Houston Houston, do you hear me?

JF Mezei wrote:

On 2017-09-01 23:19, Fred J. McCall wrote:

Then you should pay closer attention because the contention that
frequency and severity of storms correlates only to water temperature

My statement applied only to hurricanes/cyclones/typhoons which are only
one type of storm, a type which forms over warm oceans and is fueled by
warm ocean water. The warmer the ocean, the stronger and more frequent
hurricane/cyclone/typhoon are.

You are the one who claimed this was not true, pointing to other types
of storms.


Another one who wasn't paying attention. You, too, need to go back
through the thread and read everything.


--
"You take the lies out of him, and he'll shrink to the size of
your hat; you take the malice out of him, and he'll disappear."
-- Mark Twain

Le Sep/2/2017 à 12:58 PM, Fred J. McCall a écrit :
Alain Fournier wrote:

Le Sep/1/2017 à 11:19 PM, Fred J. McCall a écrit :
Alain Fournier wrote:

On Aug/31/2017 at 9:13 PM, Fred J. McCall wrote :
Alain Fournier wrote:

On Aug/31/2017 at 1:24 PM, Fred J. McCall wrote :
Rob wrote:

Fred J McCall wrote:
Rob wrote:

Fred J McCall wrote:
OK, you're adamantly ignorant. Your choice. Again, given global
warming, why do we not have constantly increasing storm power and
frequency (because we don't, you know)?

Because global warming only means the AVERAGE temperature is going
up. The ACTUAL temperature, both locally and globally, varies around
that average and is not higher everywhere and always.

Everyone except Donald and you understands that.


In other words, like all GCC True Believers, the evidence only matters
when you say it does. If the AVERAGE temperature is going up, the
AVERAGE storm should be more severe and the AVERAGE number should be
going up. Why are neither of those two things true?


But they ARE true!


Hogwash! You are entitled to your own opinion but you are NOT
entitled to your own data.

https://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/top10.asp

Did you actually look at the site you cited?

Seasons with the most named storms, 1851 - Present
11 of 15 years given, or 73%, are in the past 25 years. By random
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the most hurricanes, 1851 - Present
5 out of 10 given, or 50%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the most major hurricanes, 1851 - Present
3 out of 8 given, or 38%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the highest Accumulated Cyclone Energy, 1851 - Present
4 out of 10 given, or 40%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

That's all the info given on that site. All of it showing that
we now having more severe weather than in the past.


But it is not, as it should be if GCC is true and only water
temperature matters, monotonically increasing.

What are you talking about? I don't think I have ever seen anyone
anywhere claim that global warming is monotonic, nor anyone
saying only water temperature matters. There really no reason
whatsoever to think that hurricanes should increase monotonically.


Then you should pay closer attention because the contention that
frequency and severity of storms correlates only to water temperature
is what I've been arguing against right along. Perhaps you should
understand the positions being taken before you mix in?

Care to show who and when someone said that frequency and severity of
storms correlates *only* to water temperature? JF Mezei said on Aug 30
at 1:25 AM, that "So warmer oceans will result in more frequent extreme
weather events." He didn't say that there are no other causes for
extreme weather or that the increase of frequency in extreme weather
events will be monotonic. You pulled that out, because you needed a
straw man.


No, I don't care to show you. I'm disinclined to go wading back
through the thread just because you failed to pay attention. Go read
Rob's ****e, you lying ****wit, and stop molesting your straw man.

So if you don’t want to wade back through the thread I will help you a
little. Maybe you should pay attention yourself to what you have written
yourself.

On Aug 30 at 11:39 PM, Fred J.McCall wrote:
OK, you're adamantly ignorant. Your choice. Again, given global
warming, why do we not have constantly increasing storm power and
frequency (because we don't, you know)?

On Aug 31 at 4:34 AM, Rob wrote:
Because global warming only means the AVERAGE temperature is going
up. The ACTUAL temperature, both locally and globally, varies around
that average and is not higher everywhere and always.

[Rob isn’t saying that anything is going up monotonically, he
is talking about the average.]

On Aug 31 at 9:46 AM, Fred J.McCall wrote:
In other words, like all GCC True Believers, the evidence only matters
when you say it does. If the AVERAGE temperature is going up, the
AVERAGE storm should be more severe and the AVERAGE number should be
going up. Why are neither of those two things true?

[Note that the emphasis in the word AVERAGE is from Fred J.McCall
note mine.]

On Aug 31 at 10:05 AM, ob wrote:
But they ARE true!

On Aug 31 at 1:24 PM, Fred J.McCall wrote:
Hogwash! You are entitled to your own opinion but you are NOT
entitled to your own data.
https://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/top10.asp

On Aug 31 at 7:52 PM, Alain Fournier wrote:
Did you actually look at the site you cited?
Seasons with the most named storms, 1851 - Present
11 of 15 years given, or 73%, are in the past 25 years. By random
this should be about 15%.
…

On Aug 31 at 9:13 PM, Fred J.McCall wrote:
But it is not, as it should be if GCC is true and only water
temperature matters, monotonically increasing.

[You’re the first asking that they should be monotonically
increasing here. That assertion is hogwash.]


Alain Fournier

Alain Fournier wrote:

Le Sep/2/2017 à 12:58 PM, Fred J. McCall a écrit :
Alain Fournier wrote:

Le Sep/1/2017 à 11:19 PM, Fred J. McCall a écrit :
Alain Fournier wrote:

On Aug/31/2017 at 9:13 PM, Fred J. McCall wrote :
Alain Fournier wrote:

On Aug/31/2017 at 1:24 PM, Fred J. McCall wrote :
Rob wrote:

Fred J McCall wrote:
Rob wrote:

Fred J McCall wrote:
OK, you're adamantly ignorant. Your choice. Again, given global
warming, why do we not have constantly increasing storm power and
frequency (because we don't, you know)?

Because global warming only means the AVERAGE temperature is going
up. The ACTUAL temperature, both locally and globally, varies around
that average and is not higher everywhere and always.

Everyone except Donald and you understands that.


In other words, like all GCC True Believers, the evidence only matters
when you say it does. If the AVERAGE temperature is going up, the
AVERAGE storm should be more severe and the AVERAGE number should be
going up. Why are neither of those two things true?


But they ARE true!


Hogwash! You are entitled to your own opinion but you are NOT
entitled to your own data.

https://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/top10.asp

Did you actually look at the site you cited?

Seasons with the most named storms, 1851 - Present
11 of 15 years given, or 73%, are in the past 25 years. By random
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the most hurricanes, 1851 - Present
5 out of 10 given, or 50%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the most major hurricanes, 1851 - Present
3 out of 8 given, or 38%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the highest Accumulated Cyclone Energy, 1851 - Present
4 out of 10 given, or 40%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

That's all the info given on that site. All of it showing that
we now having more severe weather than in the past.


But it is not, as it should be if GCC is true and only water
temperature matters, monotonically increasing.

What are you talking about? I don't think I have ever seen anyone
anywhere claim that global warming is monotonic, nor anyone
saying only water temperature matters. There really no reason
whatsoever to think that hurricanes should increase monotonically.


Then you should pay closer attention because the contention that
frequency and severity of storms correlates only to water temperature
is what I've been arguing against right along. Perhaps you should
understand the positions being taken before you mix in?

Care to show who and when someone said that frequency and severity of
storms correlates *only* to water temperature? JF Mezei said on Aug 30
at 1:25 AM, that "So warmer oceans will result in more frequent extreme
weather events." He didn't say that there are no other causes for
extreme weather or that the increase of frequency in extreme weather
events will be monotonic. You pulled that out, because you needed a
straw man.


No, I don't care to show you. I'm disinclined to go wading back
through the thread just because you failed to pay attention. Go read
Rob's ****e, you lying ****wit, and stop molesting your straw man.

So if you don’t want to wade back through the thread I will help you a
little. Maybe you should pay attention yourself to what you have written
yourself.


Perhaps you should interest yourself in something other than your
constant carping and distortion. Go do what I told you.


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn

On Sunday, September 3, 2017 at 3:14:09 PM UTC-4, Fred J. McCall wrote:
Alain Fournier wrote:

Le Sep/2/2017 Ã* 12:58 PM, Fred J. McCall a écrit :
Alain Fournier wrote:

Le Sep/1/2017 Ã* 11:19 PM, Fred J. McCall a écrit :
Alain Fournier wrote:

On Aug/31/2017 at 9:13 PM, Fred J. McCall wrote :
Alain Fournier wrote:

On Aug/31/2017 at 1:24 PM, Fred J. McCall wrote :
Rob wrote:

Fred J McCall wrote:
Rob wrote:

Fred J McCall wrote:
OK, you're adamantly ignorant. Your choice. Again, given global
warming, why do we not have constantly increasing storm power and
frequency (because we don't, you know)?

Because global warming only means the AVERAGE temperature is going
up. The ACTUAL temperature, both locally and globally, varies around
that average and is not higher everywhere and always.

Everyone except Donald and you understands that.


In other words, like all GCC True Believers, the evidence only matters
when you say it does. If the AVERAGE temperature is going up, the
AVERAGE storm should be more severe and the AVERAGE number should be
going up. Why are neither of those two things true?


But they ARE true!


Hogwash! You are entitled to your own opinion but you are NOT
entitled to your own data.

https://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/top10.asp

Did you actually look at the site you cited?

Seasons with the most named storms, 1851 - Present
11 of 15 years given, or 73%, are in the past 25 years. By random
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the most hurricanes, 1851 - Present
5 out of 10 given, or 50%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the most major hurricanes, 1851 - Present
3 out of 8 given, or 38%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

Seasons with the highest Accumulated Cyclone Energy, 1851 - Present
4 out of 10 given, or 40%, are in the past 25 years. By random,
this should be about 15%.

That's all the info given on that site. All of it showing that
we now having more severe weather than in the past.


But it is not, as it should be if GCC is true and only water
temperature matters, monotonically increasing.

What are you talking about? I don't think I have ever seen anyone
anywhere claim that global warming is monotonic, nor anyone
saying only water temperature matters. There really no reason
whatsoever to think that hurricanes should increase monotonically.


Then you should pay closer attention because the contention that
frequency and severity of storms correlates only to water temperature
is what I've been arguing against right along. Perhaps you should
understand the positions being taken before you mix in?

Care to show who and when someone said that frequency and severity of
storms correlates *only* to water temperature? JF Mezei said on Aug 30
at 1:25 AM, that "So warmer oceans will result in more frequent extreme
weather events." He didn't say that there are no other causes for
extreme weather or that the increase of frequency in extreme weather
events will be monotonic. You pulled that out, because you needed a
straw man.


No, I don't care to show you. I'm disinclined to go wading back
through the thread just because you failed to pay attention. Go read
Rob's ****e, you lying ****wit, and stop molesting your straw man.

So if you don’t want to wade back through the thread I will help you a
little. Maybe you should pay attention yourself to what you have written
yourself.


Perhaps you should interest yourself in something other than your
constant carping and distortion.

I'm sorry if I have distorted what you have said. Maybe that's due to
the fact that I don't understand what your position is.

On Aug 31 at 9:46 AM, you wrote:
In other words, like all GCC True Believers, the evidence only matters
when you say it does. If the AVERAGE temperature is going up, the
AVERAGE storm should be more severe and the AVERAGE number should be
going up. Why are neither of those two things true?

Then on Aug 31 at 1:24 PM, you cited:
https://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/top10.asp
which seam to indicates that the average number of storms is going up,
and that the severity is going up.

So do you think that the average number of storms and severity is going
up or not?


Alain Fournier

JF Mezei wrote:

From:
http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/text/refresh.../042037.shtml?


The hurricane will be moving through an environment of low vertical
wind shear, a moist mid-level atmosphere, and increasing upper-ocean
heat content. These conditions favor intensification and the
intensity guidance continues to call for some additional
strengthening during the next couple of days.



Note the use of "upper-ocean heat content" as one of the drivers that to
make a hurricane stronger. (and it is the main driver to create a
weather system that becomes a hurricane).


Note the use of "upper-ocean heat content" as *ONE* of the drivers
that make a hurricane (and make it stronger).


Warmer ocean waters means stronger hurricanes, and also longer hurricane
seasons because ocean temperature takes longer to cool below the point
where weather systems cannot be strong enough to be hurricanes.


And yet the data doesn't really support that very well.


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn

Le 31/08/2017 Ã* 15:46, Fred J. McCall a écritÂ*:
In other words, like all GCC True Believers, the evidence only matters
when you say it does. If the AVERAGE temperature is going up, the
AVERAGE storm should be more severe and the AVERAGE number should be
going up. Why are neither of those two things true?

Categorie 5 Hurricane Irma will hit the U.S. this week-end. It is the
strongest hurricane since 10 years, with sustained gusts of 180 miles
per hour (289 Km/h) at the center.

There is no blinder person as the man who doesn't want to see.

And no, I will not pray for the U.S.

Who would I pray to?

To the same that is sending them one blow after the other?

If it enters the Gulf it wil devastate a zone already hit very hard. And
if it goes to New York, as some meteorologists were predicting, it would
be horrible for New Yorkers and would devastate a second big city.

Hurricane season is just starting.

jacob navia wrote:

Le 31/08/2017 à 15:46, Fred J. McCall a écrit*:
In other words, like all GCC True Believers, the evidence only matters
when you say it does. If the AVERAGE temperature is going up, the
AVERAGE storm should be more severe and the AVERAGE number should be
going up. Why are neither of those two things true?

Categorie 5 Hurricane Irma will hit the U.S. this week-end. It is the
strongest hurricane since 10 years, with sustained gusts of 180 miles
per hour (289 Km/h) at the center.

There is no blinder person as the man who doesn't want to see.


So why the 10 year gap between 'strongest storm' given continual
global warming? Speaking of 'blinder' and all...


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn

JF Mezei wrote:

On 2017-09-05 15:24, jacob navia wrote:

Categorie 5 Hurricane Irma will hit the U.S. this week-end. It is the
strongest hurricane since 10 years, with sustained gusts of 180 miles
per hour (289 Km/h) at the center.

NHC just announced that its is now the strongest Atlantic hurricane on
record. (and as it moves into warmer caribeen, could get even stronger).

The problem with climate deniers is that they insist on seeing events as
isolated events, refuse to notice that weather is becoming a more and
more frequent cause for damage around the world.


Refuse to notice things that didn't happen.


Climate specialists have been warning for decades now that warmer oceans
will cause mroe hurricanes and stronger ones.


Yes, they have been warning for years and years and it didn't happen
and it didn't happen and it didn't happen.


And when it happens, the
climate deniers still refuse to accept the reality.


A couple storms in one year isn't 'climate'.


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn

On Wednesday, September 6, 2017 at 12:59:01 AM UTC-4, Fred J. McCall wrote:
JF Mezei wrote:

On 2017-09-05 15:24, jacob navia wrote:

Categorie 5 Hurricane Irma will hit the U.S. this week-end. It is the
strongest hurricane since 10 years, with sustained gusts of 180 miles
per hour (289 Km/h) at the center.

NHC just announced that its is now the strongest Atlantic hurricane on
record. (and as it moves into warmer caribeen, could get even stronger).

The problem with climate deniers is that they insist on seeing events as
isolated events, refuse to notice that weather is becoming a more and
more frequent cause for damage around the world.


Refuse to notice things that didn't happen.


Climate specialists have been warning for decades now that warmer oceans
will cause mroe hurricanes and stronger ones.


Yes, they have been warning for years and years and it didn't happen
and it didn't happen and it didn't happen.


And when it happens, the
climate deniers still refuse to accept the reality.


A couple storms in one year isn't 'climate'.

Global warmists are like a broken record, their needle is stuck,
"click, click, click, click ..."

wrote:
So do you think that the average number of storms and severity is going
up or not?

Think? Do you think he can think?