How can Boeing and LockMart compete with SpaceX?

Price for an LEO launch of the Falcon Heavy (29+ tonne payload) is just
$94.5 million - Delta IV Heavy is currently $250 million + with a smaller
payload.

http://www.spacex.com/falcon9_heavy.php also quotes a price for "TLI
missions" - why do I get the feeling that Elon Musk want's to be the 13th
person on the Moon... The F9H would get a 3-3.5 tonne payload onto the
surface. That brings up the possibility of something like the Langley
Lander/ Langley Lander Light and a modified Gemini-sized spacecraft.
Interesting stuff!

I've heard mention of a much larger engine for the Falcon series - F-1 power
levels - if this is done, then my Delta V might be better named Falcon Extra
Heavy or similar.

On Apr 12, 9:38 am, "Alan Erskine" wrote:
Price for an LEO launch of the Falcon Heavy (29+ tonne payload) is just
$94.5 million - Delta IV Heavy is currently $250 million + with a smaller
payload.

http://www.spacex.com/falcon9_heavy.php also quotes a price for "TLI
missions" - why do I get the feeling that Elon Musk want's to be the 13th
person on the Moon... The F9H would get a 3-3.5 tonne payload onto the
surface. That brings up the possibility of something like the Langley
Lander/ Langley Lander Light and a modified Gemini-sized spacecraft.
Interesting stuff!

I've heard mention of a much larger engine for the Falcon series - F-1 power
levels - if this is done, then my Delta V might be better named Falcon Extra
Heavy or similar.

They can compete easily. Spacex's prices are just like the initial
shuttle flight rate projections, not based on any real world
experience.

On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 13:38:49 GMT, "Alan Erskine"
wrote:

Price for an LEO launch of the Falcon Heavy (29+ tonne payload) is just
$94.5 million - Delta IV Heavy is currently $250 million + with a smaller
payload.

NASA was quoted well over $400 million for a Delta IV-H. (So much for
cost savings versus Titan IV...)

http://www.spacex.com/falcon9_heavy.php also quotes a price for "TLI
missions" - why do I get the feeling that Elon Musk want's to be the 13th
person on the Moon... The F9H would get a 3-3.5 tonne payload onto the
surface.

He has to make a rocket that works first. Any rocket. Just get one
into orbit, and no song-and-dance about how *almost* working is cause
for celebration.


Brian

"Brian Thorn" wrote in message
...
NASA was quoted well over $400 million for a Delta IV-H. (So much for
cost savings versus Titan IV...)

That was before or after the DIV-H was taken off the commercial market?

http://www.spacex.com/falcon9_heavy.php also quotes a price for "TLI
missions" - why do I get the feeling that Elon Musk want's to be the 13th
person on the Moon... The F9H would get a 3-3.5 tonne payload onto the
surface.

He has to make a rocket that works first. Any rocket. Just get one
into orbit, and no song-and-dance about how *almost* working is cause
for celebration.

True; but the systems are in place. Remember that Apollo 8 went to the Moon
instead of being just another LEO test after Von Braun said "there's very
little difference between Lunar orbit and Earth orbit". Once the systems
have been checked out, there's very little difference. Falcon 1s first stage
uses the same engine as the Falcon 9/F9H.

"Mr Hughes, this will fly".

On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 16:07:14 GMT, "Alan Erskine"
wrote:

"Brian Thorn" wrote in message
.. .
NASA was quoted well over $400 million for a Delta IV-H. (So much for
cost savings versus Titan IV...)

That was before or after the DIV-H was taken off the commercial market?

Delta IV-Heavy wasn't marketed commercially as far as I know. Boeing's
marketing was of the Medium variants. The $400+ million is what NASA
was quoted for purchasing launches of planetary missions. They went to
Atlas V instead.

Brian

On Apr 12, 12:40�pm, Brian Thorn wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 16:07:14 GMT, "Alan Erskine"

wrote:
"Brian Thorn" wrote in message
.. .
NASA was quoted well over $400 million for a Delta IV-H. (So much for
cost savings versus Titan IV...)

That was before or after the DIV-H was taken off the commercial market?

Delta IV-Heavy wasn't marketed commercially as far as I know. Boeing's
marketing was of the Medium variants. The $400+ million is what NASA
was quoted for purchasing launches of planetary missions. They went to
Atlas V instead.

Brian

all the atlas and deltas had their beginings as ICBMs...... and
designed for optimum operation as a missle, then were changed a bit
for space launches.

once one works, launch industry will be turned on its head........

bob haller safety advocate wrote:

all the atlas and deltas had their beginings as ICBMs.

Actually, Thor was an IRBM, not an ICBM.

--
Dave Michelson

"Alan Erskine" wrote:

"Brian Thorn" wrote in message

http://www.spacex.com/falcon9_heavy.php also quotes a price for "TLI
missions" - why do I get the feeling that Elon Musk want's to be the 13th
person on the Moon... The F9H would get a 3-3.5 tonne payload onto the
surface.

He has to make a rocket that works first. Any rocket. Just get one
into orbit, and no song-and-dance about how *almost* working is cause
for celebration.

True; but the systems are in place.

Brian specified 'no song-and-dance'.

Remember that Apollo 8 went to the Moon instead of being just another LEO test
after Von Braun said "there's very little difference between Lunar orbit and
Earth orbit".

In that, Von Braun is quite wrong - the thermal environment is
different, the radiation environment is different, the communications
and operations enviroment, ditto... The difference may not have
mattered much for Von Braun's boosters, but it make a heck of a lot of
difference for the payload.

Once the systems have been checked out, there's very little difference. Falcon 1s
first stage uses the same engine as the Falcon 9/F9H.

More 'song-and-dance'.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

http://derekl1963.livejournal.com/

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

"Derek Lyons" wrote in message
...

More 'song-and-dance'.

I like the dance and the music is beautiful.

Alan Erskine wrote:
"Derek Lyons" wrote in message
...

More 'song-and-dance'.

I like the dance and the music is beautiful.

The Kool-Aid is also tasty, no?