Where things are in the Galaxy

I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I observe
are actually located. Crossen and Tirion have a great chapter in their
"Binocular Astronomy" entitled "The Structure of Our Galaxy". Let me quote
from their section called "The forground of out Orion Arm":

" Because we lie on the inner edge of our spiral arm, when we look at the
winter Milky Way (away for the interior of the Galaxy) we are looking back
into our own spiral arm, the Orion Arm. This is confirmed by all the
relatively nearby open clusters, associations, and emission nebulae in the
constellations form Perseus to Canis Major....

"The galactic longitude of the Canis Major Association in the southern winter
Milky Way is about 240 degrees, almost opposite the direction of galactic
rotation, so toward it we are looking lengthwise down our spiral arm.
Consequently this is a direction abundant in open clusters, many very
distant. M41 (2,350 ly), M47 (1,700 ly) and M93 (3,400 ly) all lie more or
less as far away as the CMa Association. ..."

I find this chapter fascinating and want to learn more about where the deep
sky objects I observe are located (three dimensionally) in the Milky Way.
Crosen and Tirion's chapter is a good start, but I would like to learn more.
Their book was publish about 11 years ago. Since that time I would think we
would have learned a lot more about our galactic structure and the distances
to various objects. Anyone have an great references to more on this? It
seems to be an aspect of our hobby that most amateurs have neglected.

Thanks,
--
Bill Tschumy
Otherwise -- Austin, TX
http://www.otherwise.com

"There would be no be no bright stars without dim stars, and,
without the surrounding darkness, no stars at all."

Alan Watts

Bill Tschumy wrote:

I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I observe
are actually located.

try "An Atlas of The Universe" http://www.anzwers.org/free/universe/

"Bill Tschumy" wrote in message
. sbcglobal.net...
I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I
observe
are actually located.
snip
I ... want to learn more about where the deep
sky objects I observe are located (three dimensionally) in the Milky Way.
Crosen and Tirion's chapter is a good start, but I would like to learn
more.
Their book was publish about 11 years ago. Since that time I would think
we
would have learned a lot more about our galactic structure and the
distances
to various objects. Anyone have an great references to more on this? It
seems to be an aspect of our hobby that most amateurs have neglected.


I've been very impressed by Celestia, that allows you to move between
celestial objects (stars included) so you can get a feel for their position
within the Milky Way.

www.shatters.net/celestia/download.html

On Wed, 26 Nov 2003 18:31:11 -0600, OG wrote
(in message ):


"Bill Tschumy" wrote in message
. sbcglobal.net...
I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I
observe
are actually located.
snip
I ... want to learn more about where the deep
sky objects I observe are located (three dimensionally) in the Milky Way.
Crosen and Tirion's chapter is a good start, but I would like to learn
more.
Their book was publish about 11 years ago. Since that time I would think
we
would have learned a lot more about our galactic structure and the
distances
to various objects. Anyone have an great references to more on this? It
seems to be an aspect of our hobby that most amateurs have neglected.


I've been very impressed by Celestia, that allows you to move between
celestial objects (stars included) so you can get a feel for their position
within the Milky Way.

www.shatters.net/celestia/download.html




Thanks for the link. I need to play with it some more, but it seems like it
is more oriented towards stars rather than deep sky objects. I am also
looking for more of an overview approach so you can easily see where things
are in relation to the galaxy as a whole.

I'm not necessarily looking for software. A good book or web site would be
fine.

--
Bill Tschumy
Otherwise -- Austin, TX
http://www.otherwise.com

"There would be no be no bright stars without dim stars, and,
without the surrounding darkness, no stars at all."

Alan Watts

In article lobal.net,
Bill Tschumy wrote:
I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I observe
are actually located.

Yes!!! That's what I enjoy most about astronomy -- not just seeing
objects as if they were painted on the sky, but learning about their
spatial relationships, motion, history, and all, as parts of a grand
living scene.

[... good stuff omitted ...]

I find this chapter fascinating and want to learn more about where the deep
sky objects I observe are located (three dimensionally) in the Milky Way.
Crosen and Tirion's chapter is a good start, but I would like to learn more.
Their book was publish about 11 years ago. Since that time I would think we
would have learned a lot more about our galactic structure and the distances
to various objects. Anyone have an great references to more on this? It
seems to be an aspect of our hobby that most amateurs have neglected.

The Amer. Mus. of Nat. Hist. in New York has put together a database of
Milky Way objects -- nearby stars, open and globular clusters, planetary
nebulae, pulsars, gas clouds, etc. as well as all-sky images in various
wavebands. You can fly around the galaxy and see, for example, that
the most distant of the familiar open clusters is about as far away
as the nearest of the globulars, or that some of the globulars are *amazingly*
far away. Or, you can select just the young open clusters (turn open
clusters on, then type "g6 thresh logage 7", say) and see how they trace
out the nearby spiral arms. (Looking at the full set of open clusters
doesn't show the arms -- there are too many old clusters!)

It's at www.haydenplanetarium.org.

(Disclosu I wrote the freeware viewer software they distribute,
so I'm biased, but still think it's a wonderful dataset.)

I'd love to read more discussions of the spatial distribution of
deep sky objects, too, as a supplement to catalogs whether computerized
or not. One I remember was from an astronomer (Kris Davidson of U of Minn),
giving a talk about eta Carinae. He pointed out that, in the direction of
Carina, we're again looking along a spiral arm, and the sky is very rich:
filled with objects at many different distances.

And, I'd really like to know more about the space motions of objects,
like the orbits of the globular clusters, or for that matter of Milky Way
disk stars as they orbit around the core and oscillate above and below
the plane. There was some nice descriptive material in a book that's
getting a bit old now, "Our Milky Way as a Galaxy", from 1990.

Stuart

"OG" wrote in message
...

"Bill Tschumy" wrote in message
. sbcglobal.net...
I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I
observe
are actually located.
snip
I ... want to learn more about where the deep
sky objects I observe are located (three dimensionally) in the Milky
Way.

I've been very impressed by Celestia, that allows you to move between
celestial objects (stars included) so you can get a feel for their
position
within the Milky Way.

www.shatters.net/celestia/download.html


You might also want to try Starry Night Deep Space Explorer. I think the
list price is a pretty reasonable $29. The icluded Quicktime movies alone
are worth the price.

http://www.starrynight.com/dse.html

Even more reasonable than I thought... only $19.95 list. $17.95 at
Amazon.com

a.. Travel anywhere within 700 million light years of Earth; visit 28,000
galaxies and 30,000 stars
a.. Starship controls to speed up, slow down, or change direction
a.. Full-color images of all planets and their moons
a.. Internet database links for more information on any object
a.. Identify and highlight galaxy clusters to see how galaxies form groups
in intergalactic space

Bill Tschumy wrote in message .sbcglobal.net...
I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I
observe are actually located.

I think you would be interested in: "The Guide to the Galaxy", by
Nigel Henbest and Heather Couper, Cambridge University Press, 1994. It
discusses the nature and location of a multitude of features in the
Milky Way and its arms.

(Phil Niles) wrote in message . com...
Bill Tschumy wrote in message .sbcglobal.net...
I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I
observe are actually located.

I think you would be interested in: "The Guide to the Galaxy", by
Nigel Henbest and Heather Couper, Cambridge University Press, 1994. It
discusses the nature and location of a multitude of features in the
Milky Way and its arms.

I bought this book used on your recommendation and was immensely
pleased with it. Thanks for posting the reference here.

Do you know the source that the authors used to come up with the
Galaxy x-y plane plots of diffuse hydrogen bubbles of the Local Arm
(eg. on page 122) and the Sagittarus Arm (e.g. on page 196)? Are
these stellar formation regions, described in some catalogues? I did
not realize that there were any spatial plots in that level of detail
in the x-y plane.

Regards, Kurt

(Phil Niles) wrote in message . com...
Bill Tschumy wrote in message .sbcglobal.net...
I am becoming interested in learning where in the galaxy the things I
observe are actually located.

I think you would be interested in: "The Guide to the Galaxy", by
Nigel Henbest and Heather Couper, Cambridge University Press, 1994. It
discusses the nature and location of a multitude of features in the
Milky Way and its arms.

I bought this book used on your recommendation and was immensely
pleased with it. Thanks for posting the reference here.

Do you know the source that the authors used to come up with the
Galaxy x-y plane plots of diffuse hydrogen bubbles of the Local Arm
(eg. on page 122) and the Sagittarus Arm (e.g. on page 196)? Are
these stellar formation regions, described in some catalogues? I did
not realize that there were any spatial plots in that level of detail
in the x-y plane.

Regards, Kurt