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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
Hello,
If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. Simliarly, soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. (In both cases, I'm relying on memory.) You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. Fine. You can tell me I've remembered wrong. Fine. But if I'm correct, how can these be? The explanations I've read go something like this: 1. "The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at quantum sizes, such as were in play during the first moments after the Big Bang." (Why not? And does that mean that subatomic objects can move FTL?) 2. The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at vast distances, such as the distances between galaxies." (Why not? At which distances does the speed rule become moot?) 3. The speed-of-light rule applies, and it is not violated. The objects aren't really moving FTL. Instead, the space containing them is explanding FTL. (Oh really? How can we tell the difference between "two objects moving relative to each other" and "space expanding or contracting between two objects"?) This is a serious, if naive, question. Thank you for all serious answers. Ted Shoemaker |
#2
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
"Ted Shoemaker" wrote in message ... | Hello, | | If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each | other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. Simliarly, | soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. (In both | cases, I'm relying on memory.) | | You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. Fine. You | can tell me I've remembered wrong. Fine. Ok, done. |
#3
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
On Oct 20, 1:20*pm, Ted Shoemaker wrote:
Hello, If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. *Simliarly, soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. *(In both cases, I'm relying on memory.) You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. *Fine. *You can tell me I've remembered wrong. *Fine. But if I'm correct, how can these be? The explanations I've read go something like this: 1. *"The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at quantum sizes, such as were in play during the first moments after the Big Bang." * * *(Why not? *And does that mean that subatomic objects can move FTL?) 2. *The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at vast distances, such as the distances between galaxies." * * *(Why not? *At which distances does the speed rule become moot?) 3. *The speed-of-light rule applies, and it is not violated. *The objects aren't really moving FTL. *Instead, the space containing them is explanding FTL. * * *(Oh really? *How can we tell the difference between "two objects moving relative to each other" and "space expanding or contracting between two objects"?) This is a serious, if naive, question. *Thank you for all serious answers. Ted Shoemaker 0.5 c is as fast as anything physical can be forced to move. Perhaps the voodoo physics of SR/GR makes it only seem as though greater velocity is possible. However, the force of gravity and gravity lensing should be faster than light. ~ BG |
#4
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
"Androcles" wrote in message ... "Ted Shoemaker" wrote in message ... | Hello, | | If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each | other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. Simliarly, | soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. (In both | cases, I'm relying on memory.) | | You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. Fine. You | can tell me I've remembered wrong. Fine. Ok, done. So, someone raises some very valid points and that's your contribution ??? |
#5
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
On Oct 20, 3:20*pm, Ted Shoemaker wrote:
Hello, If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. *Simliarly, soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. *(In both cases, I'm relying on memory.) You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. *Fine. *You can tell me I've remembered wrong. *Fine. But if I'm correct, how can these be? The explanations I've read go something like this: 1. *"The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at quantum sizes, such as were in play during the first moments after the Big Bang." * * *(Why not? *And does that mean that subatomic objects can move FTL?) 2. *The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at vast distances, such as the distances between galaxies." * * *(Why not? *At which distances does the speed rule become moot?) 3. *The speed-of-light rule applies, and it is not violated. *The objects aren't really moving FTL. *Instead, the space containing them is explanding FTL. * * *(Oh really? *How can we tell the difference between "two objects moving relative to each other" and "space expanding or contracting between two objects"?) This is a serious, if naive, question. *Thank you for all serious answers. Ted Shoemaker There is no such thing as speed of light unless you are comparing the state of one object to another. So to say the galaxies are fleeing from one another greater than the speed of light is a vague, meaningless statement, since you are not comparing the state of one object to another, but to a whole fleet of obects. |
#6
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
On Oct 20, 5:39*pm, Mark Earnest wrote:
On Oct 20, 3:20*pm, Ted Shoemaker wrote: Hello, If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. *Simliarly, soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. *(In both cases, I'm relying on memory.) You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. *Fine. *You can tell me I've remembered wrong. *Fine. But if I'm correct, how can these be? The explanations I've read go something like this: 1. *"The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at quantum sizes, such as were in play during the first moments after the Big Bang." * * *(Why not? *And does that mean that subatomic objects can move FTL?) 2. *The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at vast distances, such as the distances between galaxies." * * *(Why not? *At which distances does the speed rule become moot?) 3. *The speed-of-light rule applies, and it is not violated. *The objects aren't really moving FTL. *Instead, the space containing them is explanding FTL. * * *(Oh really? *How can we tell the difference between "two objects moving relative to each other" and "space expanding or contracting between two objects"?) This is a serious, if naive, question. *Thank you for all serious answers. Ted Shoemaker There is no such thing as speed of light unless you are comparing the state of one object to another. So to say the galaxies are fleeing from one another greater than the speed of light is a vague, meaningless statement, since you are not comparing the state of one object to another, but to a whole fleet of obects.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You can scan the Milky Way in one second. How much faster than light is that? TreBert |
#7
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
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#9
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
On Oct 20, 5:00*pm, bert wrote:
On Oct 20, 5:39*pm, Mark Earnest wrote: On Oct 20, 3:20*pm, Ted Shoemaker wrote: Hello, If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. *Simliarly, soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. *(In both cases, I'm relying on memory.) You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. *Fine. *You can tell me I've remembered wrong. *Fine. But if I'm correct, how can these be? The explanations I've read go something like this: 1. *"The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at quantum sizes, such as were in play during the first moments after the Big Bang." * * *(Why not? *And does that mean that subatomic objects can move FTL?) 2. *The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at vast distances, such as the distances between galaxies." * * *(Why not? *At which distances does the speed rule become moot?) 3. *The speed-of-light rule applies, and it is not violated. *The objects aren't really moving FTL. *Instead, the space containing them is explanding FTL. * * *(Oh really? *How can we tell the difference between "two objects moving relative to each other" and "space expanding or contracting between two objects"?) This is a serious, if naive, question. *Thank you for all serious answers. Ted Shoemaker There is no such thing as speed of light unless you are comparing the state of one object to another. So to say the galaxies are fleeing from one another greater than the speed of light is a vague, meaningless statement, since you are not comparing the state of one object to another, but to a whole fleet of obects.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You can scan the Milky Way in one second. How much faster than light is that? * TreBert Good one, but not quite the same thing. ~ BG |
#10
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How can galaxies move FTL relative to each other?
On Oct 20, 7:00*pm, bert wrote:
On Oct 20, 5:39*pm, Mark Earnest wrote: On Oct 20, 3:20*pm, Ted Shoemaker wrote: Hello, If I read correctly, galaxies are generally moving away from each other, sometimes at speeds greater than that of light. *Simliarly, soon after the Big Bang, objects moved faster than light. *(In both cases, I'm relying on memory.) You can tell me that the sources I've read are worthless. *Fine. *You can tell me I've remembered wrong. *Fine. But if I'm correct, how can these be? The explanations I've read go something like this: 1. *"The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at quantum sizes, such as were in play during the first moments after the Big Bang." * * *(Why not? *And does that mean that subatomic objects can move FTL?) 2. *The speed-of-light rule doesn't apply at vast distances, such as the distances between galaxies." * * *(Why not? *At which distances does the speed rule become moot?) 3. *The speed-of-light rule applies, and it is not violated. *The objects aren't really moving FTL. *Instead, the space containing them is explanding FTL. * * *(Oh really? *How can we tell the difference between "two objects moving relative to each other" and "space expanding or contracting between two objects"?) This is a serious, if naive, question. *Thank you for all serious answers. Ted Shoemaker There is no such thing as speed of light unless you are comparing the state of one object to another. So to say the galaxies are fleeing from one another greater than the speed of light is a vague, meaningless statement, since you are not comparing the state of one object to another, but to a whole fleet of obects.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You can scan the Milky Way in one second. How much faster than light is that? * TreBert- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - If you assume that you can touch a star just by looking at it, which is feasible if you consider the spirits of things, then sure, your line of vision exceeds the speed of light all the time when looking up at the night time sky on any clear night. |
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