"NASA Watch" gets really ****ed off.

On May 17, 2:01 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:

What is the ISS useful for?


"kT" wrote
Existing.

Why pretend to be doing something other than keeping the AmeriKKKan
failure in orbit?


Nothing.


"kT" wrote
On the contrary, it exists.

Your claimed use is simple existance?

According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.


Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

"kT" wrote
That may be true, but it exists, nevertheless.

Other than existing what initial mission goals has it accomplished?


Another Failure of AmeriKKKa in space.


"kT" wrote
You can't fail unless you try.

The AmeriKKKan pattern is clear. Lofty rhetoric and goals, followed by a
pattern of repeated budget cuts and a continuing redefinition of mission
goals along with re-engineering to match the funding, until the program is
essentially a worthless boondoggle. At which point funding dries up and the
program is dropped like a hot potato.

This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

"BradGuth" wrote
As opposed to our having a robust Moon L1 platform/outpost of mostly
robotic instruments

Doing what? the Space Interferrometry Mission is cancelled due to lack of
Funding.

wrote:
You got that right. A phenomenal waste of time.


You know, it actually didn't use to be.

But now that it has morphed into "Everest Watch" instead of NASA
Watch, it is really quite different. I submitted some comments to his
site pointing out that while what Scott Parazynski is doing a
wonderful personal adventure, it actually isn't relevant to watching
NASA, and only vaguely has anything to do with real exploration for
any one but Scott. In that Scott is doing what many others have
already done, and actually following in their footprints as well as
their footsteps, there is some symbolic reference to the whole "return
to the Moon for the first time" effort.


I can't figure that out either.
He also became fascinated with the astronauts in the underwater habitat
around a year back, as well as the crew up on Devon Island pretending
they're on Mars.
Maybe he got bored with space? :-\

Pat

"Pat Flannery" wrote in message
dakotatelephone...
Which brings up a interesting question... when the ISS is decommissioned,
what exactly happens to it?


they'll probably just put it up on eBay

--
Terrell Miller


"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into a committee - that
will do them in."
- Bradley's Bromide

On May 18, 12:55 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:
On May 17, 2:01 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:

What is the ISS useful for?

"kT" wrote

Existing.

Why pretend to be doing something other than keeping the AmeriKKKan
failure in orbit?

Nothing.

"kT" wrote

On the contrary, it exists.

Your claimed use is simple existance?

Yes, obviously it's existence is crucial to its usefulness.

According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.

It's mission goals are completely wrong and now obsolete, of course,
but they could be changed by simple decree. It needs to be an
international space station for life sciences research, closed
ecological life support systems, in other words, astronaut tourists
from hostile nations growing plants. Psychotropic plants, preferably.
That would get hostile nations working together and respecting one
another quickly.

In particular, America, of course.

Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

I never claimed otherwise, I'm talking about a salvage operation.

"kT" wrote

That may be true, but it exists, nevertheless.

Other than existing what initial mission goals has it accomplished?

Another Failure of AmeriKKKa in space.

"kT" wrote

You can't fail unless you try.

The AmeriKKKan pattern is clear. Lofty rhetoric and goals, followed by a
pattern of repeated budget cuts and a continuing redefinition of mission
goals along with re-engineering to match the funding, until the program is
essentially a worthless boondoggle. At which point funding dries up and the
program is dropped like a hot potato.

Thus, the salvage operations.

This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

It's history. I am truly outrages they are trying to repeat it.
Salvaging the ISS is one method of discouraging further madness in
this direction, and discouraging further madness in launch vehicle
design.

The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

I don't want to go to Mars, I want to go to the space station, and use
that as a testbed for long duration spacecraft to go the Phobos,
Deimos, the Asteroids, and that remarkable fifth planet Ceres.

By doing this we might just have a chance to salvage something from
the Earth. If we can't salvage the space station, we'll never be able
to salvage this planet. Get it? I doubt it.

On Sun, 18 May 2008 07:00:31 -0500, Pat Flannery
wrote:

as well as the crew up on Devon Island pretending
they're on Mars.
Maybe he got bored with space? :-\

Well, I sure got bored with Devon Island. Don't give a hoot about
Scott's Everest Quest, either. Keith still occasionally has useful
NASA information, but the signal to noise ratio is so low (even worse
than sci.space, where at least you can use filters) that it is hardly
worth the effort.

Brian

On May 18, 7:00 am, Pat Flannery wrote:
wrote:
You got that right. A phenomenal waste of time.

You know, it actually didn't use to be.

But now that it has morphed into "Everest Watch" instead of NASA
Watch, it is really quite different. I submitted some comments to his
site pointing out that while what Scott Parazynski is doing a
wonderful personal adventure, it actually isn't relevant to watching
NASA, and only vaguely has anything to do with real exploration for
any one but Scott. In that Scott is doing what many others have
already done, and actually following in their footprints as well as
their footsteps, there is some symbolic reference to the whole "return
to the Moon for the first time" effort.

I can't figure that out either.
He also became fascinated with the astronauts in the underwater habitat
around a year back, as well as the crew up on Devon Island pretending
they're on Mars.
Maybe he got bored with space? :-\

Pat

I think there is a thread here. Keith's point is that what Scott is
doing is "in the spirit of exploration", and that's why it is worth
following -- to teach NASA followers what "exploration" really is.
This is a bit perplexing, because he is confusing "adventure" with
"exploration". I think "adventure" is pretty cool, especially with
risk involved, and may well be a national need. But what the
administration and agency pledged to do is "exploration" -- and that
is NOT what Scott is doing. (In many respects, it's not what the
Vision is doing either.) As you say, one can look at NEMO and Devon
Island in the same way. It's kinda neat to hear about them, but let's
not wallow in them, please.

The NASA Watch site has really changed. It used to be an insightful,
and somewhat biting glimpse into space policy. It was quite unique in
doing this, but has now gone somewhat off the rail. There are several
other excellent sites that serve the purpose that NASA Watch used to
serve, and they are forums that actually allow and encourage civil
discourse, rather than just applause. "Yay, Scott!", "Go for it,
Scott!" I really think those folks made their point in dozens of posts
that NASA Watch welcomed, but it may take a hundred such posts for
Keith to see that.

Also, NASA Watch seems to be positively besotten with Gen-Y marketing.
I think that's kind of amusing. The product that NASA should be
offering should be attractive as a cultural mandate. This Gen-Y
business is that the problem with the product is seen as a problem in
marketing, which is a sad situation.

But again, this is Keith's prerogative. It's his website. He can go
off rails and get ****ed off all he wants. But the site is floating
slowly down in my list of useful blogs. Much as for Scott Parazynski,
this site is becoming more the record of a personal journey than a
tool for others -- "It's YOUR space agency. Get involved. Take it
back. Make it work - for YOU."

I'm posting about it here not so much to complain, but just as an
observation. The site has served real needs, and Keith deserves a lot
of kudos.

Your claimed use is simple existance?


"kT" wrote
Yes, obviously it's existence is crucial to its usefulness.

So far it's primary use has been to suck funding from robotic planetary
exploration.

It's an expensive rock.


According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.


"kT" wrote
It's mission goals are completely wrong and now obsolete, of course,

Now it's mission is strictly to exist apparently.


"kT" wrote
but they could be changed by simple decree. It needs to be an
international space station for life sciences research, closed
ecological life support systems, in other words, astronaut tourists
from hostile nations growing plants. Psychotropic plants, preferably.
That would get hostile nations working together and respecting one
another quickly.

Just think of what it could do for Afghan opium production.


Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

"kT" wrote
I never claimed otherwise, I'm talking about a salvage operation.

It can be salvaged of course, and can still do useful work. All that
needs be done is to get AmeriKKKa out of the picutre.


This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

"kT" wrote
It's history. I am truly outrages they are trying to repeat it.
Salvaging the ISS is one method of discouraging further madness in
this direction, and discouraging further madness in launch vehicle
design.

I blame AmeriKKKan RepubliKKKans for the perpetual stream of U.S. white
elephants in manned space flight.


The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

"kT" wrote
I don't want to go to Mars, I want to go to the space station, and use
that as a testbed for long duration spacecraft to go the Phobos,
Deimos, the Asteroids, and that remarkable fifth planet Ceres.

I see little value in manned space flight to these orbiting piles of
rubble.


"kT" wrote
By doing this we might just have a chance to salvage something from
the Earth. If we can't salvage the space station, we'll never be able
to salvage this planet. Get it? I doubt it.

Put the Japanese in charge of design and the Russians in charge of
implementation.

Sell NASA to China. AmeriKKKa could use the cash.

On May 17, 6:22*am, " wrote:

The South Pacific is pretty much standard for such events. I guess you
could do it in the southern Indian Ocean, but the South Pacific is
bigger.

The entire Pacific is bigger still

On May 18, 10:10 pm, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:
Your claimed use is simple existance?

"kT" wrote

Yes, obviously it's existence is crucial to its usefulness.

So far it's primary use has been to suck funding from robotic planetary
exploration.

It's an expensive rock.

I agree entirely, it's a poor design, and I was opposed to building it
at all in that form, and I indeed predicted after Challenger it would
never be built. But they went ahead and built it, and now we're stuck
with it, so with a little creativity it should be much cheaper to
maintain now that it is built. What I am advocating is creativity in
the launch and life support markets, something thus far Americans are
unwilling to do.

According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.

"kT" wrote

It's mission goals are completely wrong and now obsolete, of course,

Now it's mission is strictly to exist apparently.

"kT" wrote

but they could be changed by simple decree. It needs to be an
international space station for life sciences research, closed
ecological life support systems, in other words, astronaut tourists
from hostile nations growing plants. Psychotropic plants, preferably.
That would get hostile nations working together and respecting one
another quickly.

Just think of what it could do for Afghan opium production.

Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

"kT" wrote

I never claimed otherwise, I'm talking about a salvage operation.

It can be salvaged of course, and can still do useful work. All that
needs be done is to get AmeriKKKa out of the picutre.

I agree entirely, but I would prefer America to become more rational.

This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

"kT" wrote

It's history. I am truly outrages they are trying to repeat it.
Salvaging the ISS is one method of discouraging further madness in
this direction, and discouraging further madness in launch vehicle
design.

I blame AmeriKKKan RepubliKKKans for the perpetual stream of U.S. white
elephants in manned space flight.

So do I, but there is no time like the present to change that.

The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

"kT" wrote

I don't want to go to Mars, I want to go to the space station, and use
that as a testbed for long duration spacecraft to go the Phobos,
Deimos, the Asteroids, and that remarkable fifth planet Ceres.

I see little value in manned space flight to these orbiting piles of
rubble.

Except to keep the mammals from fighting among themselves by giving
them something to do. Manned space flight to rubble piles is decades
off, but if we are able to salvage the space station, then we'll have
the skills to try and attempt something else. If we don't fight the
rubble piles over there, they'll come over here ... and ... oh ...
forget it.

"kT" wrote

By doing this we might just have a chance to salvage something from
the Earth. If we can't salvage the space station, we'll never be able
to salvage this planet. Get it? I doubt it.

Put the Japanese in charge of design and the Russians in charge of
implementation.

I agree, but the bottom line is, we need to start flying astronauts to
the ISS from hostile nations. That's the only way this is going to
work.

Sell NASA to China. AmeriKKKa could use the cash.

NASA is a problem, but that's an entirely different salvage operation.