgerson

Lasers will not give away the position of the weapon
or leave behind any physical evidence showing who
is responsible for the attack.

Things will just seem to suddenly explode
for no apparent reason with laser strikes.

Whether placed in Hummers, or a C-130 [1]
where its laser already can pop a tire at five miles.
Or mounted on a naval vessel [2].

Or whether the attack is from a ground based
laser, such as the Starfire Optical Range [3]
where the beam might be directed globally using a
constellation of mirrors [4] in low earth orbit.

Or whether some laser is mounted in a future version
of our military space plane [5], which is set to launch
this month.

They will all have one common element. Which is that
the target will explode without any warning, and without
leaving behind any evidence of who or what was
responsible for the attack.

Is this the future of modern warfare?

In any event, I feel very fortunate to be on the ...same side
of the folks building this stuff.


Jonathan

[1] Advanced Tactical Laser
http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/ic/des/index.html

[2] Maritime Laser Demonstration
http://www.armybase.us/2010/01/marit...aval-research/

[3] Starfire
http://www.engadget.com/2006/06/28/s...sciences-sake/

[4] Advanced Relay Mirror System
http://www.globalsecurity.org/space/systems/arms.htm

[5] Military Space plane X-37b
http://news.cnet.com/military-tech/?keyword=Boeing




s

In article ,
"Jonathan" wrote:

Lasers will not give away the position of the weapon
or leave behind any physical evidence showing who
is responsible for the attack.

Things will just seem to suddenly explode
for no apparent reason with laser strikes.

Whether placed in Hummers, or a C-130 [1]
where its laser already can pop a tire at five miles.
Or mounted on a naval vessel [2].

Surface based lasers are limited to LOS horizon, silly.

Or whether the attack is from a ground based
laser, such as the Starfire Optical Range [3]
where the beam might be directed globally using a
constellation of mirrors [4] in low earth orbit.

That's better.

Or whether some laser is mounted in a future version
of our military space plane [5], which is set to launch
this month.

They will all have one common element. Which is that
the target will explode without any warning, and without
leaving behind any evidence of who or what was
responsible for the attack.

Is this the future of modern warfare?

In any event, I feel very fortunate to be on the ...same side
of the folks building this stuff.

Amen.

--
Neolibertarian

"[The American People] know that we don't have deficits
because people are taxed too little; we have deficits
because big government spends too much."
---Ronald Reagan

Jonathan wrote:

It's looking to me like the war on terror is creating that ability.
We seem to make some bad guy explode on a pretty regular
basis these days, going on ten years really.

It makes wedding parties explode as well.

It isn't the weapons that need improvement, it's the targeting...

--
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.

Jonathan wrote:

"William Black" wrote in message
...
Jonathan wrote:

It's looking to me like the war on terror is creating that ability.
We seem to make some bad guy explode on a pretty regular
basis these days, going on ten years really.

It makes wedding parties explode as well.


You mean those weddiing parties that just happen to have
anti-aircraft guns as part of the ceremony?

Your joviality at the slaughter of innocents is misplaced.


It isn't the weapons that need improvement, it's the targeting...


But with lasers, the two systems can become one in the same.
And with civilians becoming the defensive weapon of choice
for so many of our adversaries, lasers can do things nothing else
can. For instance an armored column surrounded by hundreds of
human shields. A laser can be scaled to stop every vehicle without
killing everyone. Not to mention someday providing a bottomless
magazine.

Does it work?

--
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.

"Jim Wilkins" wrote in message
...
On Apr 11, 9:32 am, "Jonathan" wrote:


If we build the capability which allows us to be the policemen
of the world, do we then have a moral obligation to become
just that?

Jonathan

The US is relatively short on secret-police experience, we never had
an OAS or IRA or ETA or Red Army Faction to suppress. And it's a
necessary GloboCop skill I hope we don't have to acquire.

It's looking to me like the war on terror is creating that ability.
We seem to make some bad guy explode on a pretty regular
basis these days, going on ten years really.

And reading some of the military literature concerning the kinds
of capabilities the military wants ten and twenty years out, it
looks like our technology advances with missile defense will
translate to a very effective world-wide precision strike
capability.

Missile defense will do more than just destroy launching
and incoming missiles, but they want to be able to immediately
track the mobile launcher and take it out in real time.

And everything points towards lasers as the answer.
The scenario below clearly shows how a missile defense
system can be directly turned into an offensive system.



(2006)
US ARMY SPACE MASTER PLAN

"Future Scenario"

"In a future small, regional conflict (2020), a threat force
launches a theater ballistic missile at US/coalition forces using
a Transporter Erector Launch vehicle (TEL). TheSpace-Based
IntraRed Sensor (SBIRS) System detects the launch and tracks the
missile through burn-out, providing data to the Joint Tactical Ground
Station/Multi-Mission Mobile Processor (JTAGS/M3P). The
JTAGS/M3P predicts the trajectory path from SBIRS data
and passes that information to missile defense interceptors; it
also provides missile warning messages to other appropriate
theater network based oni mpact point predictions. SBIRS also
provides a machine-to-machine cue, with the estimated launch point,
to the Space Radar system. The Space Radar (SR) platform uses a
real-time prioritizing algorithm (based on a priori rule sets) to
re-stack its collection order and repositions its antenna to provide
radar moving target indicator coverage of the estimated launch point."

"The SR tracks the TEL when it begins to move to its hide site,
and passes the track information through the Distributed Common
Ground System to either the Joint Operations Center or the Joint
Air Defense OperationCenter for assigning a weapons platform
to the TEL. Space Radar continues to provide track information
to the assigned weapons platform while it is enroute, enabling the
weapons platform to quickly locate and kill the target."
http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=...BdDX5oAJyvgc1g


DIRECTED ENERGY DIRECTORATE

"Long Range Strike - Identify, communicate and attack time critical targets
anytime; anywhere."
http://www.kirtland.af.mil/library/f...et.asp?id=7971

Invisibility is here;
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/conten...cience.1186351
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/conten...t/314/5798/403

Such a sheild deployed around a soldier, or warcraft, would render
them invisible.

Laser propelled projectiles create hypervelocity rounds with very
little energy when compared to direct laser illumination.

A 45 caliber round massing 0.017 kg travelling at 1,200 m/sec contains
12,240 Joules of energy.

A round traveling 40x faster (48,000 m/sec) contans 1,600x as much
energy per unit mass. So, a round massing only 0.001 kg contains as
much energy as a 45 caliber round travelling at high velocity. So,
instead 6 rounds in a quarter pound of bullets, you'd have 9,600
rounds in a quarter pound of bullets.

These might be considered conventional approaches to invisibility.

Unconventional approaches would be to penetrate and control a space
without the target's knowledge. This can be done with MEMS based and
nano-scale based coordinated weapons systems.

http://www.georgiaencyclopedia.org/n....jsp?id=h-1319

Swarming nano-bots that are programmed to render a region
uninhabitable are possible.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uURqcI08IC4

Which is an advanced version of 'beanbots' which you can make over the
weekend

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzFCA-xUc8w

Nanoscale versions of these things could float on the breeze like a
fog, swarming through a region virtually undetected and build virtual
real-time models of a region. Items within a region could then be
id'd and tracked, and when signaled, the fog elements would totally
dissolve a region of interest in ways that eliminate collateral damage
- without the knowledge of non-targets.

Natural biological systems already produce elements that are too small
to see
http://repairacmiami.com/2.html

And we are well on our way to making machinery on this scale
http://guides.library.ucsb.edu/mecheng

(this is an OLD picture)

Creating arrays of dust mite sized swarming elements that are solar
powered and capable of chomping through anything, as well as sensing
the environment around them

http://www.techeblog.com/index.php/t...mallest-camera

(this too is an OLD picture - modern weaponeers will have better
smaller systems)

would be unstoppable as a plague.