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USA Needs Glasses



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 5th 03, 08:18 PM
BobZ
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Default USA Needs Glasses

I'm sure some of you get a daily update from www.space.com, or maybe a
lot of you do. I just finished reading a comment piece that strikes a
chord, really blew me away.

COMMENTARY: NASA Has a Vision, It's Our Nation That Needs Glasses
http://www.space.com/news/commentary_vision_030904.html

This is the first I have ever heard that NASA was working a plan to a
manned Mars mission even without the rest of the country.

Check it out, now where can we find a Goverment that will "put up or
shut up"

Bob Zeoli
  #2  
Old September 5th 03, 09:57 PM
Rod Mollise
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Default USA Needs Glasses


This is the first I have ever heard that NASA was working a plan to a
manned Mars mission even without the rest of the country.


Hi:

Oh, yeah. NASA has a vision alright. When they think the public requires it,
they and the politicians trot it out, conveniently never with hard numbers or
dates. When its work is done, it's quickly forgotten, I'm afraid. If they were
really serious, Robert Zubrin would be NASA Administrator right now instead
of...uh..."what's his name." ;-)

Peace,
Rod Mollise
Author of _Choosing and Using a Schmidt Cassegrain Telescope_
Like SCTs and MCTs?
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Goto http://members.aol.com/RMOLLISE/index.html
  #3  
Old September 6th 03, 03:24 PM
Rod Mollise
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Default USA Needs Glasses

Allow me to offer another perspective on why the USA will not be funding a
Mars mission any time soon:

We are broke.


Hi:

Well, there is THAT! :-) But that can be dealt with. My point is that even when
the deficits come down (assuming), we STILL will not go. It will _always_ be
something. Breakdown the Federal spending and the WASTE. There is PLENTY of
money to finance a Mars mission without cutting elsewhere. But we won't. ;-)



Peace,
Rod Mollise
Author of _Choosing and Using a Schmidt Cassegrain Telescope_
Like SCTs and MCTs?
Check-out sct-user, the mailing list for CAT fanciers!
Goto http://members.aol.com/RMOLLISE/index.html
  #4  
Old September 6th 03, 04:44 PM
Richard DeLuca
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Default USA Needs Glasses

In article t,
"Bill G." wrote:

Hi, Rod,

I do not mean to be disagreeable, but I think it is a mistake to think we
can find the huge sums needed for a Mars mission if we merely cut out
government waste. What waste? Where? It is difficult to find "waste" in
large amounts in identifiable places in government budgets. One man's
"waste" is another man's public water system.

Nationally and locally, our citizens already feel overtaxed, yet our
national and local governments find that they do not have the resources to
do what they want and need to do. The Bush Administration's answer to every
problem is to cut taxes, and, guess what, we now have horrendous budget
deficits and will for many years to come. Don't kid yourself that we will
not. We have huge and costly financial obligations looming.

The truth is that no one in government has figured out yet how we are going
to pay for these costly financial obligations. The Bush Administration's
answer is to borrow huge amounts and spend. We can do that for a while, but
we know that we are saddling our children with an ever-increasing national
debt.

Shall we borrow still more money to go to Mars?



Bill,

We don't just 'feel' we're overtaxed- we ARE overtaxed. As a person who
ran his own small business for 18 years, and had to deal with government
daily, I saw plenty of waste, on all levels. I'd list them for you, but
I'd get too depressed.

I also worked for two not-for-profits for another 20 years, and the
amounts of government money that I saw wasted in at least one of them
would make you angry. And look at the incredible entitlement programs
for our senators and congressmen.

I heard both Gebhardt and Dean say in the debate the other night that
they could completely fund a national health care program by reversing
Bush's tax cuts. Do you believe them?

Unlike the rest of us, government doesn't have to live within any
budgets. It doesn't matter who's president. Running short of money?
Just increase taxes, especially on those who are proven money-makers.
Still short? Well then, hit the working poor and social service
recipients with more cigarette taxes and lotteries. Boy, don't get me
started on state lotteries! Oh, and it will help if you encourage class
envy. And have you ever looked at the taxes in your phone bill,
electric and gas bills lately? Up and up.

Then when you have all the money you need for awhile, just spend it
recklessly. What the hay, you can always get more.

I know, I'm a cynic......shrug

Starry Skies Anyway,
Rich
  #5  
Old September 6th 03, 07:41 PM
Starlord
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Default USA Needs Glasses

There's lots of waste, it's called PORK, and I have seen first hand the biggest
PORK getter that lived, he is from Hawaii and has dreamed up such projects as
the H-3 freeway that starts near Peral Harbor and ends on the otherside of the
island near the MC base over there, they already had two major ways over the
hills to the other side and this one, with it's two major tunnels cost something
in the area of 100 BILLION to build something that starts no place and ends no
place. Now while that in itself wouldn't pay the NASA bill, it would have at
lest started. Just take a real good look at the PORK spending that gets attached
to other bills and gets passed without debates, such things as a $5 million
study to see if snails could live in the desert. I don't mean worthwhile
projects, but the shear number and amount of PORK spending each and every year
could go a long ways to getting our space program back onto the launch pad.


--
"In this universe the night was falling,the shadows were lengthening
towards an east that would not know another dawn.
But elsewhere the stars were still young and the light of morning
lingered: and along the path he once had followed, man would one day go
again."

Arthur C. Clarke, The City & The Stars

SIAR
www.starlords.org
Bishop's Car Fund
http://www.bishopcarfund.Netfirms.com/
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http://www.freelancewrittersshop.netfirms.com
Telescope Buyers FAQ
http://home.inreach.com/starlord

"Bill G." wrote in message
k.net...
Hi, Rod,

I do not mean to be disagreeable, but I think it is a mistake to think we
can find the huge sums needed for a Mars mission if we merely cut out
government waste. What waste? Where? It is difficult to find "waste" in
large amounts in identifiable places in government budgets. One man's
"waste" is another man's public water system.

Nationally and locally, our citizens already feel overtaxed, yet our
national and local governments find that they do not have the resources to
do what they want and need to do. The Bush Administration's answer to every
problem is to cut taxes, and, guess what, we now have horrendous budget
deficits and will for many years to come. Don't kid yourself that we will
not. We have huge and costly financial obligations looming.

The truth is that no one in government has figured out yet how we are going
to pay for these costly financial obligations. The Bush Administration's
answer is to borrow huge amounts and spend. We can do that for a while, but
we know that we are saddling our children with an ever-increasing national
debt.

Shall we borrow still more money to go to Mars?

Bill G.

Hi:

Well, there is THAT! :-) But that can be dealt with. My point is that even

when
the deficits come down (assuming), we STILL will not go. It will _always_

be
something. Breakdown the Federal spending and the WASTE. There is PLENTY

of
money to finance a Mars mission without cutting elsewhere. But we won't.

;-)



Peace,
Rod Mollise
Author of _Choosing and Using a Schmidt Cassegrain Telescope_
Like SCTs and MCTs?
Check-out sct-user, the mailing list for CAT fanciers!
Goto http://members.aol.com/RMOLLISE/index.html





  #6  
Old September 6th 03, 10:05 PM
Rod Mollise
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Default USA Needs Glasses


Shall we borrow still more money to go to Mars?

Bill G.


Hi Bill:

Sure, if necessary.

And, you know, it wasn't the Apollo Program that broke the bank, but 'Nam.
Also, NASA tends to put a price tag on a Mars program that is WAY too high.
Why? Don't ask me, since that's the opposite of their usual approach. Frankly,
many of the folks there, in management, anyway, seem scared of a Mars program.

I believe that it is important enough for our grandchildren and great
grandchildren that we do this thing that we need to do WHATEVER is necessary to
do it. I'm willing to sacrifice a SuperSized Mickey D's meal a week to do it.
That's what _I_ think. You or other folks may differ, and that's fine. I
understand that many, if not most, folks don't put the priority on Mars I do.
That's THEIR problem! :-) As I mentioned earlier, I would guess that your view
will win out, and that we will not go to Mars any time soon, if ever. But that
does not mean I have to like it!

Will you do me a favor? If you haven't done so, get a copy of Rober Zubrin's
_The Case for Mars_ and read it from cover to cover? Then email me and let's
talk... ;-)


Peace,
Rod Mollise
Author of _Choosing and Using a Schmidt Cassegrain Telescope_
Like SCTs and MCTs?
Check-out sct-user, the mailing list for CAT fanciers!
Goto http://members.aol.com/RMOLLISE/index.html
  #8  
Old September 7th 03, 01:46 AM
Steve Hix
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Default USA Needs Glasses

In article ,
Mick wrote:

On 06 Sep 2003 14:01:10 GMT, (Rod Mollise) wrote:

There is NOWAY humanity could have made it to Mars without doing the work
necessary to find out how humans adapt to long space voyages...I'm not
convinced we still know what such a voyage really means inspite of the
mountain of money spent and space flight and information gained to
date..stop whining all you "got to Mars" freaks...good things come to those
who do it right...


Hi:

The _evidence_ is that we _do_ know enough about humans and long duration
spaceflight. More than enough. And we also do have the technology to do it.
Have had it.

We will NOT, however, be going to Mars any time soon (the United States,
that
is), if EVER. Nor back to the Moon.

Why? We lack the guts. Let me repeat that: We as a nation lack the G-U-T-S.

That is, the _will_ as a nation to make even the slightest sacrifices to do
great things. Unfortunately, I don't see that changing any time soon. We'll
sit
and think up excuses for not going until the Sun has set on us as a nation,
as
it inevitably will in the great scheme of things, and we no longer have the
_ability_ to go. Maybe someone else will, but NASA will not, I'm convinced
of
that. If it's not "we don't know enough about humans and long duration
spaceflight," it will be the good, old "we need to use the money on Earth
for
x, y or z."

I wonder where we'd be if a quarter of the money frittered away on LBJ's
Great
Society had been spent on a Moon/Mars exploration program?

Ain't happening, folks. I'd like to be proven wrong, but the "progress" of
the
U.S. manned spaceflight program over the last 30 years points to me being
right.



We aren't going to Mars until nuclear propulsion is a reality. The US
should be leading the way in this and get a functional nuclear rocket
going before the decade is out...


As an engineering exercise, quite doable; as a political issue, probably
impossible.
  #9  
Old September 7th 03, 01:55 AM
Rod Mollise
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Default USA Needs Glasses

As an engineering exercise, quite doable; as a political issue, probably
impossible.


Hi:

I'll give you that it's politically impossible, but I don't think of it merely
as an "engineering exercise"...more like..."a way to preserve the human race."

Peace,
Rod Mollise
Author of _Choosing and Using a Schmidt Cassegrain Telescope_
Like SCTs and MCTs?
Check-out sct-user, the mailing list for CAT fanciers!
Goto http://members.aol.com/RMOLLISE/index.html
  #10  
Old September 7th 03, 10:11 AM
Mr. Mick
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Default USA Needs Glasses



Hi:

I'll give you that it's politically impossible, but I don't think of it

merely
as an "engineering exercise"...more like..."a way to preserve the human

race."



Rod Mollise needs SUN GLASSES!!


 




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