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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
http://www.californiaconnected.org/tv/archives/449
& http://www.death-valley.us/article306.html Here on the West Coast I was watching a show called California Connected, and it had a piece about some folks working out of Death Valley and the loss of the night sky to wasted light pollution It was called 'In Search of Darkness' and brought back to mind the nerve wracking problems with wasted energy, wasted light, wasted experiences and the loss of a natural resource our young people don't know about any more. Nothing can replace laying with the Earth at your back and the Milky Way overhead and the knowing of the world turning under it all. I suppose no one person can fix this problem; but perhaps each of us can influence those about us, without seeming 'kooky' or extremely radical. In any case, if you get a chance to watch the episode listed above, please do so. TBerk |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
On 8 Aug 2006 17:15:36 -0700, "Ed" wrote:
Sadly, few Professional or Amateurs are interested in this. Why do you think this? I think nearly all astronomers, professional or amateur are very interested in this. Many are actively involved in mitigation measures. I also think the situation is improving somewhat, although reductions in wasted light aren't always keeping up with population growth. But agencies are slowly catching on to the fact that there are substantial savings to be had by reducing light pollution. And in some cases, it even goes beyond economics: here in my rural county, the last couple of housing developments that were approved carried specific lighting restrictions solely for the purpose of preserving the night sky. _________________________________________________ Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
Chris, Look at the data man there is a huge amount of folks who are professional astronomers and who are not active and more amateurs that are not. |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
Ed wrote:
Chris, Look at the data man there is a huge amount of folks who are professional astronomers and who are not active and more amateurs that are not. That's could be said of anything... But it does not translate into "only a few are interested." Perhaps in your neck of the woods (wherever that may be) but in my experience in Southern California and the Southwest it's quite the opposite. Clear skies, Greg -- Greg Crinklaw Astronomical Software Developer Cloudcroft, New Mexico, USA (33N, 106W, 2700m) SkyTools: http://www.skyhound.com/cs.html Observing: http://www.skyhound.com/sh/skyhound.html Comets: http://www.skyhound.com/sh/comets.html To reply take out your eye |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
On 8 Aug 2006 20:39:31 -0700, "Ed" wrote:
Sorry Chris but the Southwest isn't the whole United States either. You are preaching to the choir but you are not noticing everyone else. I'm on the East Coast my friend, just outside of Philadelphia. I'm not talking about the SW. Most of the success stories I've read about have been in New England, and generally east of the Mississippi. IMO, if there is an apathy problem it must be limited to your area. _________________________________________________ Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
"Chris L Peterson" wrote in message ... On 8 Aug 2006 20:39:31 -0700, "Ed" wrote: Sorry Chris but the Southwest isn't the whole United States either. You are preaching to the choir but you are not noticing everyone else. I'm on the East Coast my friend, just outside of Philadelphia. I'm not talking about the SW. Most of the success stories I've read about have been in New England, and generally east of the Mississippi. IMO, if there is an apathy problem it must be limited to your area. _________________________________________________ Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com I don't know where Ed lives, but I too live east of the Mississippi (along the Ohio River), and the light pollution here is horrible. I've talked to some in places like Milwaukee, for instance, who have had some success in getting ordinances passed to change lighting, but it is my experience that the vast majority of cities east of the Mississippi have terrible problems with light pollution. On a good night, I can barely see the northern cross from my backyard. I can see polaris if I try hard enough, but forget about seeing the little dipper. It just can't be seen here at all. George |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
Ed wrote: TBerk, Sadly, few Professional or Amateurs are interested in this. Yes, you can make a difference as my club BMAA., Inc. did manage to work some years ago and got 2 Township ordinances passed. Professional astronomers are *very* interested and exercised about light (and also other EM wavebands where interference from man made sources is a problem). However, the professionals concentrate their fire power on defending the zones around world class observatories in so far as it is posisble (and when they eventually lose out to commercial interests the scope has to be relocated to a better site as happened to the UK's Issac Newton telescope that moved to the Canary Isles from Herstmonceux (and prior to that the whole Royal Greenwich Observatory which moved to there from just outside London). Professional astromoners do not have the time to campaign for darker skies in cities. The public is terrified of the dark these days so it is pretty much a lost cause. Some petrol stations and malls are dazzlingly bright believing (probably correctly) that the light attracts more customers like moths to a flame. IDA has not compiled data from these municipalities and states regarding a cost savings analysis for each of these American cities or states. Don't blame the IDA. If you feel so strongly then why don't you get on and do it! In the UK we had a parliamentary commission look into the issue. I don't entirely agree with it's conclusions to use HPS full cut off everywhere. But they did take evidence from everyone ranging from serious amateurs up to the then Astronomer Royal, Sir martin Rees who testified in person to the committee. I don't see how you can possibly claim that professionals are "not interested". Perhaps it is different in the USA? Professionals mainly fight very hard to keep the few remaining truly dark sites pristine, but they have pretty much given up on cities and urban sprawl. Life is too short. Regards, Martin Brown (and I did sumbit material to the committee) http://www.nezumi.demon.co.uk/lightp...the%20u k.htm |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
"Ed" wrote in message
ups.com... TBerk, Sadly, few Professional or Amateurs are interested in this. Bunk! For years Massachusetts Rep. Marzilli of Arlington, MA has worked with amateur and professional astronomers to push a anti light pollution, sensible (full cutoff) lighting bill through the state legislature only to have it come close then die in some committee. http://cfa-www.harvard.edu/~graff/nelpag/BILL.html Yes, you can make a difference as my club BMAA., Inc. did manage to work some years ago and got 2 Township ordinances passed. That is admirable. However, it does little good in a high population density region to darken one town, as is the case with Harvard, MA only to have surrounding towns be artificial twilight zones. http://www.boston.com/news/globe/hea...28/lights_out/ IDA has not compiled data from these municipalities and states regarding a cost savings analysis for each of these American cities or states. I find it ironic you pick on IDA. A few years ago S&T did a commentary lamenting the number of members paying dues to IDA compared to the number of S&T subscribers. -- Hilton Evans ---------------------------------------------------------------- Lat +42° 11' 07" Lon -71° 04' 35" ---------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.chempensoftware.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- http://mysite.verizon.net/hiltonevan...troimaging.htm |
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 03:47:58 -0400, "George"
wrote: I don't know where Ed lives, but I too live east of the Mississippi (along the Ohio River), and the light pollution here is horrible. I've talked to some in places like Milwaukee, for instance, who have had some success in getting ordinances passed to change lighting, but it is my experience that the vast majority of cities east of the Mississippi have terrible problems with light pollution. On a good night, I can barely see the northern cross from my backyard. I can see polaris if I try hard enough, but forget about seeing the little dipper. It just can't be seen here at all. No doubt that light pollution is far worse east of the Mississippi. I was taking exception to Ed's belief that astronomers in general were apathetic about it (or possibly that eastern astronomers were more apathetic than western ones). _________________________________________________ Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com |
#10
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Light Pollution and the Loss of the Night Sky
"Chris L Peterson" wrote in message ... On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 03:47:58 -0400, "George" wrote: I don't know where Ed lives, but I too live east of the Mississippi (along the Ohio River), and the light pollution here is horrible. I've talked to some in places like Milwaukee, for instance, who have had some success in getting ordinances passed to change lighting, but it is my experience that the vast majority of cities east of the Mississippi have terrible problems with light pollution. On a good night, I can barely see the northern cross from my backyard. I can see polaris if I try hard enough, but forget about seeing the little dipper. It just can't be seen here at all. No doubt that light pollution is far worse east of the Mississippi. I was taking exception to Ed's belief that astronomers in general were apathetic about it (or possibly that eastern astronomers were more apathetic than western ones). _________________________________________________ Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com I don't know any astronomers or amateurs who are appathetic about it. The issue is not the astronomers, but the pervasiveness of the light pollution. I mean, in most places around here, trying to put a dent in the amount of light pollution would be such a huge undertaking that it would likely be an exercise in futility. George |
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