MSNBC (Oberg) -- NASA addresses fears about space fire hazard

Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!) wrote:
You're missing the point that both of these are inert gases, O2 is not,
then add the effects of adiabatic compression. Loud isn't the issue.


It's going to come out of that nozzle so fast, and so cold, that you
might freeze your ever-lovin' balls off if they are in the way.
This is a case of a "blow job" and "blue balls" that no guy needs. ;-)

Pat

"Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!)" wrote:

On Thu, 31 May 2007 04:25:39 GMT, in sci.space.policy
(Derek Lyons) wrote:

Pat Flannery wrote:

Derek Lyons wrote:
Not to mention "the valve will now be opened slowly to prevent a sharp
pressure/velocity rise". Huh? That's a *basic* safety precaution for
working with pressurized gases. If first learned it thirty years ago
working in a bicycle shop! Where has NASA been?


Did you ever crank open a 3000 psi helium tank without a regulator on it?
Boy, now that's loud! :-)

No, but we did once vent the 3200psi N2 system via the tube
pressurization system and an empty missile tube. Think "really big
pipe organ". This resulted in a stern warning from Squadron to use
the Authorized Procedure, which was much quieter and much less fun.

You're missing the point that both of these are inert gases, O2 is not,
then add the effects of adiabatic compression. Loud isn't the issue.

Reading comprehension, get some. Then read my first paragraph (which
you even quoted).

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

On May 30, 3:41 pm, (Derek Lyons) wrote:
"Jim Oberg" wrote:
NASA's response illustrates how seriously the space agency is taking
safety concerns in the wake of the 2003 Columbia tragedy - which led to the
loss of the shuttle and its crew, and raised alarms about a "broken safety
culture."

When you have to brag about how safe you are - your safety culture is
_still_ broken.


George Bush does just the opposite WRT terrorist attacks. Does that
mean we are actually safe from them?


Not to mention "the valve will now be opened slowly to prevent a sharp
pressure/velocity rise". Huh? That's a *basic* safety precaution for
working with pressurized gases. If first learned it thirty years ago
working in a bicycle shop! Where has NASA been?


What better way to comment on a procedural oversight than by declaring
victory for avoiding a safety hazard.

Eric

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

"Derek Lyons" wrote in message
...
Pat Flannery wrote:

Derek Lyons wrote:
Not to mention "the valve will now be opened slowly to prevent a sharp
pressure/velocity rise". Huh? That's a *basic* safety precaution for
working with pressurized gases. If first learned it thirty years ago
working in a bicycle shop! Where has NASA been?


Did you ever crank open a 3000 psi helium tank without a regulator on it?
Boy, now that's loud! :-)

No, but we did once vent the 3200psi N2 system via the tube
pressurization system and an empty missile tube. Think "really big
pipe organ". This resulted in a stern warning from Squadron to use
the Authorized Procedure, which was much quieter and much less fun.


So, I've got to ask. How many octaves below middle C was it?

(And now I'm reminded of an old sci-fi story where the character's father
"plays" the vents on Mons Olympus on Mars.)

Of course now if something had gone wrong and you'd broken the boat, some
NASA engineer could talk about the irresponsible Navy safety culture. 1/2
:-)


D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL


--
Greg Moore
SQL Server DBA Consulting Remote and Onsite available!
Email: sql (at) greenms.com http://www.greenms.com/sqlserver.html

"Greg D. Moore \(Strider\)" wrote:

"Derek Lyons" wrote in message
...
Pat Flannery wrote:

Derek Lyons wrote:
Not to mention "the valve will now be opened slowly to prevent a sharp
pressure/velocity rise". Huh? That's a *basic* safety precaution for
working with pressurized gases. If first learned it thirty years ago
working in a bicycle shop! Where has NASA been?


Did you ever crank open a 3000 psi helium tank without a regulator on it?
Boy, now that's loud! :-)

No, but we did once vent the 3200psi N2 system via the tube
pressurization system and an empty missile tube. Think "really big
pipe organ". This resulted in a stern warning from Squadron to use
the Authorized Procedure, which was much quieter and much less fun.


So, I've got to ask. How many octaves below middle C was it?

Dammifino. It's not like we measured!

(And now I'm reminded of an old sci-fi story where the character's father
"plays" the vents on Mons Olympus on Mars.)

Of course now if something had gone wrong and you'd broken the boat, some
NASA engineer could talk about the irresponsible Navy safety culture. 1/2
:-)

LOL!

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

(Derek Lyons) wrote:

:"Greg D. Moore \(Strider\)" wrote:
:
:"Derek Lyons" wrote in message
...
: Pat Flannery wrote:
:
:Derek Lyons wrote:
: Not to mention "the valve will now be opened slowly to prevent a sharp
: pressure/velocity rise". Huh? That's a *basic* safety precaution for
: working with pressurized gases. If first learned it thirty years ago
: working in a bicycle shop! Where has NASA been?
:
:
:Did you ever crank open a 3000 psi helium tank without a regulator on it?
:Boy, now that's loud! :-)
:
: No, but we did once vent the 3200psi N2 system via the tube
: pressurization system and an empty missile tube. Think "really big
: pipe organ". This resulted in a stern warning from Squadron to use
: the Authorized Procedure, which was much quieter and much less fun.
:
:
:So, I've got to ask. How many octaves below middle C was it?
:
ammifino. It's not like we measured!
:

I bet the Sonar Gang did...


--
"Oooo, scary! Y'know, there are a lot scarier things
in the world than you ... and I'm one of them."

-- Buffy the vampire

"Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!)" wrote:

:
:Ever the wi still, eh?. And folks wonder why usenet id dead/dying. Never
:saw anything associated with an extreme temperature rise mentioned. That
:is the major problem with a large adiabatic compression in an O2 system.
:The temperature rise leads to widening flammability limits of any
:contaminant in the system as well as a reduction in the minimum required
:energy for ignition or transition to spontaneous ignition.
:

Which "large adiabatic compression" would that be, Ed? I would expect
pressure to be going the OTHER way when you're talking about an O2
line like that. The stuff starts out compressed and is going to LOWER
pressures as it exits the line...


--
"It's always different. It's always complex. But at some point,
somebody has to draw the line. And that somebody is always me....
I am the law."
-- Buffy, The Vampire Slayer

"Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!)" wrote:

On Thu, 31 May 2007 15:48:26 GMT, in sci.space.policy
(Derek Lyons) wrote:

"Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!)" wrote:

On Thu, 31 May 2007 04:25:39 GMT, in sci.space.policy
(Derek Lyons) wrote:

Pat Flannery wrote:

Derek Lyons wrote:
Not to mention "the valve will now be opened slowly to prevent a sharp
pressure/velocity rise". Huh? That's a *basic* safety precaution for
working with pressurized gases. If first learned it thirty years ago
working in a bicycle shop! Where has NASA been?


Did you ever crank open a 3000 psi helium tank without a regulator on it?
Boy, now that's loud! :-)

No, but we did once vent the 3200psi N2 system via the tube
pressurization system and an empty missile tube. Think "really big
pipe organ". This resulted in a stern warning from Squadron to use
the Authorized Procedure, which was much quieter and much less fun.

You're missing the point that both of these are inert gases, O2 is not,
then add the effects of adiabatic compression. Loud isn't the issue.

Reading comprehension, get some. Then read my first paragraph (which
you even quoted).

Ever the wi still, eh?.

Nope. Ever the person who points out to individuals their ignorance.

Never saw anything associated with an extreme temperature rise mentioned.

Reading comprehension, get some. Then read my first paragraph (which
you even quoted).

Here's a clue for you since you not only lack one, you are working
very hard to avoid obtaining one: Just what the **** do you think the
basic safety precation I mention in the first paragraph is meant to
deal with? I even _explicitly_ adress pressure and temperature rises.

Learn to ****ing read.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

Fred J. McCall wrote:
Which "large adiabatic compression" would that be, Ed? I would expect
pressure to be going the OTHER way when you're talking about an O2
line like that. The stuff starts out compressed and is going to LOWER
pressures as it exits the line...


It may be "cooling" on the source O2, but the destination tank will get
warm as its pressure rises.

If the regulator is before the line to the destination tank, then the
pressure inside the line will (eventually) follow that of the tank and
rise as the pressure rises in the tank and that means the line would be
warm.

"Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!)" wrote:

On Fri, 01 Jun 2007 20:27:00 GMT, in sci.space.policy
(Derek Lyons) wrote:


Here's a clue for you since you not only lack one, you are working
very hard to avoid obtaining one: Just what the **** do you think the
basic safety precation I mention in the first paragraph is meant to
deal with? I even _explicitly_ adress pressure and temperature rises.

Learn to ****ing read.

Here's the whole OP:

When you have to brag about how safe you are - your safety culture is
_still_ broken.

Not to mention "the valve will now be opened slowly to prevent a sharp
pressure/velocity rise". Huh? That's a *basic* safety precaution for
working with pressurized gases. If first learned it thirty years ago
working in a bicycle shop! Where has NASA been?

D.

Where is temperature specifically mentioned?

Just what do you think is the result of the pressure/velocity rise?
have you never heard of the Diesel effect?

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL