Is it this easy to live on Mars?

I posted last September that water vapor and oxygen in the Mars
atmosphere was such that you could support a person's water and oxygen
consumption with a rather modest solar panel array and an
appropriately sized molecular sieve.

The work needed to raise the partial pressures to Earth normal, for
water vapor, oxygen and even nitrogen is

W = nRT * LN(Pa/Pb)

Where W=work in Joules
n = amount in moles
R = rydberg constant 8.314
T = temp in Kelvins
Pa = desired pressure (after compression)
Pb = starting pressure (before pressure)

divide this by the number of seconds it takes to consume the materials
in question, to obtain the power needed.

Anyway, here is a cool image from the Phoenix lander taken about the
same time I posted the original information - which shows ice water
clouds in the Mars atmosphere

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=15777

Here's another pointer to a 'tale-tell' being blown around in the Mars
atmosphere. Per Arthur Clarke's suggestion - we should have put a
microphone on the landers so we could hear what was going on on Mars.

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=12888

On Dec 4, 8:23 am, wrote:
I posted last September that water vapor and oxygen in the Mars
atmosphere was such that you could support a person's water and oxygen
consumption with a rather modest solar panel array and an
appropriately sized molecular sieve.

The work needed to raise the partial pressures to Earth normal, for
water vapor, oxygen and even nitrogen is

W = nRT * LN(Pa/Pb)

Where W=work in Joules
n = amount in moles
R = rydberg constant 8.314
T = temp in Kelvins
Pa = desired pressure (after compression)
Pb = starting pressure (before pressure)

divide this by the number of seconds it takes to consume the materials
in question, to obtain the power needed.

Anyway, here is a cool image from the Phoenix lander taken about the
same time I posted the original information - which shows ice water
clouds in the Mars atmosphere

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=15777

Here's another pointer to a 'tale-tell' being blown around in the Mars
atmosphere. Per Arthur Clarke's suggestion - we should have put a
microphone on the landers so we could hear what was going on on Mars.

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=12888

Here's another belated but perfectly good reason to take a closer look-
see at Mars.

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/galle...l_L-B118R1.jpg

Opportunity / Sol 115, May 25, 2004
http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/galle...nity_n115.html

Makes this nifty plank of Mars wood, as depicted from a fairly old
archived image, seem kind of weird. Wonder why it was intentionally
withheld for so many years.

Apparently the faith-based rusemasters that are about to lose a few of
their public funded jobs with benefits are starting to uncontrollably
sweat. Perhaps keeping our public media focus on Mars instead of
Venus or Selene is clearly their priority number one.

All we need is a viable fly-by-rocket lander with a robust return-home
capability, a pair of nuclear reactors, a few tonnes of other
essentials, a 4 years supply of beer and pizza to go along with the
trillion plus cost of a Mars expedition, and perhaps a decade from now
we'd get there.

Too bad there's so little of any value on Mars that we here on Earth
could use, although that Mars plank of wood could bring 100+ millions
at auction.

~ Brad Guth Brad_Guth Brad.Guth BradGuth BG / “Guth Usenet”

On Dec 4, 8:23 am, wrote:
I posted last September that water vapor and oxygen in the Mars
atmosphere was such that you could support a person's water and oxygen
consumption with a rather modest solar panel array and an
appropriately sized molecular sieve.

The work needed to raise the partial pressures to Earth normal, for
water vapor, oxygen and even nitrogen is

W = nRT * LN(Pa/Pb) (Ef)

Where W=work in Joules
n = amount in moles
R = rydberg constant 8.314
T = temp in Kelvins
Pa = desired pressure (after compression)
Pb = starting pressure (before pressure)
Ef = Efficiency (perhaps 0.25 0.5)

divide this by the number of seconds it takes to consume the materials
in question, to obtain the power needed.

Anyway, here is a cool image from the Phoenix lander taken about the
same time I posted the original information - which shows ice water
clouds in the Mars atmosphere

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=15777

Here's another pointer to a 'tale-tell' being blown around in the Mars
atmosphere. Per Arthur Clarke's suggestion - we should have put a
microphone on the landers so we could hear what was going on on Mars.

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=12888

Yes, Mars has those fast moving winds and dry-ice clouds with only the
trace .03% of a 0.5% atmosphere in amounts of water, otherwise just
hardly any bulk water unless you drill deep enough or manage to
process it out of solid bedrock.

Water or beer should be brought from Earth, not that extracting from
the 7.5e9 tonnes of Mars atmospheric water isn't technically doable.

~ BG

On Dec 5, 1:18 am, BradGuth wrote:
On Dec 4, 8:23 am, wrote:

I posted last September that water vapor and oxygen in the Mars
atmosphere was such that you could support a person's water and oxygen
consumption with a rather modest solar panel array and an
appropriately sized molecular sieve.

The work needed to raise the partial pressures to Earth normal, for
water vapor, oxygen and even nitrogen is

W = nRT * LN(Pa/Pb) (Ef)

Where W=work in Joules
n = amount in moles
R = rydberg constant 8.314
T = temp in Kelvins
Pa = desired pressure (after compression)
Pb = starting pressure (before pressure)
Ef = Efficiency (perhaps 0.25 0.5)



divide this by the number of seconds it takes to consume the materials
in question, to obtain the power needed.

Anyway, here is a cool image from the Phoenix lander taken about the
same time I posted the original information - which shows ice water
clouds in the Mars atmosphere

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=15777

Here's another pointer to a 'tale-tell' being blown around in the Mars
atmosphere. Per Arthur Clarke's suggestion - we should have put a
microphone on the landers so we could hear what was going on on Mars.

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=12888

Yes, Mars has those fast moving winds and dry-ice clouds with only the
trace .03% of a 0.5% atmosphere in amounts of water, otherwise just
hardly any bulk water unless you drill deep enough or manage to
process it out of solid bedrock.

Water or beer should be brought from Earth, not that extracting from
the 7.5e9 tonnes of Mars atmospheric water isn't technically doable.

~ BG

You made several errors - since you didn't see you made those errors -
I suspect it is pointless, given our past interaction to point those
errors out to you.

On Dec 5, 10:42 am, wrote:
On Dec 5, 1:18 am, BradGuth wrote:



On Dec 4, 8:23 am, wrote:

I posted last September that water vapor and oxygen in the Mars
atmosphere was such that you could support a person's water and oxygen
consumption with a rather modest solar panel array and an
appropriately sized molecular sieve.

The work needed to raise the partial pressures to Earth normal, for
water vapor, oxygen and even nitrogen is

W = nRT * LN(Pa/Pb) (Ef)

Where W=work in Joules
n = amount in moles
R = rydberg constant 8.314
T = temp in Kelvins
Pa = desired pressure (after compression)
Pb = starting pressure (before pressure)
Ef = Efficiency (perhaps 0.25 0.5)

divide this by the number of seconds it takes to consume the materials
in question, to obtain the power needed.

Anyway, here is a cool image from the Phoenix lander taken about the
same time I posted the original information - which shows ice water
clouds in the Mars atmosphere

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=15777

Here's another pointer to a 'tale-tell' being blown around in the Mars
atmosphere. Per Arthur Clarke's suggestion - we should have put a
microphone on the landers so we could hear what was going on on Mars.

http://jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/ima...p?fileID=12888

Yes, Mars has those fast moving winds and dry-ice clouds with only the
trace .03% of a 0.5% atmosphere in amounts of water, otherwise just
hardly any bulk water unless you drill deep enough or manage to
process it out of solid bedrock.

Water or beer should be brought from Earth, not that extracting from
the 7.5e9 tonnes of Mars atmospheric water isn't technically doable.

~ BG

You made several errors - since you didn't see you made those errors -
I suspect it is pointless, given our past interaction to point those
errors out to you.

I make more than my fair share of mistakes, though honest and not
causing blood or guts to flow, much less at public expense. So, what
is your point about going to Mars that'll take at least another decade
and a good trillion of our hard earned public loot?

Are you saying that our civil service workers and their brown-nosed
contractors that'll do anything for their next contract, will instead
donate their time, expertise and resources for next to nothing?

What can Mars provide that good old mother Earth and her Selene/moon
doesn't already have at least 1000 fold more of (with the exception of
CO2/dry-ice), and at not 0.0001% the cost per kg?

Even if the holy grail were to be discovered on Mars; so what?

~ Brad Guth Brad_Guth Brad.Guth BradGuth BG / “Guth Usenet”