Do We Have The Political Will To Support Bush's Moon/Mars Exploration Program?

Yes Or No?

On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 09:57:03 -0400, wrote:

Yes Or No?

Yes...so far.

President Bush seems strongly in favour, where he even made threats to
the Senate if NASA's requested funding was not approved.

The Senate recently approved a $16.4 billion budget for NASA by a vote
of 91 to 4.

Once the next President takes office, where large scale funding
reductions will need to take place to pay back Bush's debts, then this
strong support may quickly change.

Time will tell.

Cardman.

"Cardman" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 09:57:03 -0400, wrote:

Yes Or No?

Yes...so far.

President Bush seems strongly in favour, where he even made threats to
the Senate if NASA's requested funding was not approved.

The Senate recently approved a $16.4 billion budget for NASA by a vote
of 91 to 4.

Once the next President takes office, where large scale funding
reductions will need to take place to pay back Bush's debts, then this
strong support may quickly change.

Time will tell.

Cardman.

Yes, because any other President who comes in after Bush will
realize that NASA has one of two choices for directions now and into the
future; moon, mars and beyond or getting rid of manned spaceflight because
its a waste to simply orbit the earth for the next 30 years, so yes we will
have the will to do one of these choices. I dont think the US, reguardless
of who becomes President in the future, will be stupid enough to cancel
manned spaceflight, so we will be going to moon, mars and beyond and
supporting it in the future.

Ray

In article QNfXe.5332$i86.4869@trndny01, Ray wrote:

"Cardman" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 09:57:03 -0400, wrote:

Yes Or No?

Yes...so far.

President Bush seems strongly in favour, where he even made threats to
the Senate if NASA's requested funding was not approved.

The Senate recently approved a $16.4 billion budget for NASA by a vote
of 91 to 4.

Once the next President takes office, where large scale funding
reductions will need to take place to pay back Bush's debts, then this
strong support may quickly change.

Time will tell.

Cardman.

Yes, because any other President who comes in after Bush will
realize that NASA has one of two choices for directions now and into the
future; moon, mars and beyond or getting rid of manned spaceflight because
its a waste to simply orbit the earth for the next 30 years, so yes we will
have the will to do one of these choices. I dont think the US, reguardless
of who becomes President in the future, will be stupid enough to cancel
manned spaceflight, so we will be going to moon, mars and beyond and
supporting it in the future.

The POTUS has to bear in mind the possible cost to his or her
chances of re-election:


Option Cost

Moon and Mars Lots of $ at a time when the US is living off its credit,
plus the potential to high-light gold old American Don't
Know How. Burkina Faso managed to fly just as many space
stations in the 1980s as the US and at a much lower cost.

Cancel Program A million engineers crying out and then suddenly becoming
unemployed. A passel of angry pork managers gunning for the
POTUS.

Same old same
old Nothing that isn't already happening.

Gentlemen, prepare your Power Point Presentations.
--
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/
http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll

James Nicoll ) wrote:
: In article QNfXe.5332$i86.4869@trndny01, Ray wrote:
:
: "Cardman" wrote in message
: .. .
: On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 09:57:03 -0400, wrote:
:
: Yes Or No?
:
: Yes...so far.
:
: President Bush seems strongly in favour, where he even made threats to
: the Senate if NASA's requested funding was not approved.
:
: The Senate recently approved a $16.4 billion budget for NASA by a vote
: of 91 to 4.
:
: Once the next President takes office, where large scale funding
: reductions will need to take place to pay back Bush's debts, then this
: strong support may quickly change.
:
: Time will tell.
:
: Cardman.
:
: Yes, because any other President who comes in after Bush will
: realize that NASA has one of two choices for directions now and into the
: future; moon, mars and beyond or getting rid of manned spaceflight because
: its a waste to simply orbit the earth for the next 30 years, so yes we will
: have the will to do one of these choices. I dont think the US, reguardless
: of who becomes President in the future, will be stupid enough to cancel
: manned spaceflight, so we will be going to moon, mars and beyond and
: supporting it in the future.
:
: The POTUS has to bear in mind the possible cost to his or her
: chances of re-election:


: Option Cost

: Moon and Mars Lots of $ at a time when the US is living off its credit,
: plus the potential to high-light gold old American Don't
: Know How. Burkina Faso managed to fly just as many space
: stations in the 1980s as the US and at a much lower cost.

: Cancel Program A million engineers crying out and then suddenly becoming
: unemployed. A passel of angry pork managers gunning for the
: POTUS.

: Same old same
: old Nothing that isn't already happening.

: Gentlemen, prepare your Power Point Presentations.


From astronauts to chart chimps!

: --
: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/
: http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll

Ray wrote:

Yes, because any other President who comes in after Bush will
realize that NASA has one of two choices for directions now and into the
future; moon, mars and beyond or getting rid of manned spaceflight because
its a waste to simply orbit the earth for the next 30 years, so yes we will
have the will to do one of these choices. I dont think the US, reguardless
of who becomes President in the future, will be stupid enough to cancel
manned spaceflight, so we will be going to moon, mars and beyond and
supporting it in the future.

A future congress might be indebted enough to cacnel it though.


Ray



--
Sander

+++ Out of cheese error +++

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 00:47:35 +0000 (UTC), Sander Vesik
wrote:

A future congress might be indebted enough to cacnel it though.


Or a future Congress might want to bankroll it to show the US can do
some things right. Even then, I think the CEV capsule and booster
will be built because of the no-on-wants-to-kill-manned-spaceflight
rule. But the lunar missions and Martian missions are trickier.



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On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 15:34:08 GMT, "Ray" wrote:


I dont think the US, reguardless
of who becomes President in the future, will be stupid enough to cancel
manned spaceflight, so we will be going to moon, mars and beyond and
supporting it in the future.



Yes, I've heard that n opresident wants to be the one to go down in
history to kill NASA. But then maybe no president has found a way to
spin that into a good thing.

However -- and I'm just thinking this as I type this -- if Mr. Griffin
carries through on selecting a CEV contractor next March and gets the
thing on a fast track to development, then by the time of the 2008
election, we could be very close to putting it in production and begin
training astronauts in simulators for it. So even if Mr. Bush's
successor isn't all fired up over Moon and Mars, hopefully he or she
will want to keep the CEV in production and do SOMETHING with it.

The again, I could be wrong.



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On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:55:15 -0400, Michael Gallagher
wrote:

Yes, I've heard that n opresident wants to be the one to go down in
history to kill NASA. But then maybe no president has found a way to
spin that into a good thing.

However -- and I'm just thinking this as I type this -- if Mr. Griffin
carries through on selecting a CEV contractor next March and gets the
thing on a fast track to development, then by the time of the 2008
election, we could be very close to putting it in production and begin
training astronauts in simulators for it. So even if Mr. Bush's
successor isn't all fired up over Moon and Mars, hopefully he or she
will want to keep the CEV in production and do SOMETHING with it.

The again, I could be wrong.

It is interesting to note that when NASA and Bush first put forwards
this Moon and beyond plan, then the expected budget increase would be
small, and where this one CEV would be EELV launched.

Naturally, some of us could soon spot issues with that plan. So this
early plan was just a deception.

These days, from my count, then NASA is now wanting all of five new
vehicles. This then creates an issue, when missing any of these five
vehicles then means that the Moon is not easily possible.

The five naturally are...

Earth Launch CEV
Space Based CEV
CLV
SDHLV
Lunar Lander

This is certainly a nice collection, but at $25 to $30 billion to
build it is awfully expensive. The cost to operate this system also
remains to be seen.

Cardman.

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 16:20:30 GMT, Cardman wrote:

It is interesting to note that when NASA and Bush first put forwards
this Moon and beyond plan, then the expected budget increase would be
small, and where this one CEV would be EELV launched.

Naturally, some of us could soon spot issues with that plan. So this
early plan was just a deception.



Or they changed their minds. You will recall some months ago a lot of
booster ideas were kicked around, and shuttle-derived ones were
included. That's what they're going with.



These days, from my count, then NASA is now wanting all of five new
vehicles. This then creates an issue, when missing any of these five
vehicles then means that the Moon is not easily possible.


No, but OTOH, they're not going to build it all at once in one year.

This is certainly a nice collection, but at $25 to $30 billion to
build it is awfully expensive. The cost to operate this system also
remains to be seen.


Never know unless we do it.



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