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#21
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BFR early next year.
JF Mezei wrote on Wed, 14 Mar 2018
03:42:22 -0400: On 2018-03-13 18:40, Jeff Findley wrote: They built a full scale composite tank and pressure tested it to destruction a couple years ago. http://www.businessinsider.com/space...nk-ocean-ship- test-2016-11 But correct to state that the destructive test was only a few months ago? I seem to recal some tank video that was much more recent than 2016. True. Regular pressure tests were done at the end of 2016. The destructive test was about a year later. The prototypes had better be close to BFR/BFS in many ways, or it wouldn't be very useful would it? Depends on the goal of that test flight. It could very well be that a real BFS ship is ready to be built with the structural aspects all done, but will go without payload (the crew compartment) Uh, the 'crew compartment' isn't payload. It's structure. On the other hand, there maty be PR/marketing pressres to have a flight early, at which point engineers are told to focus on engines/tanks and just build a epty shell around iot that looks like BFS. (the real structsures/shell can be designed/built later). I don't think Musk will want to spend millions and millions of dollars on a worthless test. Or, we could see naked engines/tanks go up and down. It really depends on how far they are in the design. You don't set a test and then say, "And we'll conduct it with whatever we can get together by then." You really don't know **** about how engineering development works, do you? -- "Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong." -- Thomas Jefferson |
#22
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BFR early next year.
JF Mezei wrote on Wed, 14 Mar 2018
18:26:19 -0400: It will probably fly without the vacuum engines or a heat shield, If those engines are mounted next to each other, wouldn't a test require that there would at least be mockup vacuum engines mounted to ensure that their bells don't interfere with the sea level engines ? If that was a concern (and I'm not sure why you wouldn't figure that out in ground testing), all you need are the bells. It's the engines that are heavy, not the expansion bells. -- "Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar territory." --G. Behn |
#23
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BFR early next year.
JF Mezei wrote on Wed, 14 Mar 2018
18:42:42 -0400: On 2018-03-14 15:10, Fred J. McCall wrote: You don't set a test and then say, "And we'll conduct it with whatever we can get together by then." You really don't know **** about how engineering development works, do you? If you really think that Musk can design the BFS with all structures inside in a couple of years and have a test this soon, you are overly optimistic. MUSK tends to be optimistic. Again, you don't set a date for the test and then just fly with whatever the **** you have at that point. Expect the test to move right. Consider also that Musk like good PR stunts. And launching something that looks like BFS this early is also a great PR stunt against NASA's SLS. BFR Spaceship doesn't compete with SLS. Falcon Heavy (or Falcon Super Heavy) competes with SLS. Note: SpaceX spent more time on Dragon 2 than on BFS, and it still isn't flying. To think that SpaceX has already designed a 100 pax ship is ludicrous. To think that they're going to blow hundreds of millions of dollars on a publicity stunt is even more ludicrous. -- "Ordinarily he is insane. But he has lucid moments when he is only stupid." -- Heinrich Heine |
#24
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BFR early next year.
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#25
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BFR early next year.
JF Mezei wrote on Thu, 15 Mar 2018
01:57:12 -0400: On 2018-03-14 19:09, Fred J. McCall wrote: If that was a concern (and I'm not sure why you wouldn't figure that out in ground testing), all you need are the bells. It's the engines that are heavy, not the expansion bells. What are the major differences between a sea level Raptor and a vaccum Raptor? Wouldn't the differences be focused on the shape of the bell? Correct, which is why if interference of 'space engines' with 'sea level' engines is a concern (and I can't imagine why it would be) you only need the bells and not the engines. -- "Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar territory." --G. Behn |
#26
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BFR early next year.
JF Mezei wrote on Thu, 15 Mar 2018
02:22:21 -0400: On 2018-03-14 19:12, Fred J. McCall wrote: To think that they're going to blow hundreds of millions of dollars on a publicity stunt is even more ludicrous. A test flight before SLS could mean a LOT to SpaceX if it means the USA Govt kills SLS and directs Mars subsidies to SpaceX instead of to the companies that get pork for SLS. Let me say it again, since it seems not to have registered the first time. BFR DOES NOT COMPETE WITH SLS. FALCON HEAVY DOES. With the mega military spending, I suspect ATK will get plenty to eat from military missile contracts instead of the life support from NASA to make a couple of boosters. So it becomes politically possible to redirect NASA's pork budget from ATK to SpaceX. Just what military programs (other than ICBMs) are using large segmented solid boosters? Also, by having an early first test launch, it really shows that SpaceX is more able to deliver than whoever is building SLS/Orion under NASA guidance. Let me say it again. BFR DOES NOT COMPETE WITH SLS. FALCON HEAVY DOES. So yes, I see plenty of reasons for Musk to push engineers to get "something* ready to fly, even if it is an empty shell inside. Once more. BFR DOES NOT COMPETE WITH SLS. FALCON HEAVY DOES. Are you getting it yet? -- "Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar territory." --G. Behn |
#27
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BFR early next year.
On 3/14/2018 6:24 AM, Jeff Findley wrote:
In article , lid says... (Gosh, perhaps the "Earth to Earth transport function" is to be taken seriously...) This is all very fluid right now, isn't it? Jeff Yes, but I would also take P2P transport very seriously. I suspect Elon is. Dave |
#28
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BFR early next year.
JF Mezei wrote on Thu, 15 Mar 2018
23:14:16 -0400: On 2018-03-15 07:16, Fred J. McCall wrote: Let me say it again, since it seems not to have registered the first time. BFR DOES NOT COMPETE WITH SLS. FALCON HEAVY DOES. At the marketing level, NASA pushes SLS/Orion as the spaceship to Mars. (we all know this isn't a Mars ship, but NASA pitches it as such in public aka: to politicians). Even Trump thinks SLS is going to Mars, And it may very well do so if NASA continues stupid. Musk announced BFR/BFS in a pitch for Mars colonisation, even setting target price of $200k per passenger to Mars. n nnnn Let me say it again. BFR DOES NOT COMPETE WITH SLS. FALCON HEAVY DOES. n It was pointed to me here very often that Falcon Heavy is just a transitional temporary project and that BFR will replace it. |
#29
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BFR early next year.
On 18-03-16 05:14 , JF Mezei wrote:
On 2018-03-15 07:16, Fred J. McCall wrote: ... Let me say it again. BFR DOES NOT COMPETE WITH SLS. FALCON HEAVY DOES. It was pointed to me here very often that Falcon Heavy is just a transitional temporary project and that BFR will replace it. I hope that SLS is also a transitional temporary project, and that BFR will replace it. In this ephemeral role, too, Falcon Heavy competes with SLS. -- Niklas Holsti Tidorum Ltd niklas holsti tidorum fi . @ . |
#30
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BFR early next year.
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