Astronauts should speak up

If it were not such serious business you would swear the latest NASA
Press Conference, carried live on NASA TV, was a Saturday Night Live
skit.

The Shuttle Engineering Team, some of the nation's foremost technical
folks, declared that they are not ready to launch the orbiter Discovery
on 1 July and that more time is needed to make fixes for the insulation
problems on the external tank.

But NASA's chief administer, paraphrasing Dubya's recent "I am a
decider" utterance, announced he was over-ruling the engineers and
approving the launch date. He was quick to announce, however, that if
we lost the vehicle now, he will shut down the whole program.

Seems to me we lost a vehicle before when the warning of shuttle
engineers went into the deaf ears of NASA management. I would love to
see the astronauts join their ground-based comrades for unity and
refuse to ride until the engineers declare the mission a "Go."

AL STERN Satellite Beach FL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FloridaMilcom/

wrote:
If it were not such serious business you would swear the latest NASA
Press Conference, carried live on NASA TV, was a Saturday Night Live
skit.

The Shuttle Engineering Team, some of the nation's foremost technical
folks, declared that they are not ready to launch the orbiter
Discovery on 1 July and that more time is needed to make fixes for
the insulation problems on the external tank.

But NASA's chief administer, paraphrasing Dubya's recent "I am a
decider" utterance, announced he was over-ruling the engineers and
approving the launch date. He was quick to announce, however, that if
we lost the vehicle now, he will shut down the whole program.

Seems to me we lost a vehicle before when the warning of shuttle
engineers went into the deaf ears of NASA management. I would love to
see the astronauts join their ground-based comrades for unity and
refuse to ride until the engineers declare the mission a "Go."

AL STERN Satellite Beach FL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FloridaMilcom/

Well, Haveing heard what seems to me to be disagreement about the ice frost
ramp foam, I feel that the engineers may well be being extra doom mongering.
An engineer wants all things sorted and nice and tidy, whereas the admin
want results.

The question to ask is would these bits of foam cause the loss of a vehicle.

Having listened and read, I'm not sure anyone would stick their neck out and
say yes, but if the question is about potential damage, then yes is also the
answer.

In other words, I do feel that they are in danger of saying that now we have
the tools to get at these things, lets take a bold decision.

With regard to the Astronauts. I would have thought if any of them felt
they were in more danger, they would shout foul.

However, that would be common sense, and that is not something I often
associate with mission planning criteria!

Tongue in cheek of course.

Brian
--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email:
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wrote in message
oups.com...
If it were not such serious business you would swear the latest NASA
Press Conference, carried live on NASA TV, was a Saturday Night Live
skit.

The Shuttle Engineering Team, some of the nation's foremost technical
folks, declared that they are not ready to launch the orbiter Discovery
on 1 July and that more time is needed to make fixes for the insulation
problems on the external tank.

But NASA's chief administer, paraphrasing Dubya's recent "I am a
decider" utterance, announced he was over-ruling the engineers and
approving the launch date. He was quick to announce, however, that if
we lost the vehicle now, he will shut down the whole program.

Seems to me we lost a vehicle before when the warning of shuttle
engineers went into the deaf ears of NASA management. I would love to
see the astronauts join their ground-based comrades for unity and
refuse to ride until the engineers declare the mission a "Go."

AL STERN Satellite Beach FL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FloridaMilcom/


The engineers, battered by criticism and haunted by the prospect of being
blamed for a potential mishap, will never give the OK.

This is the time when the leader has to actually show leadership and
override the understandably cautious engineers.

....

"Why don't you fix your little problem and light this candle?"
Alan B. Shepard Jr. 5 May 1961.

IF Griffin were REALLY doing his job!

Well the foam is questionable, and the last redesign may have made it
worse

Its altogether possible we may get a shuttle stuck at station

For this reason the next shuttle will launch with at most a crew of 3
to make surviving at station easier on consumables and equiptement.

This would leave the ISS with 5 people, 3 could de orbit immediately if
necessary the remaing crew of 2 would have no lifeboat till the next
soyuz goes up...

Mark my words we are going to lose abnother vehicle and the final
safety board will site as the primary cause the 2010 ebd date...

I can see launching but not with a full crew.

one is risk the other stupidity.........

Bob Haller wrote:
IF Griffin were REALLY doing his job!

Well the foam is questionable, and the last redesign may have made it
worse

Its altogether possible we may get a shuttle stuck at station

For this reason the next shuttle will launch with at most a crew of 3
to make surviving at station easier on consumables and equiptement.

This would leave the ISS with 5 people, 3 could de orbit immediately if
necessary the remaing crew of 2 would have no lifeboat till the next
soyuz goes up...

Mark my words we are going to lose abnother vehicle and the final
safety board will site as the primary cause the 2010 ebd date...

I can see launching but not with a full crew.

one is risk the other stupidity.........

After reading many of your posts here, you impress me as the kind of
person who would actually be disappointed if your vehicle loss
prediction doesn't happen because you wouldn't be able to say I told you so.

"Bugleboy" wrote in message
news:e6Klg.2909$AC6.892@trndny08...
Bob Haller wrote:

After reading many of your posts here, you impress me as the kind of
person who would actually be disappointed if your vehicle loss
prediction doesn't happen because you wouldn't be able to say I told you
so.


Ding,you got Bob in one.

After reading many of your posts here, you impress me as the kind of
person who would actually be disappointed if your vehicle loss
prediction doesn't happen because you wouldn't be able to say I told you so.

Sadly I predicted we would lose another orbiter before the columbia
disaster. Based on the number of near disasters leading up to that
flight. True I had no way of knowing what would fail but faiure was
predictable based on previous troubles.

google back and you will find my posts which also asked aboiut shuttle
stuck at station. Others laughed at me, some pad rats tried assuring me
I was wrong.things were safe

I happened to be in orlando the day coumbia didnt make it home,
listening for the sonic boom from our hotel....

Sadly NASA has learned NOTHING from the disasters, and is about to
proceed in killing again.

All to keep some jobs for a few extra years

"Bob Haller" wrote in message
ps.com...



After reading many of your posts here, you impress me as the kind of
person who would actually be disappointed if your vehicle loss
prediction doesn't happen because you wouldn't be able to say I told you
so.

Sadly I predicted we would lose another orbiter before the columbia
disaster. Based on the number of near disasters leading up to that
flight. True I had no way of knowing what would fail but faiure was
predictable based on previous troubles.

Maybe you did, but you weren't even close to being the first.

google back and you will find my posts which also asked aboiut shuttle
stuck at station. Others laughed at me, some pad rats tried assuring me
I was wrong.things were safe

Safe, is relative, but just like crying in baseball, there *is* no safe in
spaceflight and anybody who thinks otherwise, should maybe think again...

T3

I AGREE some astronauts familys should pressure their loved ones to
back out, and resign....

Thats better than mourning their loss.

If my wife were going I would tell her...

quit or were divorced

"Bob Haller" wrote in message
oups.com...
I AGREE some astronauts familys should pressure their loved ones to
back out, and resign....

That's nice. And you know what, that's a personal decision for the families
involved. Perhaps they've had that discussion, perhaps not. But to argue
that they "should" is a bit presumptuous.



Thats better than mourning their loss.

If my wife were going I would tell her...

quit or were divorced

And if I were your wife, I'd drink the poison.