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Artemis 3 Mission in 2024



 
 
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  #1  
Old July 25th 19, 01:07 AM posted to sci.space.policy
Scott Kozel
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Posts: 28
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.

Artemis 3 (previously the Exploration Mission-3 or EM-3), is a planned 2024 flight of NASA's Orion spacecraft to be launched on the Space Launch System. It is planned to be the second crewed mission of the Artemis program and the first crewed lunar landing since Apollo 17 in 1972.

The landing zone would be in the south polar region. It is planned to have two astronauts on the surface of the Moon for about one week.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis_3

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  #2  
Old July 25th 19, 07:28 AM posted to sci.space.policy
William Elliot[_4_]
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Posts: 76
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

On Wed, 24 Jul 2019, Scott Kozel wrote:

Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.

Artemis 3 (previously the Exploration Mission-3 or EM-3), is a
planned 2024 flight of NASA's Orion spacecraft to be launched on the
Space Launch System. It is planned to be the second crewed mission
of the Artemis program and the first crewed lunar landing since
Apollo 17 in 1972.

The landing zone would be in the south polar region. It is planned to have two astronauts on the surface of the Moon for about one week.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis_3


Like the F-35, will Orion be ready for mission?
  #3  
Old July 25th 19, 11:43 AM posted to sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_6_]
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Posts: 1,994
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

In article ,
says...

Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.


Zero chance. This program is a burning dumpster.

Artemis 3 (previously the Exploration Mission-3 or EM-3), is a
planned 2024 flight of NASA's Orion spacecraft to be launched
on the Space Launch System. It is planned to be the second
crewed mission of the Artemis program and the first crewed
lunar landing since Apollo 17 in 1972.


Depends on a crewed lander that is notional, at best. NASA is seeking
proposals for the lander. So they have to go from nothing to an
operational crewed lander (that NASA approves of) in five years. Not
going to happen. The funding required would be at least a couple
billion more a year.

On top of that, NASA has no lunar EVA suits. Those need cash to be
developed. And that's just for a "flags and footprints" mission. To do
something "interesting" they need things like a crewed lunar rover.

The landing zone would be in the south polar region. It is
planned to have two astronauts on the surface of the Moon
for about one week.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis_3

It's a fantasy, IMHO. Will never happen by 2024. Kudos to Bridenstine
for trying to prod NASA into actually doing something, but no bucks, no
Buck Rogers. They'll never get the "blank check" style funding needed
to do this program in that short amount of time.

Jeff
--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.
  #4  
Old July 25th 19, 12:46 PM posted to sci.space.policy
David Spain
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Posts: 2,593
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

On 7/24/2019 8:07 PM, Scott Kozel wrote:
Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.


I'd say improbable... Forgetting minor nits such as the lack of a lander
and lunar EVA suits...

It'll be interesting to see if they actually have a working upper stage
for Block 1 SLS, let alone reliable.

If the Delta III experience of DCSS is any indication of a forerunner
for ICPS...

"The DCSS first flew on 3 Delta IIIs, and failed 2 of 2 times. The
booster failed on the third flight, causing the loss of the DCSS before
ignitions." ..and..

"The Interim Cryogenic Propulsion Stage (ICPS), a modified 5–meter DCSS,
will fly as the upper stage of NASA's Block 1 Space Launch System.[3]
Artemis 1, the first flight, is scheduled for late 2020."

From:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_...c_Second_Stage

A 2nd stage failure would certainly be basis for program delays.

Dave



  #5  
Old July 25th 19, 03:23 PM posted to sci.space.policy
Greg \(Strider\) Moore
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Posts: 666
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

"Scott Kozel" wrote in message
...

Anyone want to predict whet her this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.

Artemis 3 (previously the Exploration Mission-3 or EM-3), is a planned 2024
flight of NASA's Orion spacecraft to be launched on the Space Launch
System. It is planned to be the second crewed mission of the Artemis
program and the first crewed lunar landing since Apollo 17 in 1972.

The landing zone would be in the south polar region. It is planned to have
two astronauts on the surface of the Moon for about one week.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis_3


Yeah, I wouldn't be holding my breath on this one, or placing any long term
bets.

--
Greg D. Moore http://greenmountainsoftware.wordpress.com/
CEO QuiCR: Quick, Crowdsourced Responses. http://www.quicr.net
IT Disaster Response -
https://www.amazon.com/Disaster-Resp...dp/1484221834/

  #6  
Old July 26th 19, 04:30 AM posted to sci.space.policy
Scott Kozel
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 28
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

On Thursday, July 25, 2019 at 6:46:32 AM UTC-5, David Spain wrote:
On 7/24/2019 8:07 PM, Scott Kozel wrote:
Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.


I'd say improbable... Forgetting minor nits such as the lack of a lander
and lunar EVA suits...

It'll be interesting to see if they actually have a working upper stage
for Block 1 SLS, let alone reliable.

If the Delta III experience of DCSS is any indication of a forerunner
for ICPS...

"The DCSS first flew on 3 Delta IIIs, and failed 2 of 2 times. The
booster failed on the third flight, causing the loss of the DCSS before
ignitions." ..and..

"The Interim Cryogenic Propulsion Stage (ICPS), a modified 5–meter DCSS,
will fly as the upper stage of NASA's Block 1 Space Launch System.[3]
Artemis 1, the first flight, is scheduled for late 2020."

From:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_...c_Second_Stage

A 2nd stage failure would certainly be basis for program delays.


In addition to having a lander and EVA suits designed and built, need
to have some recent experience in using them, including with current
astronauts.

Also need recent experience with rendezvous and docking, including with
current astronauts.

All these well supplied in Gemini and the first 3 Apollo/Saturn V missions,
before the landing mission.

Doing a circumlunar mission and then a landing mission in 2024 sounds
good on paper, but I suspect that they need a lot more current
experience of the type in the 1960s above, if they want to be
successful.
  #7  
Old July 26th 19, 07:27 AM posted to sci.space.policy
William Elliot[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 76
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.


It won't happen until China has a man on the moon.

Artemis 3 (previously the Exploration Mission-3 or EM-3), is a planned 2024 flight of NASA's Orion spacecraft to be launched on the Space Launch System. It is planned to be the second crewed mission of the Artemis program and the first crewed lunar landing since Apollo 17 in 1972.
The landing zone would be in the south polar region. It is planned to have two astronauts on the surface of the Moon for about one week.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis_3


If weren't for thea Russian Sputnik, would US have a space program?
  #8  
Old July 26th 19, 12:32 PM posted to sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_6_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,994
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

In article ,
says...

On Thursday, July 25, 2019 at 6:46:32 AM UTC-5, David Spain wrote:
On 7/24/2019 8:07 PM, Scott Kozel wrote:
Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.


I'd say improbable... Forgetting minor nits such as the lack of a lander
and lunar EVA suits...

It'll be interesting to see if they actually have a working upper stage
for Block 1 SLS, let alone reliable.

If the Delta III experience of DCSS is any indication of a forerunner
for ICPS...

"The DCSS first flew on 3 Delta IIIs, and failed 2 of 2 times. The
booster failed on the third flight, causing the loss of the DCSS before
ignitions." ..and..

"The Interim Cryogenic Propulsion Stage (ICPS), a modified 5?meter DCSS,
will fly as the upper stage of NASA's Block 1 Space Launch System.[3]
Artemis 1, the first flight, is scheduled for late 2020."

From:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_...c_Second_Stage

A 2nd stage failure would certainly be basis for program delays.


In addition to having a lander and EVA suits designed and built, need
to have some recent experience in using them, including with current
astronauts.

Also need recent experience with rendezvous and docking, including with
current astronauts.


We already have that with commercial crew. Also, computers are so much
better than they were in the 60s, much of rendezvous and docking is
automated. This was demonstrated on the first, uncrewed, Dragon 2
mission to ISS. Mostly the astronauts just monitored Dragon 2 as it
approached ISS and docked.

Honestly, the equations aren't *that* hard. I know a guy who used to
help write the Rendezvous and Proximity Operations (RPOP) software for
use on laptops during the space shuttle program. That sort of software
is now built into the flight control system of new vehicles that are
designed to autonomously rendezvous and dock.

Jeff
--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.
  #9  
Old July 26th 19, 12:37 PM posted to sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_6_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,994
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

In article m,
says...

Anyone want to predict whether this will actually happen in 2024?
It would be interesting for sure.


It won't happen until China has a man on the moon.

Artemis 3 (previously the Exploration Mission-3 or EM-3), is a planned 2024 flight of NASA's Orion spacecraft to be launched on the Space Launch System. It is planned to be the second crewed mission of the Artemis program and the first crewed lunar landing since Apollo 17 in 1972.
The landing zone would be in the south polar region. It is planned to have two astronauts on the surface of the Moon for about one week.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis_3

If weren't for thea Russian Sputnik, would US have a space program?


Yes, but it would have surely been much slower and more methodical. The
original plan for a lunar mission would have used Earth Orbit Rendezvous
(EOR) to assemble (by docking) all of the bits you needed in a low earth
orbit before firing the engines on the earth departure stage. This
would have been much more sustainable because you wouldn't have needed
such a large (expensive) launch vehicle.

Plus such an approach nicely dovetails with building earth orbiting
space stations and the like.

The actual Space Race was short and sweet and sent us down the dead end
of large expendable launch vehicles. Unfortunately, NASA has gone down
that same dead end yet again with Ares/SLS. It's simply not
sustainable.

I write this on the morning after Starhopper made its first successful
hop. This was the first flight of a full flow staged combustion liquid
fueled rocket engine. That is a sustainable, reusable, approach to
spaceflight. I'm glad SpaceX is pursuing this, because NASA dropped the
ball long ago on reusabilty.

Jeff
--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.
  #10  
Old July 26th 19, 12:51 PM posted to sci.space.policy
David Spain
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,593
Default Artemis 3 Mission in 2024

On 7/26/2019 2:27 AM, William Elliot wrote:

If weren't for thea Russian Sputnik, would US have a space program?


An interesting question. I would say, yes, but it would have looked very
differently from what we remember and it would have been primarily a US
Air Force program working in conjunction with the NACA.

Sputnik was inevitable, but the *real* story is that Von Braun's team
was ready to add a small 3rd kick stage to the Jupiter C rocket a year
or so *before* Sputnik, that would have put a satellite into orbit, but
Eisenhower nixed the idea. Why I'll never know. Had that been done,
likely no panic, no NASA and no moon program.

Given that alternative history, knowing that orbit was possible there
would no doubt have been a push within the USAF to add a booster kick
stage to the air-dropped X-15, and made its own engines re-startable in
order to get it into orbit and back down. And the public would have
never known about splash-downs as it would have glided down and landed
at a runway, probably the dry lake bed at Edwards.

Where it would have gone from there is anyone's guess. Maybe a manned
orbiting "spy" er "laboratory" platform. There was the USAF Dyna-Soar
program aka the X-20 that would have launched on a Titan-III but that
was cancelled. That is a close as I know of to an *alternative* US space
program.

Dave
 




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