Possible ET foam solutions

One of the possible (temporary) solutions to this problem is to apply
over foam a highly-tear-resistant and flexible external coating (skin).
In addition, to smother a lift-off, a current vehicle stabilization
control system must be replaced by a system with significantly
shortened reaction time. As a possible candidate, I see a system based
on the (http://arxiv.org/pdf/cs.AI/0411015) "Bounded-Input
Bounded-PREDEFINED-Control Bounded-Output" approach.

wrote:
One of the possible (temporary) solutions to this problem is to apply
over foam a highly-tear-resistant and flexible external coating
(skin). In addition, to smother a lift-off, a current vehicle
stabilization control system must be replaced by a system with
significantly shortened reaction time. As a possible candidate, I see
a system based on the (http://arxiv.org/pdf/cs.AI/0411015)
"Bounded-Input Bounded-PREDEFINED-Control Bounded-Output" approach.

No use simply a net on the tank as FRF on STS 1
http://www.capcomespace.net/dossiers...20FRF%2002.jpg

--

Cordialement,

Didier Capdevila
webmaster de capcomespace.net,
le site de l'espace.
Rédacteur à Espace Magazine,
le magazine de la conquête de l'espace

In article ,
"Capcom" wrote:

wrote:
One of the possible (temporary) solutions to this problem is to apply
over foam a highly-tear-resistant and flexible external coating
(skin). In addition, to smother a lift-off, a current vehicle
stabilization control system must be replaced by a system with
significantly shortened reaction time. As a possible candidate, I see
a system based on the (http://arxiv.org/pdf/cs.AI/0411015)
"Bounded-Input Bounded-PREDEFINED-Control Bounded-Output" approach.

No use simply a net on the tank as FRF on STS 1
http://www.capcomespace.net/dossiers...981%20STS1%20F
RF%2002.jpg


If you want a 'simple' solution, mount the shuttle to the ET with the
tiles on the outside, that way foam cannot hit the bottom of the shuttle.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
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"Capcom" wrote in message
...
wrote:
One of the possible (temporary) solutions to this problem is to apply
over foam a highly-tear-resistant and flexible external coating
(skin). In addition, to smother a lift-off, a current vehicle
stabilization control system must be replaced by a system with
significantly shortened reaction time. As a possible candidate, I see
a system based on the (http://arxiv.org/pdf/cs.AI/0411015)
"Bounded-Input Bounded-PREDEFINED-Control Bounded-Output" approach.

No use simply a net on the tank as FRF on STS 1

http://www.capcomespace.net/dossiers...20FRF%2002.jpg

Umm, cite for this? Never heard of any net on the tank and that pictuer
certainly doesn't show one.



--

Cordialement,

Didier Capdevila
webmaster de capcomespace.net,
le site de l'espace.
Rédacteur à Espace Magazine,
le magazine de la conquête de l'espace

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:
"Capcom" wrote in message
...
wrote:
One of the possible (temporary) solutions to this problem is to
apply over foam a highly-tear-resistant and flexible external
coating (skin). In addition, to smother a lift-off, a current
vehicle stabilization control system must be replaced by a system
with significantly shortened reaction time. As a possible
candidate, I see a system based on the
(http://arxiv.org/pdf/cs.AI/0411015) "Bounded-Input
Bounded-PREDEFINED-Control Bounded-Output" approach.

No use simply a net on the tank as FRF on STS 1


http://www.capcomespace.net/dossiers...20FRF%2002.jpg

Umm, cite for this? Never heard of any net on the tank and that
pictuer certainly doesn't show one.

Change your eyes :-)
This is better
http://www.capcomespace.net/STS%201%20net.jpg
Jenkins Book "Space Shuttle, the 100 mission" page 265



--

Cordialement,

Didier Capdevila
webmaster de capcomespace.net,
le site de l'espace.
Rédacteur à Espace Magazine,
le magazine de la conquête de l'espace

--

Cordialement,

Didier Capdevila
webmaster de capcomespace.net,
le site de l'espace.
Rédacteur à Espace Magazine,
le magazine de la conquête de l'espace

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 09:50:09 +0200, "Capcom" wrote:

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:
Umm, cite for this? Never heard of any net on the tank and that
pictuer certainly doesn't show one.

Change your eyes :-)
This is better
http://www.capcomespace.net/STS%201%20net.jpg
Jenkins Book "Space Shuttle, the 100 mission" page 265

It's obvious in prelaunch photos, like this one:
http://images.ksc.nasa.gov/photos/19...-81PC-0137.jpg

But I can't see it in actual launch photos, such as these:
http://grin.hq.nasa.gov/IMAGES/LARGE...000-000650.jpg

http://grin.hq.nasa.gov/IMAGES/LARGE...000-000649.jpg

Where did it go?

Dale

Dale wrote:
On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 09:50:09 +0200, "Capcom"
wrote:

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:
Umm, cite for this? Never heard of any net on the tank and that
pictuer certainly doesn't show one.

Change your eyes :-)
This is better
http://www.capcomespace.net/STS%201%20net.jpg
Jenkins Book "Space Shuttle, the 100 mission" page 265

It's obvious in prelaunch photos, like this one:
http://images.ksc.nasa.gov/photos/19...-81PC-0137.jpg

But I can't see it in actual launch photos, such as these:
http://grin.hq.nasa.gov/IMAGES/LARGE...000-000650.jpg

http://grin.hq.nasa.gov/IMAGES/LARGE...000-000649.jpg

Where did it go?

Dale

This net was used only for FRF 1 prior STS 1 launch. On the ET some
insulation has woorked loose during early tanking test. It was decided to
wait until the FRF to repair the damage. I suposed this net could be used to
prevent the insulation to fall on the shuttle belly


--

Cordialement,

Didier Capdevila
webmaster de capcomespace.net,
le site de l'espace.
Rédacteur à Espace Magazine,
le magazine de la conquête de l'espace

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:38:28 +0200, "Capcom" wrote:

This net was used only for FRF 1 prior STS 1 launch. On the ET some
insulation has woorked loose during early tanking test. It was decided to
wait until the FRF to repair the damage. I suposed this net could be used to
prevent the insulation to fall on the shuttle belly

Oh- sorry. I see that you already said that now, and I had figured out that the
picture you pointed out with the big exhaust plume must have been from an FRF.
But if you're suggesting a net like that, or a more sophisticated and larger one,
could be used during ascent, the first question would be how do you keep
it on the tank? External nets and nets cast into the foam have been discussed
here. But you've probably read those discussions, and since I didn't even catch
your FRF qualifier, I think I should probably just go to bed now

Thanks,
Dale

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 21:36:57 +0200, "Capcom"
wrote:

wrote:
One of the possible (temporary) solutions to this problem is to apply
over foam a highly-tear-resistant and flexible external coating
(skin). In addition, to smother a lift-off, a current vehicle
stabilization control system must be replaced by a system with
significantly shortened reaction time. As a possible candidate, I see
a system based on the (http://arxiv.org/pdf/cs.AI/0411015)
"Bounded-Input Bounded-PREDEFINED-Control Bounded-Output" approach.

No use simply a net on the tank as FRF on STS 1
http://www.capcomespace.net/dossiers...20FRF%2002.jpg

Mount boost protective covers on the nose cap and leading edges of the
wings. Eject the covers once the tank is gone and the shuttle is in
orbit.

Rusty

Rusty wrote in
:

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 21:36:57 +0200, "Capcom"
wrote:

wrote:
One of the possible (temporary) solutions to this problem is to
apply over foam a highly-tear-resistant and flexible external
coating (skin). In addition, to smother a lift-off, a current
vehicle stabilization control system must be replaced by a system
with significantly shortened reaction time. As a possible candidate,
I see a system based on the (http://arxiv.org/pdf/cs.AI/0411015)
"Bounded-Input Bounded-PREDEFINED-Control Bounded-Output" approach.

No use simply a net on the tank as FRF on STS 1
http://www.capcomespace.net/dossiers...81-85/1981%20S
TS1%20FRF%2002.jpg

Mount boost protective covers on the nose cap and leading edges of the
wings. Eject the covers once the tank is gone and the shuttle is in
orbit.

Another system that could fail (if the covers don't come off, you've got to
remove them manually before entry or you're dead), and it makes aborts
(especially ECAL and RTLS)... rather problematic, since you're ejecting the
covers at an altitude when there's still measurable atmosphere, so the
ejection must be energetic enough to overcome aerodynamic forces and
preclude recontact.

If you're going to go for a protective cover, make it a passive one
attached to the ET (like an aerodynamic fairing) that simply stays with the
ET after the orbiter separates. You'd have to leave enough of a gap between
the fairing and the orbiter to protect for worst-case relative attitude
rates (from RCS jet failures during ET sep), but it would seem doable.


--
JRF

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