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The 600'th launch of an Atlas....Oct 12,2009...in case you missed it



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 4th 09, 01:08 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.space.history,alt.global-warming
kT
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Default The 600'th launch of an Atlas....Oct 12,2009...in case you missedit

Jonathan wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/AFSpace#p/a


I want to manufacture five meter hydrogen cores like the old fashioned
Altas ICBMs, by the gross, at Michoud. Then I'll assemble them into
gigantic solar powered Star Trek Voyager ships in orbit. Obama agrees.

Or maybe not. Doesn't matter.
  #2  
Old November 4th 09, 02:31 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.space.history,alt.global-warming
kT
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Posts: 5,032
Default The 600'th launch of an Atlas....Oct 12,2009...in case you missedit

Jonathan wrote:
"kT" wrote in message
...
Jonathan wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/AFSpace#p/a

I want to manufacture five meter hydrogen cores like the old fashioned Altas
ICBMs, by the gross, at Michoud. Then I'll assemble them into gigantic solar
powered Star Trek Voyager ships in orbit. Obama agrees.

Or maybe not. Doesn't matter.




What does matter?


Matter matters. It has mass, it interacts and evolves. It can be studied
and understood by scientific methods. The space program is what you do
with that information. Obama and his people definitely get that part.

You can't convert energy without devices that are constructed from
matter. You should know that much Jonathan, that's called 'life'.
  #3  
Old November 6th 09, 01:03 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.space.history,alt.global-warming
Jonathan
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Posts: 267
Default The 600'th launch of an Atlas....Oct 12,2009...in case you missed it


http://www.youtube.com/AFSpace#p/a


  #4  
Old November 6th 09, 01:57 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.space.history,alt.global-warming
Jonathan
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Posts: 267
Default The 600'th launch of an Atlas....Oct 12,2009...in case you missed it


"kT" wrote in message
...
Jonathan wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/AFSpace#p/a


I want to manufacture five meter hydrogen cores like the old fashioned Altas
ICBMs, by the gross, at Michoud. Then I'll assemble them into gigantic solar
powered Star Trek Voyager ships in orbit. Obama agrees.

Or maybe not. Doesn't matter.




What does matter?



  #5  
Old November 7th 09, 02:53 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.space.history,alt.global-warming
Jonathan
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Posts: 267
Default The 600'th launch of an Atlas....Oct 12,2009...in case you missed it


"kT" wrote in message ...
Jonathan wrote:
"kT" wrote in message



Or maybe not. Doesn't matter.




What does matter?




Matter matters.
It has mass, it interacts and evolves. It can be studied and understood by
scientific methods.



So you mean what is real and has a tangible existence
matters most? Taking what is 'real' and using that to project
a path into the future (the unreal)?

But in a non-linear world we can only predict the very short
term future. And with only weather-like accuracy.

Your time-worn habit of taking the real and using that
information to extrapolate a path into the future is
not an effective or rational scientific method due to
one-two punch of the uncertainty principle and butterfly
effect.

Complexity Science provides a trick, or way around this
simple fact of life wrt predicting the future of complex
adaptive systems. The trick is to start the scientific process
by doing just the opposite of starting with the cold hard
facts of reality. Instead, we should start off by using
our /imagination/ to decide upon the ideal possible future.
The future....the 'unreal' comes first and matters most.

Don't you see why? There are an infinite number of possible
paths from the present, to the future. The classical method tries
to take the present, and predict which one of those infinite
paths will actually happen. That is not possible and creates
only confusion from all the uncertainty, leading to a
world view with little meaning or optimism.

But if we begin with the ....future, the unreal, and create
our ideal possible final state first. Then we have ONE
and only ONE possibility path between there and the
current reality.

The confusion lifts, the unreal becomes possible, and now
we can grasp the simplest fact of reality of all. Which is
that there is no such thing as objective reality.
That reality and our future are equally dependent
upon us, and our actions.

The only way to accurately, consistently and scientifically
predict the future of a non-linear (evolving ) world is
to decide upon the future we WANT.

And the rest is simply a matter of connecting the dots between there
and here, grunt work....for 'clerks in counting rooms'.

And don't you see what the abstract Complex Adaptive System
truly represents? It represents the idealized evolving system.
It represents the final state with the greatest potential for
creation, adaptability and beauty.

It represents the ideal possible future.

So, in Complexity Science, we begin the scientific method
with the best possible future already a given. We have
the correct solution before even starting. And there
is only one, or a few, possibility paths between that
future and the present reality. This brings simplicity
to what was confusing. This brings certainty amidst
an uncertain sea of randomness.

It gives us a single solution that solves all possible
problems.

So the one and only rational path is to strive to make
any given system as close to a CAS as possible.
So that system can take care of itself and find the
optimum all by itself from that point on.

So for NASA, the solution to creating that bright space
faring future we all want is a matter of giving NASA
the ability to self organize. To model it after a CAS.

Which is done with a system structure where the
opposites in possibility are at simultaneous maximums
and in an unstable equilibrium with each other.

For NASA the static and chaotic opposite extremes
in possibility space are....

Static Attractor: the current state of the art.

Chaotic Attractor: the ideal future.

Dynamic Attractor: that which connects the two
in a complex way.


Such a project, one that can initiate self-organization, must
then have two properties. One, the project must be something
that NASA can actually accomplish if it's technical ability were
stretched to the limit, but without breaking. It must be possible
for NASA, but barely.

And two, it must lead to an ideal (practical) future. Not Utopia
exactly, but the best possible future within the current real world
constraints. Neither can be so lofty to be unreachable, yet so
easy as to be rote. Then the thing will take care of itself and
find the ideal future all by itself, through the processes of
evolution we all know and love.

Space Solar Power satisfies both those conditions very well.

Once started, the solutions such a program finally decides
upon will go where it will, it may not even be satellites.
That doesn't matter, as we know a self organized system
will settle on the optimum eventually, just like life.

The Vision failed to consider the future, the chaotic attractor.
As it provides no clear picture of tangible benefits to society.
Certainly not anything close to 'world saving'. The Vision
from day one was a static or dying system. Anyone should've
been able to see it's glaring and fatal weakness in initial
design as a goal.







 




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