Why is absolute zero finite compared to maximum heat (which is seemingly infinite)?

wrote in message ...
In sci.astro wrote:

This is not philosp[hy but physics, so what it "seems" to you is
irrelevant. Temperature has a physical definition and it is *not*
energy.

So let's do some physics! Are you saying that Temperature has NO
relation to energy of a system? That's clearly not true! However,
Zero temperature is clearly NOT zero energy (which I believe you
are also saying).

It would be for non Quantum, non Relativistic physics.

In the thermodynamic (ideal gas) or Kelvin scale,

i.e. non quantum, non relativistic, quite apart from non condensing (!)

Zero temperature is defined as when isothermal and adiabatic
processes are identical. In other words when a system undergoes
an isothermal process with no transfer of heat, the temperature
at which this occurs is called absolute zero.

It's one interpretation. Probably more mathematical than physical under the
circumstances.

Obviously by that
definition a zero point energy CAN exist. But hey, what if I
now REMOVE in some manner a quantity of that zero point energy.
Is the system now at a temperature BELOW absolute zero?

What exactly do you mean by 'remove some 0-point energy in some manner'?

Have
we extended temperature into a negative region? Could the Kelvin
temperature scale consist of more that simply positive numbers?
Now this is getting into philosophy since I don't think anyone
has removed any zero point energy even in theory, but it is interesting.

Or not

However, if you wish to stick with just physics, then lets just
say that by removing some zero point energy,

I thought we were sticking with physics. How would you remove this energy
without risking adding some energy?

we have gone outside
the range of the definition of Temperature, thus, the system no
longer can be said to have a temperature at all! Is that not true?

Well. let's just get past the "if I can" stage first

OG

In article ,
wrote:
In article , writes:
In sci.astro wrote:

This is not philosp[hy but physics, so what it "seems" to you is
irrelevant. Temperature has a physical definition and it is *not*
energy.

So let's do some physics! Are you saying that Temperature has NO
relation to energy of a system?

It appears that reading comprehension is a dying art:-(

Compare the two statements:

1) Temperature is not energy.
2) Temperature is not related to energy.

Now, which of the two statements I used, in the text above? Take your
time, if you run into difficulties comparing, try to count words:-)

1)...one...four....ten...two.
2)...one..eight...twenty-three...forty-seven.
Original...five...twelve...sixty-nine...a hundred.

IF TWO=FORTY-SEVEN, CALL EXIT.

When you'll recognize the difference, you're welcome to ask further
questions. Till then, don't bother, I'm not responding to strawmen,
as a rule.

[emoticon stuffs more straw padding in its overalls]

/BAH

Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.

In article , writes:
In article ,
wrote:
In article , writes:
In sci.astro wrote:

This is not philosp[hy but physics, so what it "seems" to you is
irrelevant. Temperature has a physical definition and it is *not*
energy.

So let's do some physics! Are you saying that Temperature has NO
relation to energy of a system?

It appears that reading comprehension is a dying art:-(

Compare the two statements:

1) Temperature is not energy.
2) Temperature is not related to energy.

Now, which of the two statements I used, in the text above? Take your
time, if you run into difficulties comparing, try to count words:-)

1)...one...four....ten...two.
2)...one..eight...twenty-three...forty-seven.
Original...five...twelve...sixty-nine...a hundred.

IF TWO=FORTY-SEVEN, CALL EXIT.

When you'll recognize the difference, you're welcome to ask further
questions. Till then, don't bother, I'm not responding to strawmen,
as a rule.

[emoticon stuffs more straw padding in its overalls]

:-)))

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
| chances are he is doing just the same"

In article ,
wrote:
In article ,
writes:
In article ,
wrote:
In article , writes:
In sci.astro wrote:

This is not philosp[hy but physics, so what it "seems" to you is
irrelevant. Temperature has a physical definition and it is *not*
energy.

So let's do some physics! Are you saying that Temperature has NO
relation to energy of a system?

It appears that reading comprehension is a dying art:-(

Compare the two statements:

1) Temperature is not energy.
2) Temperature is not related to energy.

Now, which of the two statements I used, in the text above? Take your
time, if you run into difficulties comparing, try to count words:-)

1)...one...four....ten...two.
2)...one..eight...twenty-three...forty-seven.
Original...five...twelve...sixty-nine...a hundred.

IF TWO=FORTY-SEVEN, CALL EXIT.

When you'll recognize the difference, you're welcome to ask further
questions. Till then, don't bother, I'm not responding to strawmen,
as a rule.

[emoticon stuffs more straw padding in its overalls]

:-)))

Whew!! [emoticon wipes anticipation sweat from brow] I was
expecting a boot.

/BAH

Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.

In article , writes:
In article ,
wrote:
In article ,
writes:
In article ,
wrote:
In article , writes:
In sci.astro wrote:

This is not philosp[hy but physics, so what it "seems" to you is
irrelevant. Temperature has a physical definition and it is *not*
energy.

So let's do some physics! Are you saying that Temperature has NO
relation to energy of a system?

It appears that reading comprehension is a dying art:-(

Compare the two statements:

1) Temperature is not energy.
2) Temperature is not related to energy.

Now, which of the two statements I used, in the text above? Take your
time, if you run into difficulties comparing, try to count words:-)

1)...one...four....ten...two.
2)...one..eight...twenty-three...forty-seven.
Original...five...twelve...sixty-nine...a hundred.

IF TWO=FORTY-SEVEN, CALL EXIT.

When you'll recognize the difference, you're welcome to ask further
questions. Till then, don't bother, I'm not responding to strawmen,
as a rule.

[emoticon stuffs more straw padding in its overalls]

:-)))

Whew!! [emoticon wipes anticipation sweat from brow] I was
expecting a boot.

Why? It was funny.

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
| chances are he is doing just the same"

In article ,
wrote:
snip

Why? It was funny.

It was meant to be funny. The incidence of humor
impairment appears to be rising and I've been worried that
it was me who had acquired it. A number of my lines have
fallen flat lately.

Over the last six months, I have been slllooowwwly working on
replacing the horsehair plaster in two closets with blue board.
The goal was to 1. Eliminate two chimney effects (the holes
were in the ceiling which goes to the attic which goes to the
outside) and 2. Eliminate doorways for 4- 6- and 8-legged critters.

I have a compendium of stories about this effort but I'll
tell the latest one.

Closet #2's ceiling had 55% of it already covered with some
kind of wallboard. The other 45% had exposed slats, dripping
horsehair plaster, insulation and gaps where 4-legged critters
had bulldozed a pathway into the closet. They used this lane
to fill the pockets of my suede jacket with seeds but that's
another story.

Closet #1 had to be completely stripped of plaster (ugh!)
and relined so I had some blue board left over for closet #2.
The dimensions of the replacement space in Closet #2 were
about 7-3/8" x 6'. I didn't have any strips of board left that
were 6'. However I did have one strip of board that was exactly
the width I needed but ~38". The other strip had be cut down
to the 7+" width but was also short. So after I had cut the
width, trying out each board to make sure they would fit widthwise,
I started to work on examining the length part of the project.
I took Board#1, put it up and marked where it stopped, placed
Board#1 on the floor. I took Board#2, put it in place and
noticed that I was short an inch. Oh, well...I can't expect
exact fits with no cutting all the time.

So I laid both boards down to dry out, get warm. The next day
I screwed in the first one. I got the second one up and it
didn't fit; it was too long by 1/2". The damned board had
grown longer. Since I was already pooped, I quit for the day
instead of trimming the length of Board#2.

I have been reading physics newsgroups for a long time. The
next morning, I decided that, if the ****ing boards could
grow longer overnight, perhaps they can grow shorter overnight.

Sure enough, they had. The second board was exactly the correct
length and it fit in tight. So I screwed it in before it changed
its mind about which length it wanted to be.


Now, all I have to do is figure out how I caused it, figure
out how to can it, then all I have to do is sell it to certain
accelerator sites.

/BAH





/BAH

Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.

In article , writes:
In article ,
wrote:
snip

Why? It was funny.

It was meant to be funny. The incidence of humor
impairment appears to be rising

Yes, I've been observing this too.

and I've been worried that it was me who had acquired it. A number of
my lines have fallen flat lately.

Well, when dealing with the humor impaired, any line will fall flat.

Over the last six months, I have been slllooowwwly working on
replacing the horsehair plaster in two closets with blue board.
The goal was to 1. Eliminate two chimney effects (the holes
were in the ceiling which goes to the attic which goes to the
outside) and 2. Eliminate doorways for 4- 6- and 8-legged critters.

Good luck with this:-) They always find more doorways.

I have a compendium of stories about this effort but I'll
tell the latest one.

Closet #2's ceiling had 55% of it already covered with some
kind of wallboard. The other 45% had exposed slats, dripping
horsehair plaster, insulation and gaps where 4-legged critters
had bulldozed a pathway into the closet. They used this lane
to fill the pockets of my suede jacket with seeds but that's
another story.

Closet #1 had to be completely stripped of plaster (ugh!)
and relined so I had some blue board left over for closet #2.
The dimensions of the replacement space in Closet #2 were
about 7-3/8" x 6'. I didn't have any strips of board left that
were 6'. However I did have one strip of board that was exactly
the width I needed but ~38". The other strip had be cut down
to the 7+" width but was also short. So after I had cut the
width, trying out each board to make sure they would fit widthwise,
I started to work on examining the length part of the project.
I took Board#1, put it up and marked where it stopped, placed
Board#1 on the floor. I took Board#2, put it in place and
noticed that I was short an inch. Oh, well...I can't expect
exact fits with no cutting all the time.

So I laid both boards down to dry out, get warm. The next day
I screwed in the first one. I got the second one up and it
didn't fit; it was too long by 1/2". The damned board had
grown longer. Since I was already pooped, I quit for the day
instead of trimming the length of Board#2.

I have been reading physics newsgroups for a long time. The
next morning, I decided that, if the ****ing boards could
grow longer overnight, perhaps they can grow shorter overnight.

Hey, worth a try.

Sure enough, they had. The second board was exactly the correct
length and it fit in tight. So I screwed it in before it changed
its mind about which length it wanted to be.

Yes, you have to nake the best of the periods when they're in a
cooperative mood.

Now, all I have to do is figure out how I caused it, figure
out how to can it, then all I have to do is sell it to certain
accelerator sites.

Sure, go for it. You probably got some combination of thermal
expansion and swelling due to changing humidity. Mostly the second, I
would guess.

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
| chances are he is doing just the same"

In sci.astro wrote:

Now, all I have to do is figure out how I caused it, figure
out how to can it, then all I have to do is sell it to certain
accelerator sites.

Um, it's caused by Red Shift! Now if we can just harness the
effect where socks and small screws shoot through the floor
into time, we'll be famous.

Bjacoby

--
Due to SPAM innundation above address is turned off!

In article , writes:
In article ,
wrote:
In article ,
writes:
In article ,
wrote:
snip

Why? It was funny.

It was meant to be funny. The incidence of humor
impairment appears to be rising

Yes, I've been observing this too.

and I've been worried that it was me who had acquired it. A number of
my lines have fallen flat lately.

Well, when dealing with the humor impaired, any line will fall flat.

I had to consider myself first.

snip story

I have been reading physics newsgroups for a long time. The
next morning, I decided that, if the ****ing boards could
grow longer overnight, perhaps they can grow shorter overnight.

Hey, worth a try.

Sure enough, they had. The second board was exactly the correct
length and it fit in tight. So I screwed it in before it changed
its mind about which length it wanted to be.

Yes, you have to nake the best of the periods when they're in a
cooperative mood.

I guess the art of carpentry is to know when the pesky material
is cooperative.

And to what extent it is willing to be cooperative. Yes.

I have 10 more years of practice before I learn.

That's about as much as the average apprentice used to spend (while
dealing with this stuff all the time, not part time). The belief that
"since this is not traditional university material, it must be simple"
is totally off.


Now, all I have to do is figure out how I caused it, figure
out how to can it, then all I have to do is sell it to certain
accelerator sites.

Sure, go for it. You probably got some combination of thermal
expansion and swelling due to changing humidity. Mostly the second, I
would guess.

I thought of that but 1/2" or so?

Yes, that's a lot.

That would make a big mess
if it did that for all blue board. I've been having strange
measuring problems which is why I've been resorting to physical
fit rather than transformations. I'd really, really like to
figure out what I'm doing that causes these errors.

Can't tell you without seeing how you're measuring.

When I first started closing critter doorways, I was using the
official carpenter's tape measure. I always ****ed it up. Since
I failed trying to figure how I messed up, I started using my
dressmaker's tape measure. That seemed to help but I have no
idea why it helped.

What was really screwy is that it took the posting of my story
24 hours to propogate. Time dilations?

Perhaps:-)

Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
| chances are he is doing just the same"

In article ,
wrote:
In article ,
writes:
In article ,
wrote:
In article ,
writes:
In article ,
wrote:

snip

snip story

I have been reading physics newsgroups for a long time. The
next morning, I decided that, if the ****ing boards could
grow longer overnight, perhaps they can grow shorter overnight.

Hey, worth a try.

Sure enough, they had. The second board was exactly the correct
length and it fit in tight. So I screwed it in before it changed
its mind about which length it wanted to be.

Yes, you have to nake the best of the periods when they're in a
cooperative mood.

I guess the art of carpentry is to know when the pesky material
is cooperative.

And to what extent it is willing to be cooperative. Yes.

[muttering emoticon here] Now I have learn how to talk to blue
board????! ;-)

I have 10 more years of practice before I learn.

That's about as much as the average apprentice used to spend (while
dealing with this stuff all the time, not part time). The belief that
"since this is not traditional university material, it must be simple"
is totally off.

Yep. Those machinists in any production line in factories are
amazing people. And it's almost poetry to watch a guy mix
and apply _lumpless_ plaster. I've never watched a whittler(sp?)
of wood but I bet that's instructive as well.



Now, all I have to do is figure out how I caused it, figure
out how to can it, then all I have to do is sell it to certain
accelerator sites.

Sure, go for it. You probably got some combination of thermal
expansion and swelling due to changing humidity. Mostly the second, I
would guess.

I thought of that but 1/2" or so?

Yes, that's a lot.

Ha. AND the width didn't shrink so it can't be a physical
phenomena. It's got to be me ****ing up unless I've truly
become a magician and can change physics laws. In this
case, everybody had better watch out when I'm on the road.


That would make a big mess
if it did that for all blue board. I've been having strange
measuring problems which is why I've been resorting to physical
fit rather than transformations. I'd really, really like to
figure out what I'm doing that causes these errors.

Can't tell you without seeing how you're measuring.

Yep. I've been trying to "observe" myself but that
doesn't work anymore; I used to be very, very good at
that. I've demonstrated that my brain
is not functional anymore by doing the inequality sections
in my calc 101 book. ~70% of them ended up bassackwards.
Now all I have to do is figure out how to get a red flag
to wave whenever the flips flop.

When I first started closing critter doorways, I was using the
official carpenter's tape measure. I always ****ed it up. Since
I failed trying to figure how I messed up, I started using my
dressmaker's tape measure. That seemed to help but I have no
idea why it helped.

What was really screwy is that it took the posting of my story
24 hours to propogate. Time dilations?

Perhaps:-)

Well, we'll test this one again. I have a couple of hypotheses
that I'll get around to isolating if the behaviour continues.

For the last two nights, the critters in the attic (which I am
now aware exist) started to create more chimneys. So all projects
are now on hol[e]d until I kill the sunovabitches.

Every improvement has three adverse side effects. I can't wait to
find out what the other two are.

/BAH

Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail.