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Power Satellite Economics
It's been a long time since I came by this group, but I did today.
If you are interested in power satellites, there is a Google group for that. Keith PS Noticed someone accounting for velocity to orbit. It turns out that if you use an air breather like Skylon, most of the gravity drag is put on the wings. |
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Power Satellite Economics
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Power Satellite Economics
On Tuesday, June 6, 2017 at 7:12:02 PM UTC-7, Fred J. McCall wrote:
wrote: It's been a long time since I came by this group, but I did today. If you are interested in power satellites, there is a Google group for that. But that means using the horrible Goggle Gropes interface, which I refuse to do. If someone says something halfway interesting, please feel free to echo it to an actual Usenet group. If you sign up, you can get it as email. Keith -- "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." --George Bernard Shaw |
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Power Satellite Economics
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Power Satellite Economics
David Spain wrote:
On 6/6/2017 4:45 PM, wrote: It's been a long time since I came by this group, but I did today. If you are interested in power satellites, there is a Google group for that. Are bad and dubious..... But if you are interested in economical power, there are plenty of terrestrial companies that will sell you cheap & reliable solar panels. But that won't be particularly economical power unless you subsidize the **** out of it. Once coupled with sufficient battery technology this will make compelling case for those who want to co-generate with the grid as primarily backup power. Frankly I just don't see how SPS competes with this. I really don't. 8 cents a kilowatt hour. Whatever your initial investment & NRE that is the figure you have to be able to compete against and win against with SPS. And remember, you have to beat that figure against today's largely natural gas powered grid. With terrestrial solar and/or large scale wind as a supplement that figure will undoubtedly go lower still. If Telsa like technology goes full scale folks might install solar just to fuel their cars and then realize it can stretch to other uses as well. Terrestrial solar and wind drive UP prices unless they are heavily subsidized. -- "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." --George Bernard Shaw |
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Power Satellite Economics
On 6/9/2017 5:24 AM, Fred J. McCall wrote:
David Spain wrote: Terrestrial solar and wind drive UP prices unless they are heavily subsidized. Oh no argument from me. And if heavily subsidized the cost is shifted from direct payment of an electric bill to the indirect payment through higher taxes so you could have removed the "...unless" part of that. The only reason an electric car makes economic sense is if your electric bill per kw/hour per mile is lower than what you'd pay directly for gasoline, and the cost to maintain an EV over a gas powered car. If you are willing to amortize the cost of that electricity over several years you might be able to reduce the cost by installing solar to supplement grid electricity for charging your electric car. You'd need something like a Tesla Power-Wall so that presumably you can recharge during the day when the car is away at work and then transfer from the Power-Wall to the car at night. Not as efficient but doable. Or.... If you work for certain companies, your employer may offer free charging stations for daytime recharging of your EV. I know two Chevy Volt owners and one Tesla owner who are very happy with their choice so far. I had an article one Prius I bought used but was unhappy with the way the computer was programmed in it that made it unsuitable for winter driving IMO. Well that and the fact that the electric steering unit would fail at low speed and Toyota told me they only warranted those defective $1,300 dollar items once and mine had been replaced already... Hence I am an ex-Prius owner. Hopefully the newer ones are better... They must be judging by the sheer numbers of surviving drivers.... Dave |
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Power Satellite Economics
David Spain wrote:
On 6/9/2017 5:24 AM, Fred J. McCall wrote: Terrestrial solar and wind drive UP prices unless they are heavily subsidized. Oh no argument from me. And if heavily subsidized the cost is shifted from direct payment of an electric bill to the indirect payment through higher taxes so you could have removed the "...unless" part of that. Just trying to keep anyone from leaping on 'consumer cost' and making claims that don't stand up. The only reason an electric car makes economic sense is if your electric bill per kw/hour per mile is lower than what you'd pay directly for gasoline, and the cost to maintain an EV over a gas powered car. If you are willing to amortize the cost of that electricity over several years you might be able to reduce the cost by installing solar to supplement grid electricity for charging your electric car. You'd need something like a Tesla Power-Wall so that presumably you can recharge during the day when the car is away at work and then transfer from the Power-Wall to the car at night. Not as efficient but doable. Or.... If you work for certain companies, your employer may offer free charging stations for daytime recharging of your EV. You have to include impacts to make and dispose of batteries. For short distance drivers electric cars probably make perfect sense. I know two Chevy Volt owners and one Tesla owner who are very happy with their choice so far. I had an article one Prius I bought used but was unhappy with the way the computer was programmed in it that made it unsuitable for winter driving IMO. Well that and the fact that the electric steering unit would fail at low speed and Toyota told me they only warranted those defective $1,300 dollar items once and mine had been replaced already... Hence I am an ex-Prius owner. Hopefully the newer ones are better... They must be judging by the sheer numbers of surviving drivers.... My sister has a Prius and it seems like an OK car. I, on the other hand, have a BMW 435i and it seems like an even more OK car. :-) -- "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." --George Bernard Shaw |
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Power Satellite Economics
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Power Satellite Economics
On Jun/18/2017 at 3:21 PM, Fred J. McCall wrote :
David Spain wrote: On 6/9/2017 5:24 AM, Fred J. McCall wrote: Terrestrial solar and wind drive UP prices unless they are heavily subsidized. Oh no argument from me. And if heavily subsidized the cost is shifted from direct payment of an electric bill to the indirect payment through higher taxes so you could have removed the "...unless" part of that. Just trying to keep anyone from leaping on 'consumer cost' and making claims that don't stand up. [Sorry if this is posted twice, I posted it 90 minutes ago, but I don't see it on the news group.] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...aper-than-wind excerpts: "But now unsubsidized solar is beginning to outcompete coal and natural gas on a larger scale, and notably, new solar projects in emerging markets are costing less to build than wind projects, according to fresh data from Bloomberg New Energy Finance. " "Auctions, where private companies compete for massive contracts to provide electricity, established record after record for cheap solar power. It started with a contract in January to produce electricity for $64 per megawatt-hour in India; then a deal in August pegging $29.10 per megawatt hour in Chile. That’s record-cheap electricity—roughly half the price of competing coal power." Alain Fournier |
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