Martin Nova designs online: APR Extra

It's been a while since I've posted a new APR Extras page. Here's a
simple one... some good scans of some Martin Nove super-boosters from
the '60's.

http://www.up-ship.com/apr/extraspace.htm

On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 06:05:23 GMT, Scott Lowther
wrote:

It's been a while since I've posted a new APR Extras page. Here's a
simple one... some good scans of some Martin Nove super-boosters from
the '60's.

http://www.up-ship.com/apr/extraspace.htm

When I first glanced at the Nova drawings I thought, look at all those
little engines. Then I realized, those are F-1's.


Rusty

Rusty wrote in
:

On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 06:05:23 GMT, Scott Lowther
wrote:

It's been a while since I've posted a new APR Extras page. Here's a
simple one... some good scans of some Martin Nove super-boosters from
the '60's.

http://www.up-ship.com/apr/extraspace.htm

When I first glanced at the Nova drawings I thought, look at all those
little engines. Then I realized, those are F-1's.

More likely M-1s, but yeah...

--Damon

too spooky . . . the bottom of the thing reminded me of N-1

In article ,
Damon Hill wrote:
When I first glanced at the Nova drawings I thought, look at all those
little engines. Then I realized, those are F-1's.

More likely M-1s, but yeah...

On some Nova and post-Nova drawings, the cute little engines are F-5s...
(a hypothetical 7.5Mlb LOX/kerosene engine).
--
"Think outside the box -- the box isn't our friend." | Henry Spencer
-- George Herbert |

John wrote:

too spooky . . . the bottom of the thing reminded me of N-1


That's just what I thought of when I saw the bottom view.

Pat

In sci.space.history
Scott Lowther wrote:
It's been a while since I've posted a new APR Extras page. Here's a
simple one... some good scans of some Martin Nove super-boosters from
the '60's.

http://www.up-ship.com/apr/extraspace.htm

Very interesting stuff.

Astronautix has some vague mentions about "reusability":
http://www.astronautix.com/lvfam/nova.htm
...and I noticed small forward-firing landing rockets
(besides forward-firing separation rockets and normal
ullage rockets) in the drawings. Makes me wonder, was
this going to come head-first into the ocean or what?
And the solids will soften the touchdown at last second,
like in Soyuz.

Some of these also have reusable second stages (with
heatshield) and some not.

Would the skirt be enough for stabilization during
entry and in other stages?
I see no parachutes (they would have to be quite big
to make a difference). That would also make the terminal
velocity quite high. If it's 20 meters in diameter and
40 m in length, with weight about 700 tons, how fast would
it come down? Those solids seem awfully small for
cushioning anything...

--
meiza
"Crash programs fail because they are based on a theory that,
with nine women pregnant, you can get a baby a month" -WvB

meiza wrote:

ullage rockets) in the drawings. Makes me wonder, was
this going to come head-first into the ocean


Yup.


Would the skirt be enough for stabilization during
entry and in other stages?


Yup.

I see no parachutes (they would have to be quite big
to make a difference). That would also make the terminal
velocity quite high. If it's 20 meters in diameter and
40 m in length, with weight about 700 tons, how fast would
it come down?

I may have that info somewhere...

Scott Lowther wrote:


I see no parachutes (they would have to be quite big to make a
difference). That would also make the terminal velocity quite high.
If it's 20 meters in diameter and 40 m in length, with weight about
700 tons, how fast would it come down?

I may have that info somewhere...


Zey should be der metal mesh parachutes to vistand der heat and speed of
der deployment.
Zey are stealing my ideas.
Das is not der "Nova", das is der UBERFERRYRAKETEN!

Wernher von Braun

In sci.space.history
Scott Lowther wrote:
meiza wrote:

Would the skirt be enough for stabilization during
entry and in other stages?


Yup.

Funny, since the weight is aft, in the engines,
and the forward section is just empty light tanks,
but I guess they knew their stuff. It's fairly stubby.

I see no parachutes (they would have to be quite big
to make a difference). That would also make the terminal
velocity quite high. If it's 20 meters in diameter and
40 m in length, with weight about 700 tons, how fast would
it come down?

I may have that info somewhere...

I did some sketchy calculations..

With a coefficient of drag 0.3 to 0.5 the terminal velocity
comes to about 300 to 200 m/s .. 0.9 to 0.6 Mach!

With 8 of Star 48 -sized solid motors (5.8 million Ns, weight
2.5 tons apiece) you'd get only 70 m/s deltav, clearly too
little. With GEMs (35 million Ns) there'd be 400 m/s,
if you ignore their weight of 14 tons each (112 tons
total).

So it's something between these two, I doubt the impact
speed could ever have been 100 m/s.

Quite a hefty braking system it must be anyways - and
I wonder what would the solids more precisely be like if
that whole thing would slow down at a few gees, making them
burn out in maybe 10 seconds. Isn't burn time a problem for
big solids, relating to not enough surface area? Even
with 2 g's and 10 seconds burn time, the burn distance
would be one kilometer, giving some serious gravity losses
(i.e. decelerating high is not wise since you only re-
accelerate again by gravity on the way down), which
I haven't taken into account.

And also, not much thrust imbalances can be tolerated
since the motors are located on the outer ring of the
vehicle and there's no compensation systems. What were
the solutions to these problems?

--
meiza
"Crash programs fail because they are based on a theory that,
with nine women pregnant, you can get a baby a month" -WvB