A little help needed :)

I am an owner of a Meade ETX-125CE since a month ago. I am both
impressed and disappointed. The eyepieces that I have are the 26mm and
(I think) 8mm. I also have some filters for the eyepieces and one sun
filter for the telescope.
I also have the LPI.

The 26mm is rather easy to use but the 8mm is really hard to get a good
focus with. If I happen to get a good focus with the 8mm it goes in and
out of focus all the time when I get into contact with the eyepiece
while watching.

I know that it is very important to practice watching through a
telescope as one does not see much of the details in the beginning. But
some things as nebulas and galaxies, I cant find at all.

I have so far succeeded in viewing of the: Sun, Moon, Saturn and off
cause some stars.
I have had no luck in finding any nebula or galaxy.

The Sun
There is no problem finding the sun but I miss the sun as an object
in the Autostar. Maybe it is there but I can’t find it. Anyway it would
be great to have the Autostar automatically tracking the sun.
The only thing I can see is the sunspots. I can not detect any
prominence, chromosphere, flare or the patterns in the photosphere (hope
I did get the names right).

Is it so that the sun filter I am using is too simple? The filter looks
like a aluminized plastic folio. I believe I read somewhere that it only
let 0.000001% of the light through.

The Moon
Viewing the moon is ok. I have yet to use the moon filter.

The Saturn
Saturn seems to be a bit small, but that is as it should be. After all
it is some distance between earth and the planet.
Yesterday when I watched Saturn, then the image became fuzzy and then
clear with a frequency of around 1Hz. That has not happened before.
Could it be the tracking or was it just the atmospherically noise? I
think it kept a rather constant frequency.

Saturn also seems to be very bright so that I can not discern any
details. I made an attempt with a red filter (not remembering the #)
that where one of the filters that where recommended for viewing Saturn.
It made Saturn darker and red, but I did not se much more details.

Galaxies
I made an attempt to look at a few galaxies that where in my field of
view. (no FOV to Andromeda). But I could not see any galaxies at all
(26mm). Or if I did see them then they looked like ordinary stars.
How clear would they be seen?
Could it possibly be that I have to much light in the neighborhood? I
live just on the edge of a small town (30 000 citizens or so). The town
is on one side and a rather big lake is on our other side. There are not
many lights from the surrounding that penetrates into our garden. I
think I can see the stars fairly good but I can not see the Milky Way.

Nebulas
I have also tried to find some nebulas, both with and without a nebula
filter. I did not see one single nebula. I search for several and the
names that come to mind are the California nebula and the Orion nebula.

LPI Camera
I have just started to get acquainted with the camera, looking at
terrestrial objects. I believe that I first have to master the telescope
without the camera before trying it out in the sky.

At the moment the cables are to short, but I found a USB-TP-USB cable
(uses a standard TP Ethernet cable between the USB connections). I will
try that out later.

As my house is rather walled in by bushes, hedges and buildings I have
problem finding nonmoving objects to practice at. Treetops have a
tendency to move a lot. But a day without wind I tried out the camera by
pointing the telescope at the top of flagpole. That way I could take a
picture of myself reflected in the brass top.
Anyway the camera seems to be very hard to focus. Is the LPI camera any
good at all?


So to end this long text I have first to ask you to forgive me if some
of it does not make sense, as English is not my native language.
And last, if you have any suggestions that might help me, please tell me.

/Jan G

"Jan Gustavsson" wrote in message
...
I am an owner of a Meade ETX-125CE since a month ago. I am both impressed
and disappointed. The eyepieces that I have are the 26mm and (I think) 8mm.
The 26mm is rather easy to use but the 8mm is really hard to get a good
focus with. If I happen to get a good focus with the 8mm it goes in and
out of focus all the time

This sounds like to me like a result of poor "seeing", the stability of the
air mass overhead. The lower power eyepieces are less effected by this.
After some experience you will figure out what nights are good for high
power, and which are not.

-SPaul

On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:49:23 +0100, Jan Gustavsson
wrote:

I am an owner of a Meade ETX-125CE since a month ago. I am both
impressed and disappointed. The eyepieces that I have are the 26mm and
(I think) 8mm. I also have some filters for the eyepieces and one sun
filter for the telescope.
I also have the LPI.

The 26mm is rather easy to use but the 8mm is really hard to get a good
focus with. If I happen to get a good focus with the 8mm it goes in and
out of focus all the time when I get into contact with the eyepiece
while watching.

In my opinion it would be worth the expense to purchase a couple of
eyepieces that provide magnifications that fall between that of your
8mm and 26mm eyepieces -- perhaps a 10mm and a 20mm eyepiece.

Your 8mm eyepiece provides a rather high magnification. Good 'seeing'
conditions are necessary in order to use such high magnifications.
Also, it's necessary to allow sufficient time for the telescope to
adjust to the outside temperature. This is more important for high
magnifications than it is for low magnifications.

I know that it is very important to practice watching through a
telescope as one does not see much of the details in the beginning. But
some things as nebulas and galaxies, I cant find at all.

Some nebulae and galaxies would be too faint to see, particularly from
a location where the sky isn't very dark. Others should be bright
enough for you to see. Keep trying for M42, the Great Orion Nebula.
It's one of the brightest nebulae in the sky! M81 would be a good
first galaxy to try for. For such objects start with your lowest
magnification (the 26mm eyepiece).

If you look directly at a galaxy or nebula the object will appear much
fainter (sometimes invisible!) than it would appear if you looked at a
point some distance away from the actual object. This practice is
known as "averted vision" and is used by everyone who observes such
objects.

The Sun
There is no problem finding the sun but I miss the sun as an object
in the Autostar. Maybe it is there but I can’t find it. Anyway it would
be great to have the Autostar automatically tracking the sun.
The only thing I can see is the sunspots. I can not detect any
prominence, chromosphere, flare or the patterns in the photosphere (hope
I did get the names right).

Your sun filter is a "white light" solar filter. It's good primarily
for observing sunspots. From time to time you should also be able to
see faculae -- slighter brighter patches here and there near the limb
of the sun. Notice that the edge (limb) of the sun is a little darker
than the central portion of the sun.

Is it so that the sun filter I am using is too simple? The filter looks
like a aluminized plastic folio. I believe I read somewhere that it only
let 0.000001% of the light through.

A more expensive, specialized solar filter (Hydrogen-Alpha) is needed
in order to see chromospheric details such as prominences -- unless
you get lucky enough to view a total solar eclipse!

The Moon
Viewing the moon is ok. I have yet to use the moon filter.

Many people (including myself) prefer to observe the moon without
using a moon filter. If you don't feel you need to use the filter,
then don't use it ;-)

The Saturn
Saturn seems to be a bit small, but that is as it should be. After all
it is some distance between earth and the planet.
Yesterday when I watched Saturn, then the image became fuzzy and then
clear with a frequency of around 1Hz. That has not happened before.
Could it be the tracking or was it just the atmospherically noise? I
think it kept a rather constant frequency.

The problem was most likely due to air masses of different
temperatures -- either between the scope and Saturn in which case all
you can do is wait for a better night -- or inside the telescope in
which case the telescope needs more time to adjust to the outside
temperature.

Saturn also seems to be very bright so that I can not discern any
details. I made an attempt with a red filter (not remembering the #)
that where one of the filters that where recommended for viewing Saturn.
It made Saturn darker and red, but I did not se much more details.

In the 26mm eyepiece Saturn would be small and bright. In higher
power eyepieces Saturn will be larger and less bright. On a good
night, after your telescope has had enough time to adjust to the
outside temperature you should be able to see some details on Saturn
without using a filter. (It would be helpful if you had more than two
eyepiece to choose between.)

I've found filters to be of very little value when it comes to
observing Saturn. Color filters can be of more use in observing Mars
and Jupiter -- particularly after you've gained a bit of observing
experience.

Galaxies

Start with M81. Other galaxies will be more difficult to see. After
M81 try for some of the other Messier galaxies.

Nebulas

Start with M42 -- the Great Orion Nebula. Afterwards try for some of
the other Messier Nebulae. The California Nebula would be invisible
in your telescope under your sky conditions. Forget about California
-- at least for now.

An excellent observing project would be a program to observe all the
Messier objects. Most (but not all) of the Messier objects are among
the best objects in the night sky!

Your telescope, used from your sky conditions, should be well suited
to observing double stars. Find the star in the 26mm eyepiece then
use the 8mm eyepiece. Gamma Andromeda would be a good double to try
first! (Remember to allow the scope sufficient time to cool down
before using high magnifications!)

Don't let invisible objects bother you. Excepting the objects
mentioned above, if you don't at first see an object make a note and
go on to a different object. Later, after you've gained more
experience you can try for some of your unseen objects once again.

LPI Camera

Someone else may be able to answer your camera questions. I don't
allow cameras to deprive me of my own eyepiece time! ;-)

Sketcher
To sketch is to see.

hi Jan,

Seeing as Sketcher has given such comprehensive answers to everything
else, I'll take a shot at the LPI question ;O)

The LPI is very good at what it sets out to do, ie. image the moon and
brighter planets. The focusing can be a little awkward at first. you
need move the focusser VERY slowly and remember what you see on your PC
screen is a second or so behind what the LPI is actually seeing, so you
need to focus, wait, focus, wait etc.

You should have got a black plastic ring with the LPI, it's called a
'par-focal ring', you can use it to make the LPI come into focus at the
exact place your 8mm does, by screwing it on to either one of them at
the right postion, so when you have the Moon in focus in your 8mm you
can just take it out and pop in the LPI and start taking pics.

The Moon is the best thing to try first as the planets can be quite
tricky, a good starting tip is to enable the 'auto adj' button neat the
top left of the screen, it gives you good starting values for most
settings.

Stick withe the LPI you can get some great results out of it with very
little effort, try the yahoo LPI group for more detailed advice:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Meade_LPI/

All the best
Gaz

Jan Gustavsson wrote:

I am an owner of a Meade ETX-125CE since a month ago. I am both
impressed and disappointed. The eyepieces that I have are the 26mm and
(I think) 8mm. I also have some filters for the eyepieces and one sun
filter for the telescope.
I also have the LPI.

The 26mm is rather easy to use but the 8mm is really hard to get a good
focus with. If I happen to get a good focus with the 8mm it goes in and
out of focus all the time when I get into contact with the eyepiece
while watching.

It might be that conditions werent good enough (still air) for the
high magnification and you can make it worse by viewing thigns like
Saturn when they are too low in the sky (even more air). If treetops
'move a lot', then the air may not be still enough for high mag.

It can vary night to night. Several nights ago, 58x provided the best
image on Jupiter, but last night seemed much better and was able to
get sharp clear views at 125x. Depending on where you are, ice
crystals in the air can make the image fuzzy or give it a halo.

It is possible some of the fuzziness is vibration from the tracking
motors - I dont know how likely that is for the Meade, but at high mag
just touching (or letting go) the tracking knobs causes my image to
jitter. A steady and cyclical event /sounds/ mechanical, but this
should be easy to determine: just turn off the motor and see if it
goes away.

Some of the standard filter sets seem a bit much to me (too dark) or I
havent found the right use for them yet. Last night Jupe was very
bright and I found that either a light blue (82a) or light yellow (8)
took just enough glare or sheen off it to clearly see some of the
belts. The same ones helped in splitting some double stars where the
main one was VERY bright and the other very close.


I know that it is very important to practice watching through a
telescope as one does not see much of the details in the beginning. But
some things as nebulas and galaxies, I cant find at all.

I have so far succeeded in viewing of the: Sun, Moon, Saturn and off
cause some stars.
I have had no luck in finding any nebula or galaxy.

I assume the ETX EC doesnt have GoTo (or it is not working right). If
so, start with bright easy objects (skip galaxies for the moment) and
work up to the harder things (I am doing just that).

Two books that can help: _Turn Left at Orion_ and _Star Watch_ have
loads of instructions for locating objects by star hopping. Includes
sketches of what they see (and you can expect) at various
magnifications.

The Astro League has a list of Urban Sky objects
(http://www.astroleague.org/al/obsclu...n/urbanld.html) which
should be easy to start with.

Their Double star list
(http://www.astroleague.org/al/obsclu.../dblstar1.html) is also
fun to work out on brighter nights and easier to do than the fainter
Messier objects.

THe web site http://www.davidpaulgreen.com/tumol.html has the Messier
objects mapped out, one per page with a mini map for finding each
(including a thumbnail image of what the target looks like). Lots of
the stuff around Orion and Taurus (eg M42, M45, M50) are easy to find
this time of year. This comes as a program or as PDF to print out and
take along.

In general, I am finding that zipping back and forth all over the sky
(without GoTo) means you need lots of patience to find stuff (hard to
do in the cold) or luck. So, I started with one const (I chose Orion)
and I am working outward to nearby ones, to get familiar with smaller
sections of the sky at a time.

To help learn setting circles (dunno if this applies to ETX EC), I
made up a list of 12 or 15 easy to find/see stars and M objects
(mostly from Gemini across Orion to M45), and work thru the list using
circles to go thru the list as sort of as a drill to get familiar with
how to use circles. All the list targets are things I can tell at a
glance if I did things right and landed on the target because they are
from my current "home" section of the sky. (I still 'get lost' after
the 3rd or 4th target, but expect milder weather wont make me want to
rush thru the drill.)

The 26mm is rather easy to use but the 8mm is really hard to get a
good
focus with. If I happen to get a good focus with the 8mm it goes in
and
out of focus all the time when I get into contact with the eyepiece
while watching.

In my opinion it would be worth the expense to purchase a couple of
eyepieces that provide magnifications that fall between that of your
8mm and 26mm eyepieces -- perhaps a 10mm and a 20mm eyepiece.

I would start at about 20mm (like you indicate) but my next choice
would be in the 16mm range. This set would allow a 2X barlow to be used
and enable a whole range of magnifications: 26mm, 20mm, 16mm, 13mm
(26*2), 10mm (20*2), and 8mm.

To the point of seeing galaxies and other dim objects. You will have to
teach your eyes to precieve detail right at the edge of visibility, and
you should expect this learning process to take at least a year and
maybe more. But it is an enjoyable journey.

Mitch

Sketcher wrote:
Also, it's necessary to allow sufficient time for the telescope to
adjust to the outside temperature.

Ok, that could be one problem. I moved the telescope from +20 degree
Celsius to -5 degree and started looking after just 5 minutes. Are there
any time rule here? For example 1 minute per degree?



If you look directly at a galaxy or nebula the object will appear much
fainter (sometimes invisible!) than it would appear if you looked at a
point some distance away from the actual object.
Even with a telescope?



A more expensive, specialized solar filter (Hydrogen-Alpha) is needed
in order to see chromospheric details such as prominences
Any idea what those cost?



/Jan G

Gaz wrote:
You should have got a black plastic ring with the LPI, it's called a
'par-focal ring', you can use it to make the LPI come into focus at the
exact place your 8mm does, by screwing it on to either one of them at
the right postion, so when you have the Moon in focus in your 8mm you
can just take it out and pop in the LPI and start taking pics.


Yes, I got such a ring.

Does the LPI see about the same amount of space or moon as the 8mm eyepiece?

/Jan G

wrote:
To the point of seeing galaxies and other dim objects. You will have to
teach your eyes to precieve detail right at the edge of visibility, and
you should expect this learning process to take at least a year and
maybe more. But it is an enjoyable journey.

Mitch

Would the LPI camera give me a better chance to see galaxies? (as it
takes in light for a longer period then the eye).

/Jan G

Michael K wrote:
It might be that conditions werent good enough (still air) for the
high magnification and you can make it worse by viewing thigns like
Saturn when they are too low in the sky (even more air). If treetops
'move a lot', then the air may not be still enough for high mag.


Ohh, I thought that problematic air motion came from heat, as when you
see the air moving above a hot road in the summer. Never thought of the
wind conditions
So I assume that a calm night is almost a must?


Depending on where you are, ice
crystals in the air can make the image fuzzy or give it a halo.

I live in Sweden close to latitude 58.4 N

It is possible some of the fuzziness is vibration from the tracking
motors but this
should be easy to determine: just turn off the motor and see if it
goes away.

A simple test
I will try that.


I assume the ETX EC doesnt have GoTo (or it is not working right).

It has a GoTo and I think it works ok. I have trained it at it seems to
find the targets.


/Jan G