Laser lunacy

It seems that some folks are using green lasers for more than outlining
constellations:

http://www.kktv.com/home/headlines/1309846.html

http://asia.news.yahoo.com/041230/ap/d879nei00.html

Let's hope the words "amateur astronomer" don't pop up in any of these
stories.

On Wed, 29 Dec 2004 21:52:52 -0700, Tim Killian
wrote:

It seems that some folks are using green lasers for more than outlining
constellations:

http://www.kktv.com/home/headlines/1309846.html

http://asia.news.yahoo.com/041230/ap/d879nei00.html

Let's hope the words "amateur astronomer" don't pop up in any of these
stories.

I think anyone using a laser in this way should have a nice
five-year jail term, but is it possible to do what the second
article said? I guess the plane would have to be a distance away
from the laser'r in order for the beam to have entered the cockpit?
Another thing; Wouldn't the laser have to be mounted on some
kind of stable tracking device? The deviation due to body shake
(from someone holding it) from the distance claimed means that it
would be about impossible to hold it on target with any kind of
timeframe on the order of "seconds."
-Rich

FBI Probes Laser Beam Directed at Cockpit

Authorities are investigating a mysterious laser beam that was
directed into the cockpit of a commercial jet traveling at more than
8,500 feet.

The beam appeared Monday when the plane was about 15 miles from
Cleveland Hopkins International Airport, the FBI said.

"It was in there for several seconds like (the plane) was being
tracked," FBI agent Robert Hawk said.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=370312

If this keeps up, we will lose our right to use our lasers as
educational tools. Too bad.

I have never shined my laser at aircraft, having read the warnings
against doing so.

Matthew Ota

Tim Killian wrote:
It seems that some folks are using green lasers for more than outlining
constellations:

http://www.kktv.com/home/headlines/1309846.html

http://asia.news.yahoo.com/041230/ap/d879nei00.html

Let's hope the words "amateur astronomer" don't pop up in any of these
stories.

They are becoming the prefered toyof cell phone users (in cars)also!

Tim Killian wrote:

It seems that some folks are using green lasers for more than outlining
constellations:

http://www.kktv.com/home/headlines/1309846.html

http://asia.news.yahoo.com/041230/ap/d879nei00.html

Let's hope the words "amateur astronomer" don't pop up in any of these
stories.

On Thu, 30 Dec 2004 01:23:42 -0500, RichA wrote:

I think anyone using a laser in this way should have a nice
five-year jail term, but is it possible to do what the second
article said? I guess the plane would have to be a distance away
from the laser'r in order for the beam to have entered the cockpit?
Another thing; Wouldn't the laser have to be mounted on some
kind of stable tracking device? The deviation due to body shake
(from someone holding it) from the distance claimed means that it
would be about impossible to hold it on target with any kind of
timeframe on the order of "seconds."
-Rich

This is something that is impossible to do with a typical class 3b laser
pointer. As you note, there is no way to hold one still enough from several
thousand feet away, and it wouldn't be bright at that distance. A searchlight
hitting a plane would be brighter and more distracting (something that happens
regularly).

Supposedly, this happened again shortly after in Colorado Springs. Frankly, I'm
suspicious that there is an element of hysteria in all this. Lately the
Department of Homeland Security has been running around warning that terrorists
with lasers are a threat to airplanes, and suddenly you have three reports of
bright green lights, from different locations, with no physical evidence at all?
Hmmm....

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

Chris L Peterson wrote in message ...
On Thu, 30 Dec 2004 01:23:42 -0500, RichA wrote:

I think anyone using a laser in this way should have a nice
five-year jail term, but is it possible to do what the second
article said? I guess the plane would have to be a distance away
from the laser'r in order for the beam to have entered the cockpit?
Another thing; Wouldn't the laser have to be mounted on some
kind of stable tracking device? The deviation due to body shake
(from someone holding it) from the distance claimed means that it
would be about impossible to hold it on target with any kind of
timeframe on the order of "seconds."
-Rich

This is something that is impossible to do with a typical class 3b laser
pointer. As you note, there is no way to hold one still enough from several
thousand feet away, and it wouldn't be bright at that distance. A
searchlight
hitting a plane would be brighter and more distracting (something that
happens
regularly).

Supposedly, this happened again shortly after in Colorado Springs. Frankly,
I'm
suspicious that there is an element of hysteria in all this. Lately the
Department of Homeland Security has been running around warning that
terrorists
with lasers are a threat to airplanes, and suddenly you have three reports
of
bright green lights, from different locations, with no physical evidence at
all?
Hmmm....

_______________________________________________ __

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

no, there are other possible explanations beside mass hysteria:

1- alien invaders from Outer Space

2- someone with a very steady hand, nanoactuator implants, and a good
infrared target acquisition and tracking implant too

3- a star party below, all attendants using the newest Chinese lasers with
adjustable negative beam divergence to allow the beam to still be a small
spot thousands of feet away from the lasers .

4- a star party below , where everybody was trying to follow the airplane
with their goto mounts and laser pointers thinking it was the ISS due to
some software glitch.

5- none of the above

Seriously now, how did this legend and paranoia get started , that a low
power laser beam with known large beam divergence would be able to
illuminate in any significant way a distant moving target, without having
tracking capability ? Even a half Watt laser with the kind of divergence
these small pointers have would not pose any risk thousands of feet away for
anybody's vision .


best regards,
matt tudor
4-

Correction:

A Laser pointer 5mw is "Class-3A". A laser with a power output 5mw is
"Class-3B". Note that these Class-3B devices are "lasers" and not "laser
pointers".

-Mij


"Chris L Peterson" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 30 Dec 2004 01:23:42 -0500, RichA wrote:

I think anyone using a laser in this way should have a nice
five-year jail term, but is it possible to do what the second
article said? I guess the plane would have to be a distance away
from the laser'r in order for the beam to have entered the cockpit?
Another thing; Wouldn't the laser have to be mounted on some
kind of stable tracking device? The deviation due to body shake
(from someone holding it) from the distance claimed means that it
would be about impossible to hold it on target with any kind of
timeframe on the order of "seconds."
-Rich

This is something that is impossible to do with a typical class 3b laser
pointer. As you note, there is no way to hold one still enough from
several
thousand feet away, and it wouldn't be bright at that distance. A
searchlight
hitting a plane would be brighter and more distracting (something that
happens
regularly).

Supposedly, this happened again shortly after in Colorado Springs.
Frankly, I'm
suspicious that there is an element of hysteria in all this. Lately the
Department of Homeland Security has been running around warning that
terrorists
with lasers are a threat to airplanes, and suddenly you have three reports
of
bright green lights, from different locations, with no physical evidence
at all?
Hmmm....

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

Someone with a laser collimator (are there green models?) could use
their scope as a "light cannon" where the optics broaden the beam and
reduce divergence. An 8 inch aperture could easily illuminate an
aircraft cockpit several miles away at night. That's why I'm concerned
this might end up in the lap of the amateur community, as in "Look what
those crazy astronomers are doing!"

Pilots flying at night are very paranoid -- any unexpected bright light
that appears to be headed their way will really **** them off.

matt wrote:


Seriously now, how did this legend and paranoia get started , that a low
power laser beam with known large beam divergence would be able to
illuminate in any significant way a distant moving target, without having
tracking capability ? Even a half Watt laser with the kind of divergence
these small pointers have would not pose any risk thousands of feet away for
anybody's vision .


best regards,
matt tudor
4-

In article , Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Thu, 30 Dec 2004 01:23:42 -0500, RichA wrote:

[...re reports of lasers shining into airplane cockpits...]
Supposedly, this happened again shortly after in Colorado Springs. Frankly, I'm
suspicious that there is an element of hysteria in all this. Lately the
Department of Homeland Security has been running around warning that terrorists
with lasers are a threat to airplanes, and suddenly you have three reports of
bright green lights, from different locations, with no physical evidence at all?
Hmmm....

Though I'm as suspicious as anyone of our administration's
"The only thing we have is fear" policies, these reports
of lasers shining into airplanes don't seem suspicious to me,
unfortunately. I bet they're from the same pattern as
copycat crimes: a few people, hearing DHS warnings about
lasers endangering airplanes, think that's a pretty cool idea
and decide to see if they can do it themselves. It might not
even be that hard, given a laser strapped to a spotting scope on
a decent tripod. We can only hope that the population of such hobbyists
remains small.

Wouldn't it be just as annoying to a pilot to shine sunlight at him
with a small mirror?
Mirrors have existed for far longer than lasers and aeroplanes.
No doubt huge areas of grower's glasshouses put a huge amount of
sunlight upwards towards 'planes.
It would be no surprise at all if these existed near airfields.
Laser pointers are now available for small change in builder's levels.
Though the beam spread on my own is unlikely to be worth consideration
of its use beyond two hundred metres as a potential weapon against
aircraft pilots.

Chris.B