Could the Mars Rover Technology become Military Weapons?

Robots have and are being, used for military purposes. I'd like to think
though, that the moon is a little bit far away to use for such things aimed
at earth.
What is more worrying is the trend from man in the loop warfare to man
advisory warfare when the human only intervenes in an emergency and most of
the decisions are made autonomously.

Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Jonathan" wrote in message
...


Just food for thought.

Why put people on the Moon as part of a missile defense shield?
When we could have a rover climb into some little bunker/crater
and send back all kinds of infrared and radar tracking data.
Safe, sound and cheap.

This idea crossed my mind only because I ran into
this website below, which curiously has a Mars Rover
on the front page. Notice this agency specializes
in spaced based radar and infrared capabilities.
Why not Moon based too, someday?


SPACE VEHICLES DIRECTORATE PRODUCT LINES

Battlespace Environment - The mission of the Battlespace
Environment Division is to detect and understand the threats
in the aerospace environment to warfighting systems across
the full range of natural and man-made sources, and to
provide active and passive means to eliminate/mitigate
such threats to support Air and Space Forces for
America's Global Engagement."
http://www.kirtland.af.mil/library/f...et.asp?id=7876


Maybe someday Chinese and US rovers will be hiding, hunting
and killing each other in a fight for the ultimate high ground.
The Moon and it's glorious view of Battlespace Earth.

Oh, and how much has the military contributed to the rovers?


s

On Nov 4, 3:55�am, "Brian Gaff" wrote:
Robots have and are being, used for military purposes. I'd like to think
though, that the moon is a little bit far away to use for such things aimed
at earth.
What is more worrying is the trend from man in the loop warfare to man
advisory warfare when the human only intervenes in an emergency and most of
the decisions are made autonomously.

Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!"Jonathan" wrote in message

...





Just food for thought.

Why put people on the Moon as part of a missile defense shield?
When we could have a rover climb into some little bunker/crater
and send back all kinds of infrared and radar tracking data.
Safe, sound and cheap.

This idea crossed my mind only because I ran into
this website below, which curiously has a Mars Rover
on the front page. Notice this agency specializes
in spaced based radar and infrared capabilities.
Why not Moon based too, someday?

SPACE VEHICLES DIRECTORATE PRODUCT LINES

Battlespace Environment - The mission of the Battlespace
Environment Division is to detect and understand the threats
in the aerospace environment to warfighting systems across
the full range of natural and man-made sources, and to
provide active and passive means to eliminate/mitigate
such threats to support Air and Space Forces for
America's Global Engagement."
http://www.kirtland.af.mil/library/f...et.asp?id=7876

Maybe someday Chinese and US rovers will be hiding, hunting
and killing each other in a fight for the ultimate high ground.
The Moon and it's glorious view of Battlespace Earth.

Oh, and how much has the military contributed to the rovers?

s- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

AI artificial intelligence is the future. stronger, more stamina, 24/7
work.
no loss of human life.

thats why it should be invested in by NASA, it has so many uses.

all NASA developments shouldnt be given away!!

everyone should pay a reasonable licensing fee no nasa to fund futher
research

There are already quite a few ground robot projects out the

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/10/tt-tt/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/11/black-knight/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...-end-year.html

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004408.html

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.o...20Sensors.aspx

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008...bot-packs-hun/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009...eady-to-swarm/

http://www.defensereview.com/idfs-ne...kyreal-sneaky/


Mars Rover technology is hardly needed.

On Nov 4, 3:38*pm, wrote:
There are already quite a few ground robot projects out the

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/10/tt-tt/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/11/black-knight/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...obobug-goes-wa...

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004408.html

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.o...ober/Pages/Qua...

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008...bot-packs-hun/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009...lls-out-one-po...

http://www.defensereview.com/idfs-ne...ic-snake-aka-r...

Mars Rover technology is hardly needed.

Hey maybe it can work the other direction. Like the Hubble is a spy
satellite with altered optics aimed out instead of in.

Just food for thought.

Why put people on the Moon as part of a missile defense shield?
When we could have a rover climb into some little bunker/crater
and send back all kinds of infrared and radar tracking data.
Safe, sound and cheap.

This idea crossed my mind only because I ran into
this website below, which curiously has a Mars Rover
on the front page. Notice this agency specializes
in spaced based radar and infrared capabilities.
Why not Moon based too, someday?


SPACE VEHICLES DIRECTORATE PRODUCT LINES

Battlespace Environment - The mission of the Battlespace
Environment Division is to detect and understand the threats
in the aerospace environment to warfighting systems across
the full range of natural and man-made sources, and to
provide active and passive means to eliminate/mitigate
such threats to support Air and Space Forces for
America's Global Engagement."
http://www.kirtland.af.mil/library/f...et.asp?id=7876


Maybe someday Chinese and US rovers will be hiding, hunting
and killing each other in a fight for the ultimate high ground.
The Moon and it's glorious view of Battlespace Earth.

Oh, and how much has the military contributed to the rovers?


s

On Nov 5, 9:40*am, |"
wrote:
On Nov 4, 3:38*pm, wrote:





There are already quite a few ground robot projects out the

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/10/tt-tt/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/11/black-knight/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...obobug-goes-wa...

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004408.html

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.o...ober/Pages/Qua...

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008...bot-packs-hun/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009...lls-out-one-po...

http://www.defensereview.com/idfs-ne...ic-snake-aka-r...

Mars Rover technology is hardly needed.

Hey maybe it can work the other direction. Like the Hubble is a spy
satellite with altered optics aimed out instead of in.

Hubble wasn't a spy satellite but one of the more recent moon probes
was!

As for the rovers, rememeber they have to be self reliant on another
planet, many earth bound ones can use batteries that are replaced
frequently, be controlled by wire, etc. - not so the Mars rovers!

But the tech can be applied in space as lessons are learned, so your
point is valid indeed!

On Nov 6, 2:31�am, "David E. Powell" wrote:
On Nov 5, 9:40�am, |"





wrote:
On Nov 4, 3:38�pm, wrote:

There are already quite a few ground robot projects out the

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/10/tt-tt/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/11/black-knight/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...obobug-goes-wa....

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004408.html

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.o...ober/Pages/Qua....

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008...bot-packs-hun/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009...lls-out-one-po....

http://www.defensereview.com/idfs-ne...ic-snake-aka-r....

Mars Rover technology is hardly needed.

Hey maybe it can work the other direction. Like the Hubble is a spy
satellite with altered optics aimed out instead of in.

Hubble wasn't a spy satellite but one of the more recent moon probes
was!

As for the rovers, rememeber they have to be self reliant on another
planet, many earth bound ones can use batteries that are replaced
frequently, be controlled by wire, etc. - not so the Mars rovers!

But the tech can be applied in space as lessons are learned, so your
point is valid indeed!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

hubble was based on lacrosse spy satellite with different optics.

the platform was basically the same

On Nov 6, 8:43*am, " wrote:
On Nov 6, 2:31 am, "David E. Powell" wrote:



On Nov 5, 9:40 am, |"

wrote:
On Nov 4, 3:38 pm, wrote:

There are already quite a few ground robot projects out the

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/10/tt-tt/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/11/black-knight/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...obobug-goes-wa...

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004408.html

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.o...ober/Pages/Qua...

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008...bot-packs-hun/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009...lls-out-one-po...

http://www.defensereview.com/idfs-ne...ic-snake-aka-r...

Mars Rover technology is hardly needed.

Hey maybe it can work the other direction. Like the Hubble is a spy
satellite with altered optics aimed out instead of in.

Hubble wasn't a spy satellite but one of the more recent moon probes
was!

As for the rovers, rememeber they have to be self reliant on another
planet, many earth bound ones can use batteries that are replaced
frequently, be controlled by wire, etc. - not so the Mars rovers!

But the tech can be applied in space as lessons are learned, so your
point is valid indeed!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

hubble was based on lacrosse spy satellite with different optics.

the platform was basically the same



Incorrect. Lacrosse is a radarsat
Also the platform is not the same as other reconsats

On Nov 6, 1:42�pm, Me wrote:
On Nov 6, 8:43�am, " wrote:





On Nov 6, 2:31 am, "David E. Powell" wrote:

On Nov 5, 9:40 am, |"

wrote:
On Nov 4, 3:38 pm, wrote:

There are already quite a few ground robot projects out the

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/10/tt-tt/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/11/black-knight/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...obobug-goes-wa...

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004408.html

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.o...ober/Pages/Qua...

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008...bot-packs-hun/

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009...lls-out-one-po...

http://www.defensereview.com/idfs-ne...ic-snake-aka-r...

Mars Rover technology is hardly needed.

Hey maybe it can work the other direction. Like the Hubble is a spy
satellite with altered optics aimed out instead of in.

Hubble wasn't a spy satellite but one of the more recent moon probes
was!

As for the rovers, rememeber they have to be self reliant on another
planet, many earth bound ones can use batteries that are replaced
frequently, be controlled by wire, etc. - not so the Mars rovers!

But the tech can be applied in space as lessons are learned, so your
point is valid indeed!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

hubble was based on lacrosse spy satellite with different optics.

the platform was basically the same

Incorrect. �Lacrosse is a radarsat
Also the platform is not the same as other reconsats- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

at the time of the launch its similarity to other sats was discussed.

wrote:
On Nov 6, 2:31�am, "David E. Powell" wrote:
On Nov 5, 9:40�am, |"





wrote:
On Nov 4, 3:38�pm, wrote:
There are already quite a few ground robot projects out the
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/10/tt-tt/
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2007/11/black-knight/
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...obobug-goes-wa...
http://www.defensetech.org/archives/004408.html
http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.o...ober/Pages/Qua...
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2008...bot-packs-hun/
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009...lls-out-one-po...
http://www.defensereview.com/idfs-ne...ic-snake-aka-r...
Mars Rover technology is hardly needed.
Hey maybe it can work the other direction. Like the Hubble is a spy
satellite with altered optics aimed out instead of in.
Hubble wasn't a spy satellite but one of the more recent moon probes
was!

As for the rovers, rememeber they have to be self reliant on another
planet, many earth bound ones can use batteries that are replaced
frequently, be controlled by wire, etc. - not so the Mars rovers!

But the tech can be applied in space as lessons are learned, so your
point is valid indeed!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

hubble was based on lacrosse spy satellite with different optics.

the platform was basically the same

Actually, I think the Hubble main mirror diameter was based on the size
of the blanks that Perkins was grinding to make the main mirrors used in
the Keyhole spy satellites of the era. Or at least that what a PhD type
that worked on the initial specs for Hubble told me. He was doing
research on what was the optimal mirror size given the likely launch
vehicles and the goals of the mission. He came up with a mirror size
that was not compatible with the 2 meter blanks (if memory serves) that
were being used for Keyhole satellites at the time. His boss tossed his
white paper back to him and explained that he *really* needed to
conclude that 2 meter was the right sized mirror. When he objected and
asked why his boss said - "I can't tell you but trust me, the answer is
2 meter".

Actually, I don't really have an issue with this. If you've got a
contractor that has been grinding a certain sized mirror repeatedly then
one would assume that this would take some cost and risk out of the
development. However, since elmer did not insist on a full up ground
test of the optical components which resulted in a near sighted Hubble
we managed to loose some or most of the benefits we should have reaped
from not re-inventing the wheel. But, it's the government we're talking
about here. Their job is to spend OPM (other people's money) on things
that do not directly impact them. You will never get efficiency out of
an arrangement like that. The more people understand this the better
off we will all be.