The Moon's poles have shifted over time.

On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:26:16 PM UTC+1, oriel36 wrote:

The lunar day/night cycle is a consequence of the moon's motion around the Earth

Yes, it has "dual surface rotations" - it goes around the Earth once a month, and during that orbit, it spins once on its axis, causing the Sun to rise and set once per month.

On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:23:44 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:13:50 PM UTC+1, oriel36 wrote:

The natural inequality in the total length of the natural noon cycles are from the same cause as the seasons.

The variation in length of the day over a year is because of the elliptical shape of Earth's orbit. This has an influence on the seasons, but we would still have seasons even if the orbit was perfectly circular because of axial tilt.


We have the seasons because of the planet's dual surface rotations to the Sun corresponding to the planet's two distinct day/night cycles.

'Axial tilt' doesn't cause the Sun come into view at the Equinox nor the present twilight at the South pole which will eventually turn to polar night -

http://www.usap.gov/videoclipsandmaps/spwebcam.cfm

This is a real location on the planet with a unique observation where the Sun will be out of view for close to 6 months as that location has now turned through the planet's circle of illumination and into the orbital shadow/umbra of the Earth.

The degree of inclination serves a much more important purpose in defining a planet's climate within a spectrum as the planet's North/South poles turn parallel to the orbital plane and it is this relationship that is crucial for researching climate. Of course the orbital surface rotation and the motion of the polar points are always orthogonal to the circle of illumination and subsequently parallel to the orbital plane -

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...precession.svg

This 'axial precession' doesn't happen, it was a throwback to the flawed framework inherited from geocentric astronomy and used by the original heliocentric astronomy constructed on using the motion of the Sun through the constellations. Maybe another participant will inform you how this has changed to the line-of-sight motion of the stars behind the central Sun but like much else it is in the archives.

Speaking to somebody who can't associate a planetary sunrise and sunset due to a rotation and this extends to daily rotation can be quite an experience although I wouldn't recommend it.

On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:41:10 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:26:16 PM UTC+1, oriel36 wrote:

The lunar day/night cycle is a consequence of the moon's motion around the Earth

Yes, it has "dual surface rotations" - it goes around the Earth once a month, and during that orbit, it spins once on its axis, causing the Sun to rise and set once per month.

You can't expect me to equate the lunar orbital motion around the Earth as 'rotation' because this is descending to an uncomfortable intellectual level no matter how many times I see it.

A simple analogy of walking around an object with an outstretched arm imitating the moon's orbital motion of the Earth should be enough for anyone as to why we see the same side of the round moon but I went way beyond this analogy by showing where Newton was getting his 'moon rotation' from by a misreading of revolution for orbital motion via Kepler.

Orbital motion is where all parts of the planet travel through space at the same speed, daily rotation on the other hand has a maximum equatorial speed diminishing to zero at the polar latitudes. This is why the poles turn to the central Sun and act as a window into the orbital behavior of the Earth..

The dynamical cause for the variations in the natural noon cycle are the same globally for this reason but this insight is way,way ahead of people who have trouble associating sunrise and sunset with planetary rotation.

oriel36 wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:41:10 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:26:16 PM UTC+1, oriel36 wrote:

The lunar day/night cycle is a consequence of the moon's motion around the Earth

Yes, it has "dual surface rotations" - it goes around the Earth once a
month, and during that orbit, it spins once on its axis, causing the Sun
to rise and set once per month.

You can't expect me to equate the lunar orbital motion around the Earth
as 'rotation' because this is descending to an uncomfortable intellectual
level no matter how many times I see it.

A simple analogy of walking around an object with an outstretched arm
imitating the moon's orbital motion of the Earth should be enough for
anyone as to why we see the same side of the round moon but I went way
beyond this analogy by showing where Newton was getting his 'moon
rotation' from by a misreading of revolution for orbital motion via Kepler.

Orbital motion is where all parts of the planet travel through space at
the same speed, daily rotation on the other hand has a maximum equatorial
speed diminishing to zero at the polar latitudes. This is why the poles
turn to the central Sun and act as a window into the orbital behavior of the Earth.

The dynamical cause for the variations in the natural noon cycle are the
same globally for this reason but this insight is way,way ahead of people
who have trouble associating sunrise and sunset with planetary rotation.





Here's another video for you:



http://youtu.be/9Ml4_Jv_HkE

On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 7:04:22 AM UTC-7, oriel36 wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 2:42:00 PM UTC+1, palsing wrote:
You will NEVER convince Gerald that the moon rotates, he does not have the gift of perception and is not capable of learning anything from anyone here or from any links you may provide.

You have been insisting for years that there are more rotations than there are 24 hour days so it is no wonder you couldn't manage to appreciate polar sunrise and sunset as coming from a separation rotation to daily rotation.

palsing wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 7:04:22 AM UTC-7, oriel36 wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 2:42:00 PM UTC+1, palsing wrote:
You will NEVER convince Gerald that the moon rotates, he does not have
the gift of perception and is not capable of learning anything from
anyone here or from any links you may provide.

You have been insisting for years that there are more rotations than
there are 24 hour days so it is no wonder you couldn't manage to
appreciate polar sunrise and sunset as coming from a separation rotation
to daily rotation.

" It is a fact not generally known that,owing to the difference between
solar and sidereal time,the Earth rotates upon its axis once more often
than there are days in the year" NASA /Harvard

I would have thought that in over two decades at least one person would
affirm that the Sun coming into view would be as a result of one
rotation of the planet but haven't seen anyone who can actually
associate a sunrise and sunset due to a rotating planet.

I wouldn't know what it feels like to force yourself to believe a
sunrise/sunset is Not a consequence of rotation and specifically polar sunrise and sunset

Yet again you are a bald-faced liar...

https://groups.google.com/forum/?fro...bG0%5B26-50%5D

What part of "I agree 100% that days and rotations keep in step, as long
as we are talking about regular days like Monday and Tuesday, and
rotations with respect to the Sun, like from midnight to midnight or from
noon to noon" don't you understand?

By the way, didn't you claim that you "weren't going to deal with me
anymore?" Another tall tail...


Remember he's withdrawn from this forum several times already. But he's
still here.

On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 8:47:02 AM UTC-7, Mike Collins wrote:
oriel36 wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:41:10 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 3:26:16 PM UTC+1, oriel36 wrote:

The lunar day/night cycle is a consequence of the moon's motion around the Earth

Yes, it has "dual surface rotations" - it goes around the Earth once a
month, and during that orbit, it spins once on its axis, causing the Sun
to rise and set once per month.

You can't expect me to equate the lunar orbital motion around the Earth
as 'rotation' because this is descending to an uncomfortable intellectual
level no matter how many times I see it.

A simple analogy of walking around an object with an outstretched arm
imitating the moon's orbital motion of the Earth should be enough for
anyone as to why we see the same side of the round moon but I went way
beyond this analogy by showing where Newton was getting his 'moon
rotation' from by a misreading of revolution for orbital motion via Kepler.

Orbital motion is where all parts of the planet travel through space at
the same speed, daily rotation on the other hand has a maximum equatorial
speed diminishing to zero at the polar latitudes. This is why the poles
turn to the central Sun and act as a window into the orbital behavior of the Earth.

The dynamical cause for the variations in the natural noon cycle are the
same globally for this reason but this insight is way,way ahead of people
who have trouble associating sunrise and sunset with planetary rotation.





Here's another video for you:



http://youtu.be/9Ml4_Jv_HkE

Terrific video... I learned something I didn't know, always a joy.

\Paul A

Polar sunrise -

https://antarcticarctic.files.wordpr...sept21_hdr.jpg

Daily sunrise -

http://c.tadst.com/gfx/750x500/sunrise.jpg?1

People may be afraid of being bullied by a dour and sour crowd and then go on to convince themselves none of this matters however a society or at least a section of society that doesn't use its reasoning and interpretative faculties will create an intellectual societal atmosphere within the autism spectrum.

The two distinct sunrises in those images are every bit as astronomical as any other out there of the celestial arena but they draw the observer to thinking about the Earth's dual rotations responsible for both types of sunrises.

This is a gift so don't waste it.

In article ,
oriel36 wrote:

On Friday, April 1, 2016 at 2:04:14 PM UTC+1, Mike Collins wrote:
http://www.psi.edu/news/sieglermoontilt

Every day is April fools day with empiricists, after all, people who look up
at the moon and declare is spins while being dead serious are wanting in
many,many ways.


Imagine for a moment that the Earth has been suddenly transported away
by some evil race of carnivorous aliens that wish to farm us in their
own galaxy. Now imagine what the motion of the moon around the sun would
look like. A year would be about 12 days long, but there would be days
followed by night. A) if the moon didn't rotate at all there would be
one day per year. B) if the moon rotated once per year there would be
perpetual night on one side and day on the other. but C) it rotates
faster than that. (just much slower than the Earth)

The recent emergence of celestial sphere software has created a proliferation of celestial sphere explanations including the notorious tilting circle of illumination pivoting off the Equator using an idea of the Sun's motion across the Equator to explain the Equinox and the seasons -

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap140319.html

I can't answer every half-wit assertion by the celestial sphere enthusiasts using the apparent motion of the stars in circumpolar motion (celestial sphere) however the proof of the Earth's orbital motion does use the change in position of the stars to the central Sun minus circumpolar motion -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeQwYrfmvoQ

If a curious person asked how would astronomers know that the Earth is moving around the Sun ,the easiest means is to point out that stars go from an evening appearance (left side of the central Sun) to a dawn appearance (right side) with an intervening period where these stars are lost behind the glare of the Sun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdFrE7hWj0A

As long as people try to force observations into a rotating celestial sphere they will never judge the most important observations correctly and specifically the relationship between the Earth's daily/ annual motions and terrestrial sciences.