NASA's list of 'dead astronauts'

Aside from the Apollo, Challenger, and Columbia astronauts,
O'Keefe just read the list:

Bassett

Carter

Conrad

Freeman

Givens

Griggs

Henize

Lawrence

Overmyer

Robinson

See

Thorne

Williams



I'm glad Lawrence was on it (I called to make sure he was),

but Mike Adams wasn't... and some of these guys died on

personal activities, even after retired.



Discussion?

In article ,
Jim Oberg wrote:
I'm glad Lawrence was on it (I called to make sure he was),
but Mike Adams wasn't... and some of these guys died on
personal activities, even after retired.

Yes, peculiar that they'd list Conrad and not, say, Shepard or Slayton.

As for X-15 pilots, the real question is why Joe Walker wasn't on the list.
He is dead, he died on duty while flying for NASA (he was the F-104 pilot
in the midair collision that destroyed the second XB-70), and he was the
only X-15 pilot to fly above 100km.
--
"Think outside the box -- the box isn't our friend." | Henry Spencer
-- George Herbert |

What about Joe Walker? He was the first person to enter space twice
(above 100km) in the X-15 in 1963. He was employed by NASA and died
while on duty in a formation flight with the XB-70.

What about Michael Adams? He died in the X-15 while earning his Air
Force astronaut wings flying above 50 miles?

-Rusty

Henry's right -- Joe Walker broke 100 km...

For other names, note:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3217961/
Oberg sent me some observations about today's "Day of Remembrance" and
NASA's list of fallen heroes.

"There's a hazy line between qualifying for the list, and just barely not
qualifying. Overall, NASA historical researchers did a respectable job,"
Oberg wrote.

He noted with approval that Administrator Sean O'Keefe mentioned Robert
Lawrence, an Air Force space trainee whom many regard as the first black
astronaut, among the fallen:

"Including Robert Lawrence was proper, because his death was while in an
active human spaceflight program and involved official activities, and he
would likely have transferred to NASA in 1969 when the military program was
canceled. But another astronaut in that program, Jim Taylor, was killed
after the program ended, in a T-38 crash on Sept. 4, 1970, while performing
his duties at the Air Force Test Pilot School at Edwards Air Force Base - he
is not memorialized.

"A third military astronaut, Mike Adams, had left the USAF astronaut program
to become an X-15 rocket plane pilot, and he was killed Nov. 15, 1967, at
the end of an X-15 flight that had flown high enough to qualify him for
'astronaut status.' Another X-15 pilot, Joe Walker, had also flown high
enough (80 kilometers, or 50 miles) to earn this status, and he was later
killed in a midair collision, June 6, 1966. Even though the X-15 was a NASA
program, NASA does not recognize these men as 'NASA astronauts.'

"Another X-15 pilot, John McKay, earned astronaut status, but then was
severely injured in an X-15 crash in 1962. After years of medical treatment,
he died on April 27, 1975, from complications of his original injuries. He
is not memorialized.

"The Air Force had an even earlier spaceflight program, the X-20 (or
'Dyna-soar') space plane, so far ahead of its time it was canceled in 1963.
One of the selected astronauts, Russ Rogers, later died in an F-105 jet
explosion, on Sept. 13, 1967, over Okinawa.

"The most poignant 'almost-astronaut' who wasn't memorialized has to be
Charles Jones, who was selected in 1982 to train as a payload specialist
aboard a shuttle mission. Several of his teammates did make spaceflights,
but he didn't, and the program was disbanded. He was aboard American
Airlines Flight 11 on Sept. 11, 2001, that smashed into the north tower of
the World Trade Center. In this online tribute, note the sad phrase, 'There
are no In Memoriams for Charles Jones.'"

On 27 Jan 2005 13:16:51 -0800, "Rusty"
wrote:

What about Joe Walker? He was the first person to enter space twice
(above 100km) in the X-15 in 1963. He was employed by NASA and died
while on duty in a formation flight with the XB-70.

....Seconded.

What about Michael Adams? He died in the X-15 while earning his Air
Force astronaut wings flying above 50 miles?

....I can see the arguement against his inclusion now:

"Well, he may have made it up there, but he didn't make it back, so he
don't count..."

OM

--

"No ******* ever won a war by dying for | http://www.io.com/~o_m
his country. He won it by making the other | Sergeant-At-Arms
poor dumb ******* die for his country." | Human O-Ring Society

- General George S. Patton, Jr

OM wrote:




What about Joe Walker? He was the first person to enter space twice
(above 100km) in the X-15 in 1963. He was employed by NASA and died
while on duty in a formation flight with the XB-70.



...Seconded.


Of course Walker's F-104 was the cause of the crash; he got too close to
the B-70 and was caught in its slipstream.






What about Michael Adams? He died in the X-15 while earning his Air
Force astronaut wings flying above 50 miles?



...I can see the arguement against his inclusion now:

"Well, he may have made it up there, but he didn't make it back, so he
don't count..."



Adams should definitely be in.

Pat

In article ,
(Henry Spencer) wrote:

In article ,
Jim Oberg wrote:
I'm glad Lawrence was on it (I called to make sure he was),
but Mike Adams wasn't... and some of these guys died on
personal activities, even after retired.

Yes, peculiar that they'd list Conrad and not, say, Shepard or Slayton.

As for X-15 pilots, the real question is why Joe Walker wasn't on the list.
He is dead, he died on duty while flying for NASA (he was the F-104 pilot
in the midair collision that destroyed the second XB-70), and he was the
only X-15 pilot to fly above 100km.

Can some well-informed person put these questions (perhaps through
intermediaries) to someone of influence at NASA?

Of course Walker's F-104 was the cause of the crash; he got too close
to the B-70 and was caught in its slipstream.

Details of the XB-70 midair and crash can be found in this NASA online
PDF monograph:

"The Smell of Kerosene, A Test Pilot's Odyssey" by Donald L. Mallick
with Peter W. Merlin

http://www.nasa.gov/centers/dryden/p...n_kerosene.pdf

http://www.nasa.gov/centers/dryden/h.../Publications/

The XB-70 crash details are on document numbered pages 132-143 (PDF
pages 142-153).

-Rusty

On 28 Jan 2005 08:48:59 -0800, "Rusty"
wrote:

Of course Walker's F-104 was the cause of the crash; he got too close
to the B-70 and was caught in its slipstream.

....Caught in the slipstream, flipped over and through both verticals,
and the Valkyrie stayed stable for a bit longer than one would have
expected. The sad part is, tho, for want of a photo op, two pilots
were lost along with one hell of an airplane.

Details of the XB-70 midair and crash can be found in this NASA online
PDF monograph:

....Which reminds me: did we make it official that Rusty won the 2004
award for ssh's most outstanding contributor?

OM

--

"No ******* ever won a war by dying for | http://www.io.com/~o_m
his country. He won it by making the other | Sergeant-At-Arms
poor dumb ******* die for his country." | Human O-Ring Society

- General George S. Patton, Jr

OM wrote:

...Caught in the slipstream, flipped over and through both verticals,
and the Valkyrie stayed stable for a bit longer than one would have
expected. The sad part is, tho, for want of a photo op, two pilots
were lost along with one hell of an airplane.



There was speculation that the plane might have remained stable if the
had cranked the wingtips to the full down position; assuming that they
would still work, as the Starfighter had hit the starboard one. It would
have made for a very interesting landing though. The big problem was
that the crew of the B-70 didn't realize that they were the aircraft
that had been struck, and assumed it was two of the other aircraft that
had collided.

...Which reminds me: did we make it official that Rusty won the 2004
award for ssh's most outstanding contributor?



No, but we should; he's got it hands-down.

Pat