Suppressed Free Energy Technology for Home Use

Editorial comment: If you will notice the applications of this technology
are for rockets, space travel and military. NO WHERE does it mention that
this technology is applicable to home use and would give everyone a free
source of energy.



http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1101075201.htm

Hydrogen Peroxide Could Be Key To Future Power Sources
WEST LAFAYETTE, Ind. -- Scientists and engineers from around the world will
meet in November at Purdue University to discuss hydrogen peroxide's role in
developing a new class of environmentally friendly rocket propellants and
highly efficient fuel cells for generating electricity.


"These are nontoxic, renewable energy sources," said Stephen Heister, Purdue
professor of aeronautics and astronautics who helped organize the Second
International Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference, sponsored by the
School of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Nov. 7-10.

"Anybody interested in peroxide for power applications will be here," said
another conference organizer, John Rusek, an assistant professor of
aeronautics and astronautics who specializes in propulsion and power
research.

Rusek is trying to develop a high-efficiency fuel cell that generates
electricity from hydrogen peroxide and aluminum. Such a device could one day
replace conventional batteries and would have many applications, including
use by military field personnel who lug around heavy portable electronic
equipment. He will discuss that work during the conference, which is
expected to draw an international attendance of about 150 researchers, with
29 of them delivering scientific papers. Presentations will be made by
officials from the U.S. Navy and Air Force, Joint Services, and the National
Aeronautics and Space Administration, as well as researchers from private
industry.

Hydrogen peroxide differs from water only in that it contains two oxygen
atoms. It might be used to replace conventional oxidizers, such as liquid
oxygen, nitrogen tetroxide and ammonium perchlorate, which are needed to
burn rocket fuels.

"Nitrogen tetroxide is one of the oxidizers that we are essentially trying
to replace," Heister said. "That's a poisonous gas. If we had some in the
room right now, we'd be dying or dead."

Unlike the drugstore version of hydrogen peroxide, which is about 97 percent
water, the rocket-propulsion variety has just the opposite concentration --
3 percent water and 97 percent hydrogen peroxide -- and it has had critical
contaminants removed, Heister said.

This purified, concentrated form of H2O2 is broken down with chemical
catalysts, yielding oxygen that combusts with alcohol-based fuels, such as
methanol or ethanol, which can be derived from corn. Such a propulsion
system would provide an inexpensive alternative to today's nonrenewable
hydrocarbon fuels that are processed from crude oil, Heister said.

Breaking down peroxide not only would provide oxygen for combustion but also
would produce steam, an important byproduct that could be used to run a
turbine to generate electricity, Heister said.

Hydrogen peroxide has a history in aviation; for example, it was used in the
German V-2 rocket and the experimental X-15 rocket plane.

"It kind of went by the wayside because, at the time, we were seeking the
very highest-energy propellants," Heister said. However, new technologies
are promising to revive its potential.

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc. in Texas is planning to develop a complete,
three-stage launch vehicle that uses hydrogen peroxide as an oxidizer. Its
first-stage engine would be the largest rocket engine ever built, producing
more than three million pounds of thrust. Meanwhile, NASA and the Air Force
are working to develop lower-cost rocket engines using hydrogen peroxide as
an oxidizer.

###

Related Web sites:

Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference:
http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/co...nperoxide.html

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc.: http://www.bealaerospace.com

John Rusek: http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/Fa.../Faculty/rusek

Stephen Heister: http://Roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~heister

"*" wrote in message
...
Editorial comment: If you will notice the applications of this technology
are for rockets, space travel and military. NO WHERE does it mention that
this technology is applicable to home use and would give everyone a free
source of energy.



http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1101075201.htm

Hydrogen Peroxide Could Be Key To Future Power Sources
WEST LAFAYETTE, Ind. -- Scientists and engineers from around the world
will
meet in November at Purdue University to discuss hydrogen peroxide's role
in
developing a new class of environmentally friendly rocket propellants and
highly efficient fuel cells for generating electricity.


"These are nontoxic, renewable energy sources," said Stephen Heister,
Purdue
professor of aeronautics and astronautics who helped organize the Second
International Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference, sponsored by the
School of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Nov. 7-10.

"Anybody interested in peroxide for power applications will be here," said
another conference organizer, John Rusek, an assistant professor of
aeronautics and astronautics who specializes in propulsion and power
research.

Rusek is trying to develop a high-efficiency fuel cell that generates
electricity from hydrogen peroxide and aluminum. Such a device could one
day
replace conventional batteries and would have many applications, including
use by military field personnel who lug around heavy portable electronic
equipment. He will discuss that work during the conference, which is
expected to draw an international attendance of about 150 researchers,
with
29 of them delivering scientific papers. Presentations will be made by
officials from the U.S. Navy and Air Force, Joint Services, and the
National
Aeronautics and Space Administration, as well as researchers from private
industry.

Hydrogen peroxide differs from water only in that it contains two oxygen
atoms. It might be used to replace conventional oxidizers, such as liquid
oxygen, nitrogen tetroxide and ammonium perchlorate, which are needed to
burn rocket fuels.

"Nitrogen tetroxide is one of the oxidizers that we are essentially trying
to replace," Heister said. "That's a poisonous gas. If we had some in the
room right now, we'd be dying or dead."

Unlike the drugstore version of hydrogen peroxide, which is about 97
percent
water, the rocket-propulsion variety has just the opposite
concentration --
3 percent water and 97 percent hydrogen peroxide -- and it has had
critical
contaminants removed, Heister said.

This purified, concentrated form of H2O2 is broken down with chemical
catalysts, yielding oxygen that combusts with alcohol-based fuels, such as
methanol or ethanol, which can be derived from corn. Such a propulsion
system would provide an inexpensive alternative to today's nonrenewable
hydrocarbon fuels that are processed from crude oil, Heister said.

Breaking down peroxide not only would provide oxygen for combustion but
also
would produce steam, an important byproduct that could be used to run a
turbine to generate electricity, Heister said.

Hydrogen peroxide has a history in aviation; for example, it was used in
the
German V-2 rocket and the experimental X-15 rocket plane.

"It kind of went by the wayside because, at the time, we were seeking the
very highest-energy propellants," Heister said. However, new technologies
are promising to revive its potential.

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc. in Texas is planning to develop a
complete,
three-stage launch vehicle that uses hydrogen peroxide as an oxidizer. Its
first-stage engine would be the largest rocket engine ever built,
producing
more than three million pounds of thrust. Meanwhile, NASA and the Air
Force
are working to develop lower-cost rocket engines using hydrogen peroxide
as
an oxidizer.

###

Related Web sites:

Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference:
http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/co...nperoxide.html

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc.: http://www.bealaerospace.com

John Rusek: http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/Fa.../Faculty/rusek

Stephen Heister: http://Roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~heister


They are making it sound innocuous. I can recall reading that the Germans
used hydrogen peroxide in experimental rocket fighters during the closing
stage of WW2, and discovered that any accident in which H2O2 was released
had the unfortunate tendency to dissolve the pilot.

It needs proper handling, boys and girls. Not "water with merely another
oxygen".

--
Mike Dworetsky

(Remove "pants" spamblock to send e-mail)

On Wed, 7 Apr 2004 06:53:50 +0000 (UTC), "Mike Dworetsky"
wrote:



"*" wrote in message
.. .
Editorial comment: If you will notice the applications of this technology
are for rockets, space travel and military. NO WHERE does it mention that
this technology is applicable to home use and would give everyone a free
source of energy.



http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1101075201.htm

Hydrogen Peroxide Could Be Key To Future Power Sources
WEST LAFAYETTE, Ind. -- Scientists and engineers from around the world
will
meet in November at Purdue University to discuss hydrogen peroxide's role
in
developing a new class of environmentally friendly rocket propellants and
highly efficient fuel cells for generating electricity.


"These are nontoxic, renewable energy sources," said Stephen Heister,
Purdue
professor of aeronautics and astronautics who helped organize the Second
International Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference, sponsored by the
School of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Nov. 7-10.

"Anybody interested in peroxide for power applications will be here," said
another conference organizer, John Rusek, an assistant professor of
aeronautics and astronautics who specializes in propulsion and power
research.

Rusek is trying to develop a high-efficiency fuel cell that generates
electricity from hydrogen peroxide and aluminum. Such a device could one
day
replace conventional batteries and would have many applications, including
use by military field personnel who lug around heavy portable electronic
equipment. He will discuss that work during the conference, which is
expected to draw an international attendance of about 150 researchers,
with
29 of them delivering scientific papers. Presentations will be made by
officials from the U.S. Navy and Air Force, Joint Services, and the
National
Aeronautics and Space Administration, as well as researchers from private
industry.

Hydrogen peroxide differs from water only in that it contains two oxygen
atoms. It might be used to replace conventional oxidizers, such as liquid
oxygen, nitrogen tetroxide and ammonium perchlorate, which are needed to
burn rocket fuels.

"Nitrogen tetroxide is one of the oxidizers that we are essentially trying
to replace," Heister said. "That's a poisonous gas. If we had some in the
room right now, we'd be dying or dead."

Unlike the drugstore version of hydrogen peroxide, which is about 97
percent
water, the rocket-propulsion variety has just the opposite
concentration --
3 percent water and 97 percent hydrogen peroxide -- and it has had
critical
contaminants removed, Heister said.

This purified, concentrated form of H2O2 is broken down with chemical
catalysts, yielding oxygen that combusts with alcohol-based fuels, such as
methanol or ethanol, which can be derived from corn. Such a propulsion
system would provide an inexpensive alternative to today's nonrenewable
hydrocarbon fuels that are processed from crude oil, Heister said.

Breaking down peroxide not only would provide oxygen for combustion but
also
would produce steam, an important byproduct that could be used to run a
turbine to generate electricity, Heister said.

Hydrogen peroxide has a history in aviation; for example, it was used in
the
German V-2 rocket and the experimental X-15 rocket plane.

"It kind of went by the wayside because, at the time, we were seeking the
very highest-energy propellants," Heister said. However, new technologies
are promising to revive its potential.

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc. in Texas is planning to develop a
complete,
three-stage launch vehicle that uses hydrogen peroxide as an oxidizer. Its
first-stage engine would be the largest rocket engine ever built,
producing
more than three million pounds of thrust. Meanwhile, NASA and the Air
Force
are working to develop lower-cost rocket engines using hydrogen peroxide
as
an oxidizer.

###

Related Web sites:

Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference:
http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/co...nperoxide.html

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc.: http://www.bealaerospace.com

John Rusek: http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/Fa.../Faculty/rusek

Stephen Heister: http://Roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~heister


They are making it sound innocuous. I can recall reading that the Germans
used hydrogen peroxide in experimental rocket fighters during the closing
stage of WW2, and discovered that any accident in which H2O2 was released
had the unfortunate tendency to dissolve the pilot.

It needs proper handling, boys and girls. Not "water with merely another
oxygen".

Building rockets is a futile attempt at space travel. All they're going to
do is blow people up.

It's only safe and practical application is in a fuel cell to generate
electricity for home use. But leave it to the defense contractors to try to
capitalize on science for profit.

"*" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 7 Apr 2004 06:53:50 +0000 (UTC), "Mike Dworetsky"
wrote:



"*" wrote in message
.. .
Editorial comment: If you will notice the applications of this
technology
are for rockets, space travel and military. NO WHERE does it mention
that
this technology is applicable to home use and would give everyone a
free
source of energy.



http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1101075201.htm

Hydrogen Peroxide Could Be Key To Future Power Sources
WEST LAFAYETTE, Ind. -- Scientists and engineers from around the world
will
meet in November at Purdue University to discuss hydrogen peroxide's
role
in
developing a new class of environmentally friendly rocket propellants
and
highly efficient fuel cells for generating electricity.


"These are nontoxic, renewable energy sources," said Stephen Heister,
Purdue
professor of aeronautics and astronautics who helped organize the
Second
International Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference, sponsored by the
School of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Nov. 7-10.

"Anybody interested in peroxide for power applications will be here,"
said
another conference organizer, John Rusek, an assistant professor of
aeronautics and astronautics who specializes in propulsion and power
research.

Rusek is trying to develop a high-efficiency fuel cell that generates
electricity from hydrogen peroxide and aluminum. Such a device could
one
day
replace conventional batteries and would have many applications,
including
use by military field personnel who lug around heavy portable
electronic
equipment. He will discuss that work during the conference, which is
expected to draw an international attendance of about 150 researchers,
with
29 of them delivering scientific papers. Presentations will be made by
officials from the U.S. Navy and Air Force, Joint Services, and the
National
Aeronautics and Space Administration, as well as researchers from
private
industry.

Hydrogen peroxide differs from water only in that it contains two
oxygen
atoms. It might be used to replace conventional oxidizers, such as
liquid
oxygen, nitrogen tetroxide and ammonium perchlorate, which are needed
to
burn rocket fuels.

"Nitrogen tetroxide is one of the oxidizers that we are essentially
trying
to replace," Heister said. "That's a poisonous gas. If we had some in
the
room right now, we'd be dying or dead."

Unlike the drugstore version of hydrogen peroxide, which is about 97
percent
water, the rocket-propulsion variety has just the opposite
concentration --
3 percent water and 97 percent hydrogen peroxide -- and it has had
critical
contaminants removed, Heister said.

This purified, concentrated form of H2O2 is broken down with chemical
catalysts, yielding oxygen that combusts with alcohol-based fuels, such
as
methanol or ethanol, which can be derived from corn. Such a propulsion
system would provide an inexpensive alternative to today's nonrenewable
hydrocarbon fuels that are processed from crude oil, Heister said.

Breaking down peroxide not only would provide oxygen for combustion but
also
would produce steam, an important byproduct that could be used to run a
turbine to generate electricity, Heister said.

Hydrogen peroxide has a history in aviation; for example, it was used
in
the
German V-2 rocket and the experimental X-15 rocket plane.

"It kind of went by the wayside because, at the time, we were seeking
the
very highest-energy propellants," Heister said. However, new
technologies
are promising to revive its potential.

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc. in Texas is planning to develop a
complete,
three-stage launch vehicle that uses hydrogen peroxide as an oxidizer.
Its
first-stage engine would be the largest rocket engine ever built,
producing
more than three million pounds of thrust. Meanwhile, NASA and the Air
Force
are working to develop lower-cost rocket engines using hydrogen
peroxide
as
an oxidizer.

###

Related Web sites:

Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference:
http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/co...nperoxide.html

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc.: http://www.bealaerospace.com

John Rusek: http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/Fa.../Faculty/rusek

Stephen Heister: http://Roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~heister


They are making it sound innocuous. I can recall reading that the
Germans
used hydrogen peroxide in experimental rocket fighters during the closing
stage of WW2, and discovered that any accident in which H2O2 was released
had the unfortunate tendency to dissolve the pilot.

It needs proper handling, boys and girls. Not "water with merely another
oxygen".

Building rockets is a futile attempt at space travel. All they're going
to
do is blow people up.

It's only safe and practical application is in a fuel cell to generate
electricity for home use. But leave it to the defense contractors to try
to
capitalize on science for profit.


I'm wondering what wonderful method you would propose for getting into space
without rockets?

My point is that it has potential serious dangers for fuel cell use also--at
least as dangerous as gasoline/petrol, which should not be stored in a home.

--
Mike Dworetsky

(Remove "pants" spamblock to send e-mail)

On Thu, 8 Apr 2004 09:44:28 +0000 (UTC), "Mike Dworetsky"
wrote:



"*" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 7 Apr 2004 06:53:50 +0000 (UTC), "Mike Dworetsky"
wrote:



"*" wrote in message
.. .
Editorial comment: If you will notice the applications of this
technology
are for rockets, space travel and military. NO WHERE does it mention
that
this technology is applicable to home use and would give everyone a
free
source of energy.



http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1101075201.htm

Hydrogen Peroxide Could Be Key To Future Power Sources
WEST LAFAYETTE, Ind. -- Scientists and engineers from around the world
will
meet in November at Purdue University to discuss hydrogen peroxide's
role
in
developing a new class of environmentally friendly rocket propellants
and
highly efficient fuel cells for generating electricity.


"These are nontoxic, renewable energy sources," said Stephen Heister,
Purdue
professor of aeronautics and astronautics who helped organize the
Second
International Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference, sponsored by the
School of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Nov. 7-10.

"Anybody interested in peroxide for power applications will be here,"
said
another conference organizer, John Rusek, an assistant professor of
aeronautics and astronautics who specializes in propulsion and power
research.

Rusek is trying to develop a high-efficiency fuel cell that generates
electricity from hydrogen peroxide and aluminum. Such a device could
one
day
replace conventional batteries and would have many applications,
including
use by military field personnel who lug around heavy portable
electronic
equipment. He will discuss that work during the conference, which is
expected to draw an international attendance of about 150 researchers,
with
29 of them delivering scientific papers. Presentations will be made by
officials from the U.S. Navy and Air Force, Joint Services, and the
National
Aeronautics and Space Administration, as well as researchers from
private
industry.

Hydrogen peroxide differs from water only in that it contains two
oxygen
atoms. It might be used to replace conventional oxidizers, such as
liquid
oxygen, nitrogen tetroxide and ammonium perchlorate, which are needed
to
burn rocket fuels.

"Nitrogen tetroxide is one of the oxidizers that we are essentially
trying
to replace," Heister said. "That's a poisonous gas. If we had some in
the
room right now, we'd be dying or dead."

Unlike the drugstore version of hydrogen peroxide, which is about 97
percent
water, the rocket-propulsion variety has just the opposite
concentration --
3 percent water and 97 percent hydrogen peroxide -- and it has had
critical
contaminants removed, Heister said.

This purified, concentrated form of H2O2 is broken down with chemical
catalysts, yielding oxygen that combusts with alcohol-based fuels, such
as
methanol or ethanol, which can be derived from corn. Such a propulsion
system would provide an inexpensive alternative to today's nonrenewable
hydrocarbon fuels that are processed from crude oil, Heister said.

Breaking down peroxide not only would provide oxygen for combustion but
also
would produce steam, an important byproduct that could be used to run a
turbine to generate electricity, Heister said.

Hydrogen peroxide has a history in aviation; for example, it was used
in
the
German V-2 rocket and the experimental X-15 rocket plane.

"It kind of went by the wayside because, at the time, we were seeking
the
very highest-energy propellants," Heister said. However, new
technologies
are promising to revive its potential.

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc. in Texas is planning to develop a
complete,
three-stage launch vehicle that uses hydrogen peroxide as an oxidizer.
Its
first-stage engine would be the largest rocket engine ever built,
producing
more than three million pounds of thrust. Meanwhile, NASA and the Air
Force
are working to develop lower-cost rocket engines using hydrogen
peroxide
as
an oxidizer.

###

Related Web sites:

Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference:
http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/co...nperoxide.html

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc.: http://www.bealaerospace.com

John Rusek: http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/Fa.../Faculty/rusek

Stephen Heister: http://Roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~heister


They are making it sound innocuous. I can recall reading that the
Germans
used hydrogen peroxide in experimental rocket fighters during the closing
stage of WW2, and discovered that any accident in which H2O2 was released
had the unfortunate tendency to dissolve the pilot.

It needs proper handling, boys and girls. Not "water with merely another
oxygen".

Building rockets is a futile attempt at space travel. All they're going
to
do is blow people up.

It's only safe and practical application is in a fuel cell to generate
electricity for home use. But leave it to the defense contractors to try
to
capitalize on science for profit.


I'm wondering what wonderful method you would propose for getting into space
without rockets?

My point is that it has potential serious dangers for fuel cell use also--at
least as dangerous as gasoline/petrol, which should not be stored in a home.

Riiiiiight. Batteries (fuel cells) aren't safe, right?

"*" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Apr 2004 09:44:28 +0000 (UTC), "Mike Dworetsky"
wrote:



"*" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 7 Apr 2004 06:53:50 +0000 (UTC), "Mike Dworetsky"
wrote:



"*" wrote in message
.. .
Editorial comment: If you will notice the applications of this
technology
are for rockets, space travel and military. NO WHERE does it
mention
that
this technology is applicable to home use and would give everyone a
free
source of energy.



http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1101075201.htm

Hydrogen Peroxide Could Be Key To Future Power Sources
WEST LAFAYETTE, Ind. -- Scientists and engineers from around the
world
will
meet in November at Purdue University to discuss hydrogen peroxide's
role
in
developing a new class of environmentally friendly rocket
propellants
and
highly efficient fuel cells for generating electricity.


"These are nontoxic, renewable energy sources," said Stephen
Heister,
Purdue
professor of aeronautics and astronautics who helped organize the
Second
International Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference, sponsored by
the
School of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Nov. 7-10.

"Anybody interested in peroxide for power applications will be
here,"
said
another conference organizer, John Rusek, an assistant professor of
aeronautics and astronautics who specializes in propulsion and power
research.

Rusek is trying to develop a high-efficiency fuel cell that
generates
electricity from hydrogen peroxide and aluminum. Such a device could
one
day
replace conventional batteries and would have many applications,
including
use by military field personnel who lug around heavy portable
electronic
equipment. He will discuss that work during the conference, which is
expected to draw an international attendance of about 150
researchers,
with
29 of them delivering scientific papers. Presentations will be made
by
officials from the U.S. Navy and Air Force, Joint Services, and the
National
Aeronautics and Space Administration, as well as researchers from
private
industry.

Hydrogen peroxide differs from water only in that it contains two
oxygen
atoms. It might be used to replace conventional oxidizers, such as
liquid
oxygen, nitrogen tetroxide and ammonium perchlorate, which are
needed
to
burn rocket fuels.

"Nitrogen tetroxide is one of the oxidizers that we are essentially
trying
to replace," Heister said. "That's a poisonous gas. If we had some
in
the
room right now, we'd be dying or dead."

Unlike the drugstore version of hydrogen peroxide, which is about 97
percent
water, the rocket-propulsion variety has just the opposite
concentration --
3 percent water and 97 percent hydrogen peroxide -- and it has had
critical
contaminants removed, Heister said.

This purified, concentrated form of H2O2 is broken down with
chemical
catalysts, yielding oxygen that combusts with alcohol-based fuels,
such
as
methanol or ethanol, which can be derived from corn. Such a
propulsion
system would provide an inexpensive alternative to today's
nonrenewable
hydrocarbon fuels that are processed from crude oil, Heister said.

Breaking down peroxide not only would provide oxygen for combustion
but
also
would produce steam, an important byproduct that could be used to
run a
turbine to generate electricity, Heister said.

Hydrogen peroxide has a history in aviation; for example, it was
used
in
the
German V-2 rocket and the experimental X-15 rocket plane.

"It kind of went by the wayside because, at the time, we were
seeking
the
very highest-energy propellants," Heister said. However, new
technologies
are promising to revive its potential.

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc. in Texas is planning to develop a
complete,
three-stage launch vehicle that uses hydrogen peroxide as an
oxidizer.
Its
first-stage engine would be the largest rocket engine ever built,
producing
more than three million pounds of thrust. Meanwhile, NASA and the
Air
Force
are working to develop lower-cost rocket engines using hydrogen
peroxide
as
an oxidizer.

###

Related Web sites:

Hydrogen Peroxide Propulsion Conference:
http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/co...nperoxide.html

Beal Aerospace Technologies Inc.: http://www.bealaerospace.com

John Rusek:
http://aae.www.ecn.purdue.edu/AAE/Fa.../Faculty/rusek

Stephen Heister: http://Roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~heister


They are making it sound innocuous. I can recall reading that the
Germans
used hydrogen peroxide in experimental rocket fighters during the
closing
stage of WW2, and discovered that any accident in which H2O2 was
released
had the unfortunate tendency to dissolve the pilot.

It needs proper handling, boys and girls. Not "water with merely
another
oxygen".

Building rockets is a futile attempt at space travel. All they're
going
to
do is blow people up.

It's only safe and practical application is in a fuel cell to generate
electricity for home use. But leave it to the defense contractors to
try
to
capitalize on science for profit.


I'm wondering what wonderful method you would propose for getting into
space
without rockets?

My point is that it has potential serious dangers for fuel cell use
also--at
least as dangerous as gasoline/petrol, which should not be stored in a
home.

Riiiiiight. Batteries (fuel cells) aren't safe, right?


Ordinary batteries are perfectly safe (unless you toss them in a fire). But
when fuel cells include tanks of dangerous chemicals they are not
completely safe.

But such arguments about safety aside, such energy would not be free. Why
do you think that it would be? H2O2 cannot be manufactured and handled
without some cost and hazard involved.

After all, if it were cheaper and safer to make our own electricity with
home generators, we would all be doing it. The reason we don't is the cost
and inconvenience (including the hazard of having to store fuel, and the
problems of air pollution). Fuel cells might be better, but the actual
capital and running cost per household would probably make it impractical.

--
Mike Dworetsky

(Remove "pants" spamblock to send e-mail)

"Mike Dworetsky" wrote in message
...
|
| But such arguments about safety aside, such energy would not
| be free. Why do you think that it would be?

Because when "*" reads that hydrogen peroxide can potentially be made from
water, he believes the transition from H2O to H2O2 is then somehow a trivial
process. Since H2O2 is shown to liberate great quantities of energy when it
decomposes back into oxygen and water, he believes it constitutes a
suppressed form of free energy. Of course whether the energy is free or not
depends on how much energy is required to create the hydrogen peroxide in
the first place.

| H2O2 cannot be manufactured and handled without some cost and
| hazard involved.

Considerable cost. The cheapest method of creating hydrogen peroxide in
large quantities requires costly reactants. To keep the reaction productive
requires expensive chemical production plants. You can't simply put water
and oxygen in the same jar and shake it. In fact, the common process uses
water only as a mixing agent to separate the H2O2 from the solvents involved
in one of the steps. You then have to distill out the H2O2.

Hydrogen peroxide, in the concentrations used in the applications "*" cites,
is a powerful oxidizing agent. That's extremely hazardous. You wouldn't be
allowed to have it in your home in concentrations greater than 8%. We want
to use it for rocket fuel because, hazardous as it is, it's still less
hazardous than the truly vile things we have to use now.

| After all, if it were cheaper and safer to make our own electricity
| with home generators, we would all be doing it.

But that's where the free-energy enthusiasts claim that the large energy
companies are in cahoots with the world governments to suppress all this
"cheap" and "safe" energy in order to protect their profits. But you knew
all along there was some anti-Gubmint conspiracy theory buried down there
somewhere.

You can usually find that free-energists lack even basic scientific
understanding. This helps along their delusions quite nicely. And they
usually can't understand the difference between efficiency and
cost-effectiveness. Nuclear energy, for example, is tremendously efficient.
But the cost of operating it safely erodes the benefit.

--
|
The universe is not required to conform | Jay Windley
to the expectations of the ignorant. | webmaster @ clavius.org

* wrote in message . ..
Building rockets is a futile attempt at space travel. All they're going
to
do is blow people up.

It's only safe and practical application is in a fuel cell to generate
electricity for home use. But leave it to the defense contractors to try
to
capitalize on science for profit.


I'm wondering what wonderful method you would propose for getting into space
without rockets?

My point is that it has potential serious dangers for fuel cell use also--at
least as dangerous as gasoline/petrol, which should not be stored in a home.

Riiiiiight. Batteries (fuel cells) aren't safe, right?

Batteries are not hydrogen peroxide based, I believe. Comparing the
two would be like comparing a child's paper cap with an M-80 because
they both have gunpowder in them!

"Mike Dworetsky" wrote in message ...
Ordinary batteries are perfectly safe (unless you toss them in a fire). But
when fuel cells include tanks of dangerous chemicals they are not
completely safe.

But such arguments about safety aside, such energy would not be free. Why
do you think that it would be? H2O2 cannot be manufactured and handled
without some cost and hazard involved.

After all, if it were cheaper and safer to make our own electricity with
home generators, we would all be doing it. The reason we don't is the cost
and inconvenience (including the hazard of having to store fuel, and the
problems of air pollution). Fuel cells might be better, but the actual
capital and running cost per household would probably make it impractical.

There was an article, (60 Minutes I think, but don't quote me,) about
a guy who lived out in the desert without any power connections. He
had a windmill which he used to pump up water and broke the water down
to hydrogen and oxygen. He kept the hydrogen for cooking and heating.
He also had a bank of (huge) homemade batteries (which may have been
"fuel cells,") which he used for power. It was very impressive, but
it still wasn't "free." There was a serious labor-intensive cost in
living his lifestyle.

On Fri, 9 Apr 2004 08:41:53 -0600, "Jay Windley"
wrote:

Of course whether the energy is free or not
depends on how much energy is required to create the hydrogen peroxide in
the first place.

| H2O2 cannot be manufactured and handled without some cost and
| hazard involved.

Considerable cost. snip troll

So you disagree with the scientists at the Perdue study.

Big whoop, you don't know anything except pinning a yarn.