James Oberg on Soyuz TMA-11

Good sized article:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/content/?cid=5412
He's ****ed off the Russians again, who are hinting he wants to destroy
the cooperation over the ISS.
Comrades! James Oberg - Trotskyite Wrecker! :-)

Pat

"Pat Flannery" wrote in message
news:NvudnWji5sejEYvVnZ2dnUVZ_gadnZ2d@northdakotat elephone...
Good sized article:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/content/?cid=5412
He's ****ed off the Russians again, who are hinting he wants to destroy
the cooperation over the ISS.
Comrades! James Oberg - Trotskyite Wrecker! :-)

Since the same failure of the SM to completely separate from the DM has
happened on two missions in a row, you'd think the Russians would want to
get to the bottom of this. Considering that there is a Soyuz at ISS which
could have the same problem as the other two, I'm shocked that the Russian
officials are essentially denying that there is a problem.

Jeff
--
A clever person solves a problem.
A wise person avoids it. -- Einstein

"Jeff Findley" wrote in message
...

"Pat Flannery" wrote in message
news:NvudnWji5sejEYvVnZ2dnUVZ_gadnZ2d@northdakotat elephone...
Good sized article:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/content/?cid=5412
He's ****ed off the Russians again, who are hinting he wants to destroy
the cooperation over the ISS.
Comrades! James Oberg - Trotskyite Wrecker! :-)

Since the same failure of the SM to completely separate from the DM has
happened on two missions in a row, you'd think the Russians would want to
get to the bottom of this. Considering that there is a Soyuz at ISS which
could have the same problem as the other two, I'm shocked that the Russian
officials are essentially denying that there is a problem.

Well you know how it is. Go fever and all.

And if you admit you have a problem, your customers may desert you.

Of course if you kill a crew, you're going to have a bigger problem.

But hey, those O-rings are only eroded 30%. See, it's safe enough.

See, the SM eventually broke off, it's safe enough.



Jeff
--
A clever person solves a problem.
A wise person avoids it. -- Einstein





--
Greg Moore
SQL Server DBA Consulting Remote and Onsite available!
Email: sql (at) greenms.com http://www.greenms.com/sqlserver.html

"Jeff Findley" wrote:

Since the same failure of the SM to completely separate from the DM has
happened on two missions in a row, you'd think the Russians would want to
get to the bottom of this. Considering that there is a Soyuz at ISS which
could have the same problem as the other two, I'm shocked that the Russian
officials are essentially denying that there is a problem.

You're shocked they are sticking true to form?

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

http://derekl1963.livejournal.com/

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

Jeff Findley wrote:
Since the same failure of the SM to completely separate from the DM has
happened on two missions in a row, you'd think the Russians would want to
get to the bottom of this. Considering that there is a Soyuz at ISS which
could have the same problem as the other two, I'm shocked that the Russian
officials are essentially denying that there is a problem.


As James Oberg pointed out, the first time anyone heard that TMA-10 had
had a SM separation problem as well as a ballistic descent was after the
TMA-11 problem.
As there were no American astronauts aboard the TMA-10 when it landed,
they apparently "neglected" to inform NASA about the SM separation problem.
I'd say TMA-12 is pretty iffy as far as reentry safety goes, and it
_will_ be bringing an American space tourist home - Richard Garriott:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Garriott
This may inspire whole new concepts for his video games, as the "Game
Over" function in this scenario involves a real coffin.

Pat

"Pat Flannery" wrote in message
news:NvudnWji5sejEYvVnZ2dnUVZ_gadnZ2d@northdakotat elephone...
Good sized article:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/content/?cid=5412
He's ****ed off the Russians again, who are hinting he wants to destroy the
cooperation over the ISS.
Comrades! James Oberg - Trotskyite Wrecker! :-)

Pat


Well, it's nice to see journalism is based on facts and
reliable sources these days.



"Moscow space officials who have essentially prejudged ....."


Who prejudged?


"They have declared, at the highest level......."


Oh! They!


"....rumors began circling the planet"


Thank god for rumors!


".....so the stories went."


Stories told by who?


"Also, NASA engineers in Houston whispered.....


Shhhh! Quiet, maybe he'll whisper to us the sources of the ...whispers!


"The remaining combined modules would hit the air sideways or even nose
forward, where heat shielding was much thinner. The delicate
parachutes are located here, and any damage to them or their lines
could have doomed the crew."


Says who? Or was this one of those whispers carried by another rumor?


"Moscow rumor mill:"


At last, now the article gets down to the real solid facts.....


"A Russian source first broke these stories"


Whathisname again?


"The exterior part of the pressure equalization valve was burnt,'
he continued."


Who is 'he'?



"he explained"

Oh



"he concluded"


Him again?


'The information which was published with a reference to an
unnamed and highly incompetent source was nothing but
a dirty trick."


Now I understand!



" ....but provided no supportive evidence of this
interpretation."


I'm astonished!!!



" Why should somebody lie?"


Who is somebody? Who is lying?



"Head of the Russian Space Agency Anatoliy Perminov agreed:"
'If we rush into panic and write what did not take place,
this is wrong, and this will not come to anything good."


At last a name.


"Moscow media quoted another Russian space source"


At last, some facts!


"who was at the landing site, who called the alarmist media
reports 'nonsense''


Reports of nonsense are in fact nonsense.



"So this attempted refutation of the alarmist 'leak' seems
itself bogus."


Deep-cover-anti-alarmist-agenda-driven-counter-rumors?


"Well, maybe."


No, really, I give up.


"....the mystery remains as to why"


After all these facts, how could there be any mysteries?


" Claims supposedly originating from space workers"


Supposedly! Which space workers?
Let's try to get back to the facts.



"For example, last December 27, rumors about the resignation
(or firing) of Perminov briefly circulated."


Oh no, not more rumors? But lets get the facts straight about these rumors.
These rumors did not circulate the planet, but lived only 'briefly'.



"Similarly, when early last February there were rumors that..."


Everyone knows a pile of rumors equals one fact.



"In a society that tolerates such snap judgments and conspiracy
thinking at the highest level, it's difficult to expect...."




Who is lecturing who about rumors???



s

"Jeff Findley" wrote in message
...
Considering that there is a Soyuz at ISS which could have the same problem
as the other two, I'm shocked that the Russian officials are essentially
denying that there is a problem.

Why would the Russians, who have far less money to work with, behave any
differently than NASA?


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Apr 29, 5:15 pm, "jonathan" wrote:
"They have declared, at the highest level......."

Oh! They!

quote
'The reports about the threat to the life of astronauts do not stand
up to scrutiny from the technical point of view and generally harm the
Russian space industry,' stated the head of the space agency's press
service, Aleksandr Vorobyov.
/quote

Yes, "they".

/dps