Secret Pixels of Venus / by Brad Guth

Though many official image archives exist, thanks again to our once
upon a time Usenet contributor "tomcat", for having posted the
optional link to this somewhat older but updated collective page of
our Venus surface images.
http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/imgcat/th...humbnails.html

Some of the most interesting of natural as well as AI(artificial
intelligence) worthy information can be found within image No.17 from
the top left, as clearly situated within the 225 m/pixel composite
frame of view by way of such radar imaging obtained pixels that just
so happens to include the robust, rather sizable and somewhat complex
community of structures with 'GUTH Venus', of which by all means you
should apply your very own PhotoShop or Photo whatever resampling/
enlargement of at least 3X, along with using whatever's your best
unsharp-mask filter plus other image cleaning or contrast options
you'd care to apply. Try to remember, that a purely negative or
naysay mindset of a true rusemaster or of faith-based formulated
denial simply can not accomplish such PhotoShop enlargements, at least
not without making this image look far worse off than it really is.

"Lava channels, Lo Shen Valles, Venus from Magellan Cycle 1"
http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/imgcat/ht...115s095_1.html
http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/imgcat/hi...c115s095_1.gif

First of all, you do not have to be an Einstein or most any other kind
of wizard, just as long as you're not deductive impaired, logic
impaired or faith-based mindset against ETs existing/coexisting upon
other than Earth. Not that Earth isn't entirely extra special and
perhaps far between similar wet and badly polluted worlds capable of
accommodating our forms of complex life as is, as well as in the buff,
so to speak.

Speaking of other worlds; if you still can not manage to zoom in and/
or enlarge sufficiently in order to find this complex community of
interesting pixels on your own, much less properly photo enlarge for a
somewhat better view, then perhaps you are not nearly as good at basic
observationology as you think you are. Remember that the small
details of the Venus terrain are in fact quite visible and of
impressive geology formations as is, and of whatever else is looking
as though intelligent created or as modified to suit are those items
of somewhat larger pixel patterns. So, in all fairness you can't
possibly claim seeing one set of pixels as forming a given pattern
related to whatever is perfectly natural, as clearly being the case,
and then not deductively interpret those of other pixels of them more
substantial patterns that look as though anything but natural, or
perhaps that's just my open mindset and otherwise deductive logic
kicking in.
- Brad Guth -

In order to ever revise upon the official published scientific word of
God (aka NASA), about how hot and nasty the planet Venus actually has
been geothermally created from the bottom up, for even that much to
happen one needs to appreciate the geothermal heat loss of Venus is
truly impressive, not to mention rather telling of a somewhat newish
or possibly renewed kind of formulated/reformulated planet that's in
the proto-Earth era, of the natural planetology doing its long drawn
out thing of cooling off the best it can, of which has been easier
said than done because if the mostly dry CO2 and highly insulative
layers of those S8 acidic clouds.

There is nothing of physics or via the best available cache of
existing science that actually forbids or otherwise excludes the
potential of Venus hosting other intelligent life, be that of a local
evolved species or especially on behalf of an ET (including us, though
obviously not in the buff) kind of sufficient intelligence that's
perfectly capable of existing/coexisting on Venus. Surviving the
toasty geothermal forced environment of Venus is simply not
insurmountable for anything but as interpreted by those faith-based
diehard nayism folks that simply can't ever admit to being wrong.

An Alternate View of Venus / by John Ackerman
http://www.firmament-chaos.com/papers/fvenuspaper.pdf
has this peer replicated science of thermal energy balance, on behalf
of the surplus energy outflow pegged at 21 w/m2, but I recall having
also seen this published as 20 w/m2, as well as other published
science as specifying upon the solar influx reaching the surface being
of less than 150 w/m2 out of the 2625~2660 w/m2 is not greater than
5.66% of solar potential, and much of which gets through to that
already toasty surface isn't even of the IR spectrum, and of course
you'd have to divide that in half because the nighttime season is not
exactly absorbing squat worth of solar photons.

The Planet Venus / By David Harry Grinspoon is yet another well enough
published resource of old but viable data that tells us we haven't a
purely atmospheric solar-induced greenhouse situation, even though
critical science data from multiple probes had been intentionally
removed/excluded so as to continually benefit the original solar-
atmospheric greenhouse as the one and only consideration, because
Venus is supposed to be of the exact same age and origin as Earth, as
having been stipulated by those faith-based conditional laws of
physics.

David Grinspoon quotes: http://thinkexist.com/quotes/david_grinspoon/
"We're ignorant of life in the universe. We only have one planet that
serves as an example and in science it's not good to derive
information from a sample size of one."

"We need more Venus missions to really answer the biggest mysteries
about the planet. Venus Express will be a great mission and will tell
us a lot about the planet, but I think to really make the next leaps
in understanding Venus we're going to have to do something more than
just orbit the planet. We need to take the plunge and explore the
clouds and the surface directly."

"They might do photosynthesis in the ultraviolet as opposed to the
visual spectrum. It's a tremendous amount of energy if you can make
use of it instead of being killed by it. It's unusual, but natural
selection makes the best out of adversity."

Often such worthy tidbits of scientific truths about Venus have been
published within Nature.com, then forever banished away from the
educational mindset and mainstream media that simply can't ever be
allowed to revise squat without breaking wind and igniting such.
ESA's Venus EXPRESS has been keeping itself unusually quiet these
days, as though there's a whole lot more to the Venus thermal energy
balance than had ever been previously allowed into the mainstream, as
to ponder along with any degree of our deductive reasoning is
apparently another big taboo.
.. - Brad Guth



On Mar 6, 9:47 am, BradGuth wrote:
Though many official image archives exist, thanks again to our once
upon a time Usenet contributor "tomcat", for having posted the
optional link to this somewhat older but updated collective page of
our Venus surface images.http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/imgcat/th...humbnails.html

Some of the most interesting of natural as well as AI(artificial
intelligence) worthy information can be found within image No.17 from
the top left, as clearly situated within the 225 m/pixel composite
frame of view by way of such radar imaging obtained pixels that just
so happens to include the robust, rather sizable and somewhat complex
community of structures with 'GUTH Venus', of which by all means you
should apply your very own PhotoShop or Photo whatever resampling/
enlargement of at least 3X, along with using whatever's your best
unsharp-mask filter plus other image cleaning or contrast options
you'd care to apply. Try to remember, that a purely negative or
naysay mindset of a true rusemaster or of faith-based formulated
denial simply can not accomplish such PhotoShop enlargements, at least
not without making this image look far worse off than it really is.

"Lava channels, Lo Shen Valles, Venus from Magellan Cycle 1"http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/imgcat/html/object_page/mgn_c115s095_1.htmlhttp://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/imgcat/hires/mgn_c115s095_1.gif

First of all, you do not have to be an Einstein or most any other kind
of wizard, just as long as you're not deductive impaired, logic
impaired or faith-based mindset against ETs existing/coexisting upon
other than Earth. Not that Earth isn't entirely extra special and
perhaps far between similar wet and badly polluted worlds capable of
accommodating our forms of complex life as is, as well as in the buff,
so to speak.

Speaking of other worlds; if you still can not manage to zoom in and/
or enlarge sufficiently in order to find this complex community of
interesting pixels on your own, much less properly photo enlarge for a
somewhat better view, then perhaps you are not nearly as good at basic
observationology as you think you are. Remember that the small
details of the Venus terrain are in fact quite visible and of
impressive geology formations as is, and of whatever else is looking
as though intelligent created or as modified to suit are those items
of somewhat larger pixel patterns. So, in all fairness you can't
possibly claim seeing one set of pixels as forming a given pattern
related to whatever is perfectly natural, as clearly being the case,
and then not deductively interpret those of other pixels of them more
substantial patterns that look as though anything but natural, or
perhaps that's just my open mindset and otherwise deductive logic
kicking in.
- Brad Guth -

You're an asshole.
"BradGuth" wrote in message
...



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Mar 7, 11:38 pm, "Stan Engel" wrote:
You're an asshole."BradGuth" wrote in message

news:1027a93c-2952-4ae2-
...

--
Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com

And that special contribution of your best wisdom has what if anything
to do with the planet Venus?

Are you here only to topic/author stalk and bash, or would you like to
revise that opinion of yours and actually share a little something
that's topic related?
.. - Brad Guth

On Mar 9, 7:37 pm, BradGuth wrote:
On Mar 7, 11:38 pm, "Stan Engel" wrote: You're an asshole."BradGuth" wrote in message

news:1027a93c-2952-4ae2-
...



--
Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com

And that special contribution of your best wisdom has what if anything
to do with the planet Venus?

Are you here only to topic/author stalk and bash, or would you like to
revise that opinion of yours and actually share a little something
that's topic related?
. - Brad Guth

Apparently our Stan Engel is without words, as well as without physics
or science.
.. - Brad Guth

On Mar 8, 3:38*am, "Stan Engel" wrote:
You're an asshole."BradGuth" wrote in message

...

--
Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com

I tend to agree with your assessment about that individual. However,
even though some ill informed folks are fascinated with Venus for the
inconceivably wrong reasons, that shouldn't put us off thinking
creatively about Venus. After all, its still an interesting planet.

While the surface is waay too hot at present and the atmosphere is
poisonous to life at present, it should be remembered that at an
altitude of 50 km or so, the atmospheric pressure is the same as that
on Earth, and the air temperature is a balmy 70 F - and the CO2
atmosphere is 3 times as dense as that of Earth's nitrogen oxygen
atmosphere.

This inspired the famous astronomer Carl Sagan to speculate that
humans might develop engineered free floating plants that process the
CO2 in the Venusian atmosphere into carbon compounds

In 1967 Buckminster Fuller suggested that geodesic domes 1 mile in
diameter could float in Earth's atmosphere being homes to 50,000
people. It is quite possible with 2.5 kg per cubic meter lifting
capacity, that such floating cities might make an appearance in Venus'
upper atmosphere. Such stations might tend aerial gardens that are
engineered to transform the Venusian landscape into something more
earthlike.

I have proposed elsewhere that ICF based nuclear propulsion system
could be used to harvest rich asteroids and bring them into orbit
around Earth. There, teleoperated factories on orbit could process
asteroids into useful products that would then rain down to users on
Earth.

A similar setup can be imagined for Venus. A ring of asteroidal
factories and space colonies could send down engineered plants and
free flying cities. We could call them 'cloud minders'

The atmospheres of Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune have similarly friendly
environments where cloud cities might be built - if a reason could be
found to build them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floatin...nce_fiction%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonization_of_Venus

Atmosphere of Earth has a density of 1.26 kg per cubic meter. The
atmosphere of Venus, at an altitude of 55 km above the surface, is
mostly CO2 at Earth normal pressure and temperature, and its density
is around 3.75 kg per cubic meter. So, a plant that was genetically
engineered to form bubbles of oxygen inside them, would have a
bouyancy of about 2.49 kg per cubic meter. That is, if a plant formed
a ball say 1 meter in diameter and absorbed CO2 and sunlight on its
outer surface, and exhaled oxygen and water to its interior, it could
mass 1.3 kg spread across 3.1 sq meters of tissue area. That's 413
grams of tissue per cubic meter. With a density of 0.6 grams per ml,
that/s 690 ml per square meter. 0.69 mm tissue thickness.

To close the cycle, approximately 1/5th the mass should be animal
tissue. So, the plant tissue would be reduced to 0.85 mm and tiny
creatures ranging from mites to mice could be bred to inhabit the
interior and nibble only so far into the tissue layer, perhaps running
like rates in a exercise wheel, to bring fresh material to the bottom
of the sphere to eat it, and circulating the water and waste products
through the 'lawn' of the interior.

The plant - has a capacity to process sulfuric acid into sulfates
which are dropped from the balloon. Reproduction would an interesting
process - with perhaps tiny balloons fissioning off like dandelion
seeds. This favors mites rather than mice - which can ride on the
tiny balloons when the spawn. Mice sized infections of the interior
of offspring would require larger sized fissioning balloons.

The whole life process takes sulfur out of the air and turns it into a
solid - the same way certain life forms take calcium out of the ocean
and make solids out of it. The life forms also take carbon dioxide
out of the atmosphere and turn it into solids - plant material, and
animal tissue, and waste products which is mixed with sulfur and
dropped out of the system as more is added. Free oxygen also leaks
out of the system - so over time the atmosphere changes to Oxygen and
Water vapor -

While this is going on Fuller style cloud nine floating cities would
be possible. A 1 km diameter sphere carrying an oxygen argon
atmosphere would be 1 billion times as massive as a 1 m diameter
sphere so 1.3 million tons of material spread over 3.14 sq km of area
would allow 413 kg per sq meter. A sheet of glass 16.3 cm thick would
be possible with this system. A sheet of PET film (impervious to
sulfuric acid) could be 25 cm thick (10 inches!)

Clearly a multi-layer system of aluminum reinforced triangles imbedded
in PET film with a glassy interior layer would easily be made to
withstand the rigors of Venus, especially if deployed near the poles.
Since oxygen is lighter than carbon dioxide, a set of doosr at the
bottom of the sphere, form an airlock to admit aircraft and space
craft - just as a door in an underwater habitat remain open once the
pressures are equalized.

VTOL style propulsive skin aircraft/spacecraft similar to those used
on Earth, powered by lasers from space - which also power the spheres
- from an orbiting industrial ring - would easily navigate to these
cities and back. The cities themselves are made from asteroidal
feedstock on orbit and deorbited collapsed and then opened after
they've slowed to subsonic speeds. At 50 tons per person, each
sphere carries up to 65,000 people and nominally carries 50,000 people


The city, like the plant systems, drop sulfur and carbon solids from
them, while releasing oxygen and water vapor into the atmosphere.

Molecular sieves and pumps maintain oxygen atmosphere. A simple
system of electrolysis driven by laser is used to take sulfuric acide
and reduce it to hydrogen and oxygen and sulfur dioxide. Another
laser driven system involves iron catalysts and carbon to break oxygen
from CO2 using laser power from space.

H2SO4 --- SO2 + H2O + 1/2O2
CO2 --- C + O2

Carbon and sulfur can be combined into a wide range of compounds that
when dropped to the lower atmosphere would cycle up more CO2 and more
H2SO4 to convert into water and oxygen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organosulfur_compounds

Some of this could be engineered into the mice and plants mentioned
earlier.

Given the mass of the Venusian atmosphere, the mass of materials
needed to be processed, the efficiency of the processes used, and the
energy available to process them - we can estimate the time frame for
full conversion of the Venusian atmosphere to water and oxygen.

Given the amount of argon in the atmosphere, I wonder what happened to
the nitrogen? It likely reacted with the rocks below and released
the sulfur that we see. If the temperature drops - and chemistry
changes - enforcing a planetary cooling on Venus by lowering CO2
levels - we may find that when the surface conditions start to change,
nitrogen levels rise, and sulfur gets sucked up leaving carbon and
water on the surface. At that point the plants and animals and cities
have descended to the surface and operate freely there.

On Apr 30, 11:09 am, Williamknowsbest wrote:
Atmosphere of Earth has a density of 1.26 kg per cubic meter. The
atmosphere of Venus, at an altitude of 55 km above the surface, is
mostly CO2 at Earth normal pressure and temperature, and its density
is around 3.75 kg per cubic meter. So, a plant that was genetically
engineered to form bubbles of oxygen inside them, would have a
bouyancy of about 2.49 kg per cubic meter. That is, if a plant formed
a ball say 1 meter in diameter and absorbed CO2 and sunlight on its
outer surface, and exhaled oxygen and water to its interior, it could
mass 1.3 kg spread across 3.1 sq meters of tissue area. That's 413
grams of tissue per cubic meter. With a density of 0.6 grams per ml,
that/s 690 ml per square meter. 0.69 mm tissue thickness.

To close the cycle, approximately 1/5th the mass should be animal
tissue. So, the plant tissue would be reduced to 0.85 mm and tiny
creatures ranging from mites to mice could be bred to inhabit the
interior and nibble only so far into the tissue layer, perhaps running
like rates in a exercise wheel, to bring fresh material to the bottom
of the sphere to eat it, and circulating the water and waste products
through the 'lawn' of the interior.

The plant - has a capacity to process sulfuric acid into sulfates
which are dropped from the balloon. Reproduction would an interesting
process - with perhaps tiny balloons fissioning off like dandelion
seeds. This favors mites rather than mice - which can ride on the
tiny balloons when the spawn. Mice sized infections of the interior
of offspring would require larger sized fissioning balloons.

The whole life process takes sulfur out of the air and turns it into a
solid - the same way certain life forms take calcium out of the ocean
and make solids out of it. The life forms also take carbon dioxide
out of the atmosphere and turn it into solids - plant material, and
animal tissue, and waste products which is mixed with sulfur and
dropped out of the system as more is added. Free oxygen also leaks
out of the system - so over time the atmosphere changes to Oxygen and
Water vapor -

While this is going on Fuller style cloud nine floating cities would
be possible. A 1 km diameter sphere carrying an oxygen argon
atmosphere would be 1 billion times as massive as a 1 m diameter
sphere so 1.3 million tons of material spread over 3.14 sq km of area
would allow 413 kg per sq meter. A sheet of glass 16.3 cm thick would
be possible with this system. A sheet of PET film (impervious to
sulfuric acid) could be 25 cm thick (10 inches!)

Clearly a multi-layer system of aluminum reinforced triangles imbedded
in PET film with a glassy interior layer would easily be made to
withstand the rigors of Venus, especially if deployed near the poles.
Since oxygen is lighter than carbon dioxide, a set of doosr at the
bottom of the sphere, form an airlock to admit aircraft and space
craft - just as a door in an underwater habitat remain open once the
pressures are equalized.

VTOL style propulsive skin aircraft/spacecraft similar to those used
on Earth, powered by lasers from space - which also power the spheres
- from an orbiting industrial ring - would easily navigate to these
cities and back. The cities themselves are made from asteroidal
feedstock on orbit and deorbited collapsed and then opened after
they've slowed to subsonic speeds. At 50 tons per person, each
sphere carries up to 65,000 people and nominally carries 50,000 people

The city, like the plant systems, drop sulfur and carbon solids from
them, while releasing oxygen and water vapor into the atmosphere.

Molecular sieves and pumps maintain oxygen atmosphere. A simple
system of electrolysis driven by laser is used to take sulfuric acide
and reduce it to hydrogen and oxygen and sulfur dioxide. Another
laser driven system involves iron catalysts and carbon to break oxygen
from CO2 using laser power from space.

H2SO4 --- SO2 + H2O + 1/2O2
CO2 --- C + O2

Carbon and sulfur can be combined into a wide range of compounds that
when dropped to the lower atmosphere would cycle up more CO2 and more
H2SO4 to convert into water and oxygen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organosulfur_compounds

Some of this could be engineered into the mice and plants mentioned
earlier.

Given the mass of the Venusian atmosphere, the mass of materials
needed to be processed, the efficiency of the processes used, and the
energy available to process them - we can estimate the time frame for
full conversion of the Venusian atmosphere to water and oxygen.

Given the amount of argon in the atmosphere, I wonder what happened to
the nitrogen? It likely reacted with the rocks below and released
the sulfur that we see. If the temperature drops - and chemistry
changes - enforcing a planetary cooling on Venus by lowering CO2
levels - we may find that when the surface conditions start to change,
nitrogen levels rise, and sulfur gets sucked up leaving carbon and
water on the surface. At that point the plants and animals and cities
have descended to the surface and operate freely there.

Not that your plan of action as based upon working from the cozy and
buoyant 50 km altitude on down isn't technically doable, because it
most certainly is.

However, since equalized pressure is not a negative/insurmountable
biological issue, and If technologically situated upon that
geothermally forced surface as is (though obviously not in the buff),
and were given unlimited local energy (fully renewable none the less),
what couldn't be resolved on behalf of human habitats?
.. - Brad Guth

Some have said that the surface of Venus today is safe for human
habitation. These same individuals say the moon is not. We don't
have to guess about the surface condition of either.

Here's a picture from the surface of Venus

http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ima...nera13_big.gif

that was sent by the Soviet Venera 13 space probe sitting on the
surface of Venus after parachuting there on 1 March 1982. The
vehicle, even though safeguarded from conditions in its own safe-like
enclosure survived only half an hour in the blazing 482 C (900 F)
temperature - about twice as hot as your oven at home. The air
pressure was 92 bar - 92 times sea level pressure on Earth. Chemical
analysis of the droplets in the clouds surrounding the lander indicate
they wree pure sulfuric acid.

Now if any of you have ever left a chicken or a steak under a broiler
at 500 F for too long, or if any of you have ever cooked a whole
turkey in minutes in a pressure cooker (which operates at 2 bar) - or
if any of you have ever dropped anything organic in sulfuric acid -
you may have some inkling of just how BAD a day you would have if you
found yourself on the surface of Venus!

Twice as hot as the broiler gets, 40x more pressure than a pressure
cooker, and clouds of liquid sulfuric acid.. hmm..

Any organic material, would burst into a weird sort of flame, and
dissolve away in seconds leaving the bones behind which might last
nearly 20 minutes or so before dissolving altogether.

This is NOT conducive to life.

As far as the moon is concerned.

We've been there.. Here's a series of films shot from Apollo 15's
Falcon lander.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1xzPGyt4F4

Here's a few more images from the lunar surface

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6c60m3JbKw&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOLa6BOFu3A&NR=1

And if you want to see more! for only $20 you can get the DVD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjtJ3...eature=related

Euugene Cernan said once that naysayers can spin all sorts of crazy
theories they want about Apollo,to take away the thrill, and the glory
of those missions to the American people, but there's one thing
they'll never do, and that's take those footprints I made on Montes
Taurus the Winter of 1972 away from me!.

Now it is true that there is more radiation on the moon than on Earth,
but the amounts are tolerable if stay times are short - less than 90
days. For those who wish to stay longer than a year on the moon, you
need to get underground or do something different. This is an issue
for long-term habitation. Not for short term exploration or tourism
or even industry if you rotate work crews or work tele-robotically
from shielded bunkers

It is an issue that will be resolved in my estimation.

More video from the moon

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8V9quPcNWZE&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmpNgvVOZQ4&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTmZGSU4Hm8&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGMEn0FFQvw&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMINSD7MmT4&NR=1

Apollo was a great program, and all the men who flew to the moon
heroes. Something Amierca can be proud of. Something that has earned
us a lasting place in the history of the human race.