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VLBI
http://celebrating200years.noaa.gov/...come.html#vlbi
The use of VLBI has about the same intellectual substance as photographing the wandering Sun analemma and these people are not only wasting time with their wayward assertions, the connection between planetary dynamics and terrestrial effects will continue to suffer due to this intolerable notion. I look at all these doctorates at the IERS and they can't seem to get that right ascension techniques are homocentric but they assume their telescopes are tracking an extra-galactic source as the Earth turns but it takes one person with common sense to see that the telescope turns around its own individual axis and besides,it is an extension of the 24 hour AM/PM system which meshes with the Lat/Long system. You do not have to talk like you are about to lay an egg with these things and a blizzard of abbreviations are not going to disguise that a great injustice prevails at the expense of not just astronomy with humanity itself.If a concept that hinges on VLBI is throwing up 1465 rotations in 1461 days ,as this is what right ascension adherents truly believe,then chant voodoo all you will,it began with a mistake and has now grown into a monstrosity that nobody wants to touch apart from what is discussed in this forum. |
#2
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VLBI
On Dec 7, 12:58*pm, oriel36 wrote:
The use of VLBI has about the same intellectual substance as photographing the wandering Sun analemma You are saying this to a newsgroup filled with people who have frequently seen with their own eyes that the resolving power of a telescope increases with its aperture - which is another manifestation of the wave nature of light (Newton was partial to the opposing corpuscular theory) on which VLBI is based. At long last, have you no sense of irony? John Savard |
#3
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VLBI
Quadibloc:
You are saying this to a newsgroup filled with people who have frequently seen with their own eyes that the resolving power of a telescope increases with its aperture - which is another manifestation of the wave nature of light (Newton was partial to the opposing corpuscular theory) on which VLBI is based. "I want to emphasize that light comes in this form‹particles. It is very important to know that light behaves like particles, especially for those of you have gone to school, where you probably learned something about light behaving like waves. IŒm telling you the way it /does/ behave‹like particles." ‹Richard Feynman in QED. (Emphasis his.) -- I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that you will say in your entire life. usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm |
#4
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VLBI
On Dec 8, 10:33Â*pm, Davoud wrote:
Quadibloc: You are saying this to a newsgroup filled with people who have frequently seen with their own eyes that the resolving power of a telescope increases with its aperture - which is another manifestation of the wave nature of light (Newton was partial to the opposing corpuscular theory) on which VLBI is based. "I want to emphasize that light comes in this form‹particles. It is very important to know that light behaves like particles, especially for those of you have gone to school, where you probably learned something about light behaving like waves. IŒm telling you the way it /does/ behave‹like particles." ‹Richard Feynman in QED. (Emphasis his.) I'm well aware of the photoelectric effect. But no doubt Oriel would regard the wave-particle duality as pretentious mathematical obfuscation by those nasty empiricists; I was addressing very simply the point where he was wrong without wading into deep quantum-mechanical waters. John Savard |
#5
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VLBI
On Dec 9, 6:33Â*am, Davoud wrote:
Quadibloc: You are saying this to a newsgroup filled with people who have frequently seen with their own eyes that the resolving power of a telescope increases with its aperture - which is another manifestation of the wave nature of light (Newton was partial to the opposing corpuscular theory) on which VLBI is based. "I want to emphasize that light comes in this form‹particles. It is very important to know that light behaves like particles, especially for those of you have gone to school, where you probably learned something about light behaving like waves. IŒm telling you the way it /does/ behave‹like particles." ‹Richard Feynman in QED. (Emphasis his.) Feynman indeed !,just another empiricist chancing his arm knowing that there were no astronomers around in attaching Roemer's name to Newton and his 'predictions' agenda - "The Character of Physical Law", and in the pages on Newton's law of gravity (pages 22-23) he mentions that observations of the moons of jupiter showed that they "were ahead of schedule when Jupiter was close to the earth and behind schedule when it was far away, a rather odd circumstance. Mr. Roemer [Olaus Roemer, 1644-1710, Danish astronomer], having confidence in the Law of Gravitation, came to the interesting conclusion that it takes light some time to travel from the moons of Jupiter to the earth..." Feynman Considering Roemer proposed his solution for the anomalous motion of Io in the 1670's while Newton's work of mathematical fiction was written in the late 1680's I am sure somebody like Feymann could doctor history to insert Newton but not now in the presence of an astronomer. Isaac mentioned Roemer's use of the Equation of Time as absolute/ relative time but not even Roemer could have known that the Equation is discontinuous by virtue of the 11 minute discrepancy each annual cycle but such things would only interest a genuine astronomer who can understand why natural noon cycles vary in the first place. "Absolute time, in astronomy, is distinguished from relative, by the equation or correlation of the vulgar time. For the natural days are truly unequal, though they are commonly considered as equal and used for a measure of time; astronomers correct this inequality for their more accurate deducing of the celestial motions.... The necessity of which equation, for determining the times of a phænomenon, is evinced as well from the experiments of the pendulum clock, as by eclipses of the satellites of Jupiter." Principia All this early 20th century relativity nonsense and I can obliterate it so easily using modern imaging - all it needs are honest people who can set aside their reputations and work to correct things for a change. At least Newton was interesting in the same way a rogue knows how to exploit genuine articles of discovery and bend them to his purpose,works great as long as you can get away with it,even for centuries but ultimately is is as far removed from the achievements of astronomy as anything. -- I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that you will say in your entire life. usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm |
#6
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VLBI
On 08/12/2012 23:09, Quadibloc wrote:
On Dec 7, 12:58 pm, oriel36 wrote: The use of VLBI has about the same intellectual substance as photographing the wandering Sun analemma In the sense that both are based on the knowledge of the physical laws that govern the universe he is actually right. The great thing about VLBI and any other large network of interferometer telscopes is that with N scopes you get N(N-1)(N-2)/6 good phase observables Jennison (1958) and N(N-1)(N-2)(N-3)/12 good amplitude observables. It is for this reason that the VLBI network scopes tend to take chances in stormy weather to stay on the network. Dropping from N=9 to 8 is a big hit. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closure_phase You are saying this to a newsgroup filled with people who have frequently seen with their own eyes that the resolving power of a telescope increases with its aperture - which is another manifestation of the wave nature of light (Newton was partial to the opposing corpuscular theory) on which VLBI is based. At long last, have you no sense of irony? Much harder to explain is intensity interferometry where photon counting detectors were used to measure the diameters of the most promising super giants were measured by Hanbury-Brown and Twiss at Jodrell Bank to prove the concept and later with a much larger setup at Narrabi in South Africa. The book is fairly rare but the technique led to a very fierce debate in the physics community about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanbury...d_Twiss_effect Wave paricle duality has some very interesting consequences. These guys deserve much better recognition for their ground breaking research! I don't actually like thi semi-classical derivation but it is online. ISTR someone in s.e.d posted a link to a scan of the book but I don't believe in copyright infringement so I am not reposting it here. http://szczypka.web.cern.ch/szczypka...wiss/twiss.pdf Note that in the implementation of the H-B intensity interferometer the detectors were photon counting devices 931A phototubes if memory serves. The correlation are real and determined by the baeline length and the angular diameter of the source. Regards, Martin Brown |
#7
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VLBI
On Dec 9, 9:55*pm, Martin Brown
wrote: On 08/12/2012 23:09, Quadibloc wrote: On Dec 7, 12:58 pm, oriel36 wrote: The use of VLBI has about the same intellectual substance as photographing the wandering Sun analemma In the sense that both are based on the knowledge of the physical laws that govern the universe he is actually right. The great thing about VLBI and any other large network of interferometer telscopes is that with N scopes you get N(N-1)(N-2)/6 good phase observables Jennison (1958) and N(N-1)(N-2)(N-3)/12 good amplitude observables. It is for this reason that the VLBI network scopes tend to take chances in stormy weather to stay on the network. Dropping from N=9 to 8 is a big hit. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closure_phase You are saying this to a newsgroup filled with people who have frequently seen with their own eyes that the resolving power of a telescope increases with its aperture - which is another manifestation of the wave nature of light (Newton was partial to the opposing corpuscular theory) on which VLBI is based. At long last, have you no sense of irony? Much harder to explain is intensity interferometry where photon counting detectors were used to measure the diameters of the most promising super giants were measured by Hanbury-Brown and Twiss at Jodrell Bank to prove the concept and later with a much larger setup at Narrabi in South Africa. The book is fairly rare but the technique led to a very fierce debate in the physics community about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanbury...d_Twiss_effect Wave paricle duality has some very interesting consequences. These guys deserve much better recognition for their ground breaking research! I don't actually like thi semi-classical derivation but it is online. ISTR someone in s.e.d posted a link to a scan of the book but I don't believe in copyright infringement so I am not reposting it here. http://szczypka.web.cern.ch/szczypka...wiss/twiss.pdf Note that in the implementation of the H-B intensity interferometer the detectors were photon counting devices 931A phototubes if memory serves. The correlation are real and determined by the baeline length and the angular diameter of the source. Regards, Martin Brown It doesn't matter whether a pendulum clock is used or VLBI,the determination that local tracking of a star in stellar circumpolar motion reflects daily rotation is false by virtue that it is a homocentric determination which happens to be one step lower that geocentricity and equivalent to astronomical oblivion. I notice with greater frequency that they no longer call their imaginative conceptions by the name of 'theories' but 'models' and the first one was trying to model the motions of the Earth using the 24 hour AM/PM cycle allied with the Lat/Long system which in turn happen to be an extension of the 1461 day calendar cycle in a format of 365 day/366 day rotations. You don't have a feel for astronomical timekeeping nor structural astronomy Brown and although you and your colleagues will continue like this for a while,even a long while,but technically you are finished as astronomy recovers the ability to correlate cause and effect between dynamics and what happens on Earth. |
#8
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VLBI
Quadibloc:
But no doubt Oriel would regard the wave-particle duality as... I wouldn't know how Oriel would regard anything because he's in my kill-file. I was addressing very simply the point where he was wrong... That's a relief. So you've straightened him out once and for all and I can take him out of my kill-file because now that you have set him straight he will hereafter post only logical and cogent thoughts. Is that the way you see it? If I had a ha'penny for every time Oriel has made a fool of those who are obsessed with setting him straight once and for all I'd be a rich man today! -- I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that you will say in your entire life. usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm |
#9
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VLBI
"oriel36" wrote in message
... On Dec 9, 9:55 pm, Martin Brown wrote: On 08/12/2012 23:09, Quadibloc wrote: On Dec 7, 12:58 pm, oriel36 wrote: The use of VLBI has about the same intellectual substance as photographing the wandering Sun analemma In the sense that both are based on the knowledge of the physical laws that govern the universe he is actually right. The great thing about VLBI and any other large network of interferometer telscopes is that with N scopes you get N(N-1)(N-2)/6 good phase observables Jennison (1958) and N(N-1)(N-2)(N-3)/12 good amplitude observables. It is for this reason that the VLBI network scopes tend to take chances in stormy weather to stay on the network. Dropping from N=9 to 8 is a big hit. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closure_phase You are saying this to a newsgroup filled with people who have frequently seen with their own eyes that the resolving power of a telescope increases with its aperture - which is another manifestation of the wave nature of light (Newton was partial to the opposing corpuscular theory) on which VLBI is based. At long last, have you no sense of irony? Much harder to explain is intensity interferometry where photon counting detectors were used to measure the diameters of the most promising super giants were measured by Hanbury-Brown and Twiss at Jodrell Bank to prove the concept and later with a much larger setup at Narrabi in South Africa. The book is fairly rare but the technique led to a very fierce debate in the physics community about it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanbury...d_Twiss_effect Wave paricle duality has some very interesting consequences. These guys deserve much better recognition for their ground breaking research! I don't actually like thi semi-classical derivation but it is online. ISTR someone in s.e.d posted a link to a scan of the book but I don't believe in copyright infringement so I am not reposting it here. http://szczypka.web.cern.ch/szczypka...wiss/twiss.pdf Note that in the implementation of the H-B intensity interferometer the detectors were photon counting devices 931A phototubes if memory serves. The correlation are real and determined by the baeline length and the angular diameter of the source. Regards, Martin Brown It doesn't matter whether a pendulum clock is used or VLBI,the determination that local tracking of a star in stellar circumpolar motion reflects daily rotation is false by virtue that it is a homocentric determination which happens to be one step lower that geocentricity and equivalent to astronomical oblivion. I notice with greater frequency that they no longer call their imaginative conceptions by the name of 'theories' but 'models' and the first one was trying to model the motions of the Earth using the 24 hour AM/PM cycle allied with the Lat/Long system which in turn happen to be an extension of the 1461 day calendar cycle in a format of 365 day/366 day rotations. You don't have a feel for astronomical timekeeping nor structural astronomy Brown and although you and your colleagues will continue like this for a while,even a long while,but technically you are finished as astronomy recovers the ability to correlate cause and effect between dynamics and what happens on Earth. ================================================== == Rut roh... Kelleher is now preaching astrology. My star sign is Cepheus, Kelleher. What do the dynamic stars foretell my future to be, here on Earth? Will I go on a journey? Will I meet a short, blond and chubby woman? Consult the crystal ball and the star charts for me, Kelleher. -- This message is brought to you from the keyboard of Lord Androcles, Zeroth Earl of Medway |
#10
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VLBI
On Sunday, December 9, 2012 7:08:39 PM UTC-8, oriel36 wrote:
...the determination that local tracking of a star in stellar circumpolar motion reflects daily rotation is false... So, what does it indicate? |
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