Lunar Lander in a 5.2m faring?

Rüdiger Klaehn wrote:
But how can you get a descent lunar lander, capable of landing ~10 tons
on the lunar surface, into the 5.2m dimater faring offered by SpaceX
(or Boeing, LM, or the Stick)?

Can this be done without orbital assembley?


Sure. Why not. 5m diameter is plenty if you do not use hydrogen. Two 4m
diameter spheres filled with liquid methane and LOX would contain more
than enough fuel to land and launch quite a large payload on the moon.
You would just have to fill it up at a propellant depot in low earth
orbit.


You also have the Transhab concept, which would also allow for the
volume contraints for the manned portion.

For that matter, I think you might also be able to manage a similar
form of inflatable tankage. There is no rule that the tankage has to
be metallic. There are several bladder systems that would work fairly
well.

You also have the Transhab concept, which would also allow for the
volume contraints for the manned portion.

That would definitely be a good idea for the manned portion. If people
are supposed to live and work on the moon for several weeks to months,
they will need some room. But the manned portion would be a separate
module.

For that matter, I think you might also be able to manage a similar
form of inflatable tankage. There is no rule that the tankage has to
be metallic. There are several bladder systems that would work fairly
well.
Of course you could do this. But it is not necessary for the first
mission since 5m diameter is more than enough to store lots of
propellant.

Might be a good idea for an orbital propellant depot though: Two
bigelow 330 modules adapted to propellant storage could store more than
100 metric tons of liquid methane and more than 300 metric tons of
liquid oxygen. That should be enough for several very ambitious moon
missions.

And with such a large diameter, an almost spherical shape and many
debris protection layers, boiloff should be minimal.

Charles Buckley wrote:
Rüdiger Klaehn wrote:
But how can you get a descent lunar lander, capable of landing ~10 tons
on the lunar surface, into the 5.2m dimater faring offered by SpaceX
(or Boeing, LM, or the Stick)?

Can this be done without orbital assembley?


Sure. Why not. 5m diameter is plenty if you do not use hydrogen. Two 4m
diameter spheres filled with liquid methane and LOX would contain more
than enough fuel to land and launch quite a large payload on the moon.
You would just have to fill it up at a propellant depot in low earth
orbit.


OK - so we have 2m of engine and 8m length of tankage, and the cargo is
now at 10m.

Whilst I beleive that LOX / Kerosene is the best propellant choice for
Earth launch and perhaps the EDS, I think LOX/LH2 is better for lunar
operations, because (OK, if) H2 and O2 can be obtained from the moon.

That's obviously why NASA's gone for methane!

You also have the Transhab concept, which would also allow for the
volume contraints for the manned portion.

Yes, but your transhab is now sitting at 10m above the lunar surface.

For that matter, I think you might also be able to manage a similar
form of inflatable tankage. There is no rule that the tankage has to
be metallic. There are several bladder systems that would work fairly
well.

Would propellant sloshing be a problem?