The night the world nearly died. (posted without permission but with attribution)

(Jake) wrote:
This article about the Soviet officer who prevented what
could have become a worldwide nuclear war in 1983, along
with links to more media reports, photos, etc., can be
found on this website (see "Weekendavisen"):

http://www.brightstarsound.com

Jake


(Orestes) wrote in message news:
Nuclear War: Minuteman


Weekendavisen
April 2, 2004

Lieutenant Colonel Stanislav Petrov was the duty officer on the
September night in 1983 when the Soviet spy satellite Kosmos-1382
suddenly reported the firing of five American nuclear missiles toward
the Soviet Union. The lieutenant colonel had to make a decision.

The movie "Wargames" was released in June 1983. This incident is alleged to
have happened in September of the same year. Hmmm.

The back wall of the room was covered by two large green
electronic maps of the Soviet Union and U.S., where the nine American
military bases could be seen.

It's the big board! Just like in Strangelove! Only it was the Russkies who
had it!

And here I thought the Russkies would "...go absolutely ape and they're
gonna strike back with everything they've got."

"Jim Logajan" wrote in message
...

The movie "Wargames" was released in June 1983. This incident is alleged
to
have happened in September of the same year. Hmmm.

one of the worst movies ever made. Blecch.

--
Terrell Miller


proudly keeping alt.music.yes all-to-**** since 1996

"Terrell Miller" wrote:
"Jim Logajan" wrote in message
...

The movie "Wargames" was released in June 1983. This incident is alleged
to
have happened in September of the same year. Hmmm.

one of the worst movies ever made. Blecch.

It wasn't very good. But I know of movies that are much worse - but I
thought it was interesting that the article alleges an incident happening
in the same year that bomb came out.

In article ,
(Eric Chomko) wrote:
Terrell Miller ) wrote:
: "Jim Logajan" wrote in message
: ...

: The movie "Wargames" was released in June 1983. This incident is alleged
: to
: have happened in September of the same year. Hmmm.

: one of the worst movies ever made. Blecch.

The best part was the IMSAI 8080 computer!

Also, wouldn't the hotline be "red" with noise about something like this?
THAT is what it was for. No mention of that makes the article even MORE
dubious. If it were real the hotline would have been mentioned.

Eric


From what they showed, Global Thermonuclear War seemed like a dull game
anyway.

: --
: Terrell Miller
:

: proudly keeping alt.music.yes all-to-**** since 1996

Terrell Miller ) wrote:
: "Jim Logajan" wrote in message
: ...

: The movie "Wargames" was released in June 1983. This incident is alleged
: to
: have happened in September of the same year. Hmmm.

: one of the worst movies ever made. Blecch.

The best part was the IMSAI 8080 computer!

Also, wouldn't the hotline be "red" with noise about something like this?
THAT is what it was for. No mention of that makes the article even MORE
dubious. If it were real the hotline would have been mentioned.

Eric

: --
: Terrell Miller
:

: proudly keeping alt.music.yes all-to-**** since 1996

"Lloyd Parker" wrote in message
...
In article ,

From what they showed, Global Thermonuclear War seemed like a dull game
anyway.

My understanding is in the original version of the script, there WAS a
winner.

I think that would have been a much better movie.



: --
: Terrell Miller
:

: proudly keeping alt.music.yes all-to-**** since 1996

Lloyd Parker ) wrote:
: In article ,
: (Eric Chomko) wrote:
: Terrell Miller ) wrote:
: : "Jim Logajan" wrote in message
: : ...
:
: : The movie "Wargames" was released in June 1983. This incident is alleged
: : to
: : have happened in September of the same year. Hmmm.
:
: : one of the worst movies ever made. Blecch.
:
: The best part was the IMSAI 8080 computer!
:
: Also, wouldn't the hotline be "red" with noise about something like this?
: THAT is what it was for. No mention of that makes the article even MORE
: dubious. If it were real the hotline would have been mentioned.
:
: Eric
:

: From what they showed, Global Thermonuclear War seemed like a dull game
: anyway.

Like "MIssile Command" after about the 3rd time you play it.

Eric

: : --
: : Terrell Miller
: :
:
: : proudly keeping alt.music.yes all-to-**** since 1996
:
:

Regarding the false nuclear attack warning involving Soviet military
officer Stanislav Petrov in 1983 (http://www.brightstarsound.com):

(Eric Chomko) wrote in message news:

[snip]

Also, wouldn't the hotline be "red" with noise about something like this?
THAT is what it was for. No mention of that makes the article even MORE
dubious. If it were real the hotline would have been mentioned.

Eric


The Cold War "Hot Line" was meant for use only by the top Soviet
and American leaders. Word of this attack warning never reached
that high a level. When Colonel Petrov declared the alarm false,
the possibility of any nuclear weapons launch stopped immediately.

If he had *not* declared a false alarm, the top Soviet leadership
would quickly have been notified. Bruce Blair, a Cold War nuclear
strategies expert with the Center for Defense Information in
Washington, D.C., said, "The top (Soviet) leadership, given only
a couple of minutes to decide, told that an attack had been
launched, would make a decision to retaliate."

Because of the paranoia in the Soviet leadership in 1983 and the
small window of time for them to make a decision, it's debatable
under these circumstances whether the Soviets would even have
considered using the "Hot Line." If they perceived that enemy
missiles had already been launched and were heading toward them,
it appears they would have been inclined to unleash their arsenal
immediately. A Baltimore Sun article, reprinted as "The Nuclear
War That Almost Happened in 1983," tells how serious the Soviet
paranoia was:

http://hnn.us/articles/1709.html#bombs9-5-03


John

John ) wrote:
:

: Regarding the false nuclear attack warning involving Soviet military
: officer Stanislav Petrov in 1983 (http://www.brightstarsound.com):

: (Eric Chomko) wrote in message news:

: [snip]

: Also, wouldn't the hotline be "red" with noise about something like this?
: THAT is what it was for. No mention of that makes the article even MORE
: dubious. If it were real the hotline would have been mentioned.
:
: Eric


: The Cold War "Hot Line" was meant for use only by the top Soviet
: and American leaders. Word of this attack warning never reached
: that high a level. When Colonel Petrov declared the alarm false,
: the possibility of any nuclear weapons launch stopped immediately.

Are saying that his prevention of attack was beneath the need for the
hotline? If so, then I sure as heck would want to know what WOULD
constitute the need for hotline use!

: If he had *not* declared a false alarm, the top Soviet leadership
: would quickly have been notified. Bruce Blair, a Cold War nuclear
: strategies expert with the Center for Defense Information in
: Washington, D.C., said, "The top (Soviet) leadership, given only
: a couple of minutes to decide, told that an attack had been
: launched, would make a decision to retaliate."

: Because of the paranoia in the Soviet leadership in 1983 and the
: small window of time for them to make a decision, it's debatable
: under these circumstances whether the Soviets would even have
: considered using the "Hot Line."

What is more to the point is that if the US HAD lauched missiles is that
they (the US) would have used the "hot line" and not the other way around.

: If they perceived that enemy
: missiles had already been launched and were heading toward them,
: it appears they would have been inclined to unleash their arsenal
: immediately. A Baltimore Sun article, reprinted as "The Nuclear
: War That Almost Happened in 1983," tells how serious the Soviet
: paranoia was:

: http://hnn.us/articles/1709.html#bombs9-5-03

I'll check it but still remain skeptical about this perceived "threat".

FYI, my father was chief interpreter of the hotline from 1967-70.

I'll forward the Balt. Sun article as well.

Eric

: John

(Eric Chomko) wrote in message news:
John ) wrote:

: Regarding the false nuclear attack warning involving Soviet military
: officer Stanislav Petrov in 1983 (http://www.brightstarsound.com):

: (Eric Chomko) wrote in message news:

: [snip]

: Also, wouldn't the hotline be "red" with noise about something like this?
: THAT is what it was for. No mention of that makes the article even MORE
: dubious. If it were real the hotline would have been mentioned.
:
: Eric

: The Cold War "Hot Line" was meant for use only by the top Soviet
: and American leaders. Word of this attack warning never reached
: that high a level. When Colonel Petrov declared the alarm false,
: the possibility of any nuclear weapons launch stopped immediately.

Are saying that his prevention of attack was beneath the need for the
hotline?


In this case, yes. Colonel Petrov declared that the Soviet
satellite surveillance data was faulty. In other words, he
was saying that in his judgment no missiles had been launched
by the United States, so no further action was required. That
included no need to notify the top Soviet leadership (who were
the ones with access to the Hot Line).


If so, then I sure as heck would want to know what WOULD
constitute the need for hotline use!

: If he had *not* declared a false alarm, the top Soviet leadership
: would quickly have been notified. Bruce Blair, a Cold War nuclear
: strategies expert with the Center for Defense Information in
: Washington, D.C., said, "The top (Soviet) leadership, given only
: a couple of minutes to decide, told that an attack had been
: launched, would make a decision to retaliate."

: Because of the paranoia in the Soviet leadership in 1983 and the
: small window of time for them to make a decision, it's debatable
: under these circumstances whether the Soviets would even have
: considered using the "Hot Line."

What is more to the point is that if the US HAD lauched missiles is that
they (the US) would have used the "hot line" and not the other way around.

: If they perceived that enemy
: missiles had already been launched and were heading toward them,
: it appears they would have been inclined to unleash their arsenal
: immediately. A Baltimore Sun article, reprinted as "The Nuclear
: War That Almost Happened in 1983," tells how serious the Soviet
: paranoia was:

: http://hnn.us/articles/1709.html#bombs9-5-03

I'll check it but still remain skeptical about this perceived "threat".
FYI, my father was chief interpreter of the hotline from 1967-70.
I'll forward the Balt. Sun article as well.
Eric


Please don't misunderstand - I'm not minimizing the importance
of the Hot Line. In fact, I think establishing it was one of
the most sensible actions in all of the Cold War. But in this
specific instance in 1983, the Soviet leadership had literally
been expecting a first-strike "preventive" attack by the United
States. "Dangerous Prelude" on this webpage gives some examples:

http://www.brightstarsound.com/world_hero/article.html

In this incident, if the Soviets had become convinced an attack
was actually underway, it is possible they may have seen little
value in communicating with their enemy (the United States) via
the Hot Line. (At that point, would there have been any trust?)

Credit goes to Colonel Petrov since he immediately declared the
attack warnings false, stopping the process which could have led
to a mistaken "retaliation" against the United States.

It would be interesting to hear what your father thinks of the
false nuclear attack warning involving Stanislav Petrov, and
also what role the Hot Line could have played if Colonel Petrov
had declared the alarm valid.

Just curious, was your father's position as chief interpreter
military or civilian?


John