Why Tolerate this Newsgroup?

Chris,

I do not expose my email address because I do not want to use a spam filter.
No matter how good the spam filter, there are times that an important
message will wind up in your bulk or spam email directory and therefore it
is necessary to constantly monitor the spam directory for messages that
should not have been flagged as spam. I have chastised my friends regarding
sending my email address in the "clear" and have taught them to use the BCC
field for all emails that are sent to a list. It is a jungle out there and
it is important to protect your email address.

Best Regards,

-mij



"Chris L Peterson" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 17:08:38 -0700, "Mij Adyaw"
wrote:

I advocate posting using a real email address, however I personally
would never use a real email address because of all of the software bots
that crawl Usenet collecting email addressed to sell to spammers. Many
years
ago, I posted to this newsgroup using a real email address and within
several months my email address was ruined with spam. I was receiving over
100 spam emails per day...

I've been posting here since 1997 or so, and every post has contained my
real email address (the same one all that time). I have a few other
addresses I use for things that I think might attract spam. I don't see
any more garbage coming to my main address than to the others. Spam
filters are good enough to strip away the bulk of the junk and leave a
manageable (albeit still somewhat annoying) amount.

These days, there are so many ways of harvesting addresses that it
hardly seems worthwhile to worry about it. If you actually use your
address, it is only a matter of time before it is harvested (perhaps
from something as simple as a clueless friend who sends out some stupid
email joke to everyone in his address book- including you- and doesn't
know what the BCC field is for).

I have many Internet friends I have met through this group. Personally,
I don't choose to make it difficult for future ones by using a fake or
obfuscated address.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

There are many e-mail Astronomy lists, I run some myself, but over all, they
get far less postings than the newsgroup. For those of us who have been here
a good long time, we know how to use our killfiles and message rules to keep
90% of the main trolls off our screens.

As far as names go, I've used the "Starlord" handle for a long time, even
before computers where used by so many people I used that handle in storys.

As for address, mine IS a good one, it's not mugged at all, BUT the outfit
does a good job of blocking spam from reaching me, as the address colleting
bots just grab it and use it. I also have seen collectors log onto a group,
check the membership list and log off with a copy of the list. That is why
on my lists, only myself can see the membership lists.

I think it'll stay about the same, as 98% of new computer users don't know
what a newsgroup is nor how to even find them, they go for the web and maybe
some lists via yahoo or others.

If you think this one gets a lot of trolls, then you've never been on
alt.astronomy, whew, that one get's not only trolls but other crud by the
solar tons. But I watch it for the lone posting that comes up at times that
I can reply to and help someone out.

To add to all of the above, while I've not met most of them face to face,
there's some good users here that I trade pstings with.


"Mij Adyaw" wrote in message
news:eWebe.82300$A31.9856@fed1read03...
I would like to respectfully ask why so many of you tolerate this
newsgroup. It seems to be full of trolls and other types of folks that get
their jollies by antagonizing other members of the group. There are some
very knowledgeable members of this group and I have learned much from being
a member of this group.

Using this webby box, it's impossible for me to disguise my email addy.
It sits at the top of everything I post in several groups I frequent.
However, I don't find myself inundated with spam. I get maybe 20 a
day... mostly unintelligible stuff from some asian source, a few
"financial" things, a few porno ads, and the occasional Nigerian scam.
I delete 'em all without opening 'em, and they're gone.
I don't have killfiles either. I just don't read stuff I don't
want to read.
Good people in here.
Marty

Jan Owen wrote
While that may well be true for thee and me, newbies often have NO clue as
to what's on the up and up, and what's a troll, and may be totally misled
on their single exposure to this medium.

The problem, as I see it, is that NO one wants to be responsible for
anything anymore. They mostly just want to feed their sick egos. They
think they have the right to post anything they want, if it will stroke
their ego by getting responses. But the new folks, who honestly need help
can never tell when they are getting it, or are being taken advantage of
by a troll, or a SEE ME type, hiding behind an alias, and a fake e-mail
address. This lack of accountability is what is destroying SAA. Simple
as that. Well, certainly the dumbing down of America has helped, but the
primary problem is in the former...

--
Jan Owen

With respect, I feel your post suggests you have lost some perspective.
As a learner/lurker, I have had to learn how usenet works and how to
recognise bogus posts. I have worked out how to assess who is a helpful
informative poster and who isn't (I have you down as the former BTW).
I've learnt a lot about astronomy from many people here on SAA.
I've posted the odd piece of crap and tried to be helpful, and learnt
that trying to be helpful is far more gratifying.
Newbies learn quickly that un-moderated groups are anarchic and
moderated groups can sometimes have despotic moderators.
Through all this I think they also learn very quickly that all they need
is for the good guys to keep doing what they do, and ignore the
trolls/flakes/loons/egomaniacs/pseudo-intellectuals etc.
Sometimes a well educated newbie comes along who can contribute
meaningfully, which strengthens the group. All it takes for SAA and any
other un-moderated group to survive is for the good guys to be
relentless.
Don't worry too much about newbies, if they're really interested in
astronomy, it's likely they've got the brains to see through the trolls.

The most damage to a newsgroup is done by those who have forgotten that
this is a true anarchy, and, believing that they have some kind of
seniority, seek to lay down the law as they see it. You can only invite
people to stick to the charter, and if they don't, the only effective
remedy in the long run is to ignore/killfile them.


Denis
--
DT
change nospam: n o s p a m
v a l l e ys

X-No-archive: yes
Mij Adyaw wrote:
It is a jungle out there and it is important to protect your email
address.
Mij Adyaw also wrote:
Have you ever considered moving this forum (essentially all of the
good
folks in this forum) to another location such as groups on Astromart
or some
other location where folks will have to post using their real names
and real
email addresses?

I agree wholeheartedly with your feelings in principle except for the
following regarding the real-id solution to the universal net problem
of trolls and persons with mental health problems. In today's
hyper-information society, it is simply too easy for prospective and/or
current employers to drop a real name into a search engine and start
scanning the net life of individuals going back for a decade. The
Astromart solution does not guard against that economic misuse of the
internet. With its other site policies, Astromart does address the
other major net problem - unscrupulous hyper-marketeers who use real
name email addresses to bombard personal-use email accounts.

The use of anonymous email addresses is a necessary part of maintaining
some reasonable level of personal privacy in the modern information
society. It does come with costs - evident in this newsgroup. I would
prefer to post with a real identity, I just don't feel that it is
realistic in the current U.S. labor market.

"Marty" wrote in message
...
Using this webby box, it's impossible for me to disguise my email addy.
It sits at the top of everything I post in several groups I frequent.
However, I don't find myself inundated with spam. I get maybe 20 a
day... mostly unintelligible stuff from some asian source, a few
"financial" things, a few porno ads, and the occasional Nigerian scam.
I delete 'em all without opening 'em, and they're gone.
I don't have killfiles either. I just don't read stuff I don't
want to read.
Good people in here.
Marty


What Marty fails to mention here is that if you cross HIM, you will live
out the rest of your life in DARKNESS...

{;^)
--
Jan Owen

To reach me directly, remove the Z, if one appears in my e-mail address...
Latitude: 33.662
Longitude: -112.3272

"Mij Adyaw" wrote in message
news:Odgbe.83359$A31.39486@fed1read03...
Chris,

I do not expose my email address because I do not want to use a spam
filter. No matter how good the spam filter, there are times that an
important message will wind up in your bulk or spam email directory and
therefore it is necessary to constantly monitor the spam directory for
messages that should not have been flagged as spam. I have chastised my
friends regarding sending my email address in the "clear" and have taught
them to use the BCC field for all emails that are sent to a list. It is a
jungle out there and it is important to protect your email address.

Best Regards,

-mij



I'd bet a years salary your name is NOT Mij Adyaw. I have been in and out of
here for quite some time
and I have never seen that name until now. Truth be told, YOU are some kind
of freaked out troll or lurker.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 03:11:12 GMT, Mike wrote:

"Mij Adyaw" wrote in message
news:Odgbe.83359$A31.39486@fed1read03...
Chris,

I do not expose my email address because I do not want to use a spam
filter. No matter how good the spam filter, there are times that an
important message will wind up in your bulk or spam email directory and
therefore it is necessary to constantly monitor the spam directory for
messages that should not have been flagged as spam. I have chastised my
friends regarding sending my email address in the "clear" and have taught
them to use the BCC field for all emails that are sent to a list. It is a
jungle out there and it is important to protect your email address.

Best Regards,

-mij



I'd bet a years salary your name is NOT Mij Adyaw. I have been in and out of
here for quite some time
and I have never seen that name until now. Truth be told, YOU are some kind
of freaked out troll or lurker.



Just a thought here. . ."Mij" backwards is "Jim" and "Adyaw" backwards is
"Wayda." Hmmmmmmm. . . .Jim Wayda?



--
Martin R. Howell
"Photographs From the Universe of Amateur Astronomy"
http://members.isp.com/universeofama...nomy%40isp.com

"Martin R. Howell" wrote

Just a thought here. . ."Mij" backwards is "Jim" and "Adyaw" backwards is
"Wayda." Hmmmmmmm. . . .Jim Wayda?

By George, I think he's GOT it!!

On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 03:11:12 GMT, "Mike" wrote:

I'd bet a years salary your name is NOT Mij Adyaw. I have been in and out of
here for quite some time
and I have never seen that name until now. Truth be told, YOU are some kind
of freaked out troll or lurker.

He's posted here at least since last year, and on sci.astro for longer.
Sometimes as Mij Adyaw, sometimes as Jim Wayda (the name that shows up
in moderated places, like Astromart). The name obfuscation isn't very
subtle. So he isn't just a lurker, and his past posts have been more or
less on topic.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com