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The Action of the dying Sun



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 25th 04, 03:28 PM
G=EMC^2 Glazier
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Default The Action of the dying Sun

Why does the sun expand out as far as Jupiter before it contracts all
the way back to becoming a White Dwarf? Our sun would end up as a
neutron star if it had 50% more mass. A star with to much mass is not
beneficial for life. I don't think rock planets could form if their sun
only lasted for 100 million years. Lets go with that supermassive star
Eta Carinae it had a giant outburst,and released as much energy as a
supernova. This star is still around. Hmmmm How did it survive that
explosion? Astronomers estimate its mass to be 100 times that of the
sun. With that mass it should end up as a blackhole. It could be the
seed for another mini-bang that will reach a critical mass,and the
moment it stops spinning its horizon will collape into the core,and
release its singularity. to create a mirror image of the universe it
was recycled from.(I love that idea) Bert

  #2  
Old January 25th 04, 06:41 PM
Luigi Caselli
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"G=EMC^2 Glazier" ha scritto nel messaggio
...
Why does the sun expand out as far as Jupiter before it contracts all
the way back to becoming a White Dwarf? Our sun would end up as a
neutron star if it had 50% more mass. A star with to much mass is not
beneficial for life. I don't think rock planets could form if their sun
only lasted for 100 million years. Lets go with that supermassive star
Eta Carinae it had a giant outburst,and released as much energy as a
supernova. This star is still around. Hmmmm How did it survive that
explosion? Astronomers estimate its mass to be 100 times that of the
sun. With that mass it should end up as a blackhole. It could be the
seed for another mini-bang that will reach a critical mass,and the
moment it stops spinning its horizon will collape into the core,and
release its singularity. to create a mirror image of the universe it
was recycled from.(I love that idea) Bert


What about if Eta Carinae will become a gravastar?
Or this theory is completely wrong?

Luigi Caselli



  #3  
Old January 25th 04, 07:05 PM
John Zinni
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"G=EMC^2 Glazier" wrote in message
...
Why does the sun expand out as far as Jupiter before it contracts all
the way back to becoming a White Dwarf?


Our sun would end up as a
neutron star if it had 50% more mass.


"The stars that eventually become neutron stars are thought to start out
with about 15 to 30 times the mass of our sun."
http://www.astro.umd.edu/~miller/nstar.html#formation


A star with to much mass is not
beneficial for life. I don't think rock planets could form if their sun
only lasted for 100 million years. Lets go with that supermassive star
Eta Carinae it had a giant outburst,and released as much energy as a
supernova. This star is still around. Hmmmm How did it survive that
explosion? Astronomers estimate its mass to be 100 times that of the
sun. With that mass it should end up as a blackhole. It could be the
seed for another mini-bang that will reach a critical mass,and the
moment it stops spinning its horizon will collape into the core,and
release its singularity. to create a mirror image of the universe it
was recycled from.(I love that idea) Bert



  #4  
Old January 25th 04, 07:37 PM
G=EMC^2 Glazier
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Hi Casselli I never heard of a "gravastar" Sounds interesting please
explain. Bert

  #5  
Old January 25th 04, 07:45 PM
G=EMC^2 Glazier
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JohnZ Read that book again. In my book (just studied it),and it tells
me a star with 1.4 mass greater than the sun would end up as a neurton
star. However JohnZ we should stop throwing books at each other,and
discuss things. You started it so you have to end it.. My books are
heavier than yours,and I can add more pages to it for sure. Bert

  #6  
Old January 25th 04, 08:01 PM
John Zinni
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"G=EMC^2 Glazier" wrote in message
...
JohnZ Read that book again. In my book (just studied it),and it tells
me a star with 1.4 mass greater than the sun would end up as a neurton
star. However JohnZ we should stop throwing books at each other,and
discuss things. You started it so you have to end it.. My books are
heavier than yours,and I can add more pages to it for sure. Bert


Nonsense. Your "Heavy Books" probably say something like "a Neutron Star is
about 1.4 solar masses". A Neutron Star does not contain the entire mass of
its progenitor. I suggest you take a closer look at your "Heavy Books".


  #7  
Old January 25th 04, 08:25 PM
John Zinni
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"G=EMC^2 Glazier" wrote in message
...
JohnZ Read that book again. In my book (just studied it),and it tells
me a star with 1.4 mass greater than the sun would end up as a neurton
star.


"It is believed that the remnant of a core collapse SN is a neutron star if
the mass of the progenitor is less than ~ 20-25M(Sun) [80, 78]. If the
progenitor's mass is in the range 20-25 ~ M ~ 40-50M(Sun), not the entire
star is ejected in the SN explosion. More than 2M(Sun) will fall back onto
the nascent neutron star and lead to black hole formation. If the
progenitor's mass exceeds roughly 40-50M(Sun), then no explosion will occur
and the star will collapse directly to a black hole. These objects are known
as collapsars. However, it is unclear if high metallicity stars with M ~
40-50M(Sun) actually end their lives in collapse or are prevented from doing
so by stellar wind driven mass loss [78]. Note that the limits on the
progenitor masses quoted in this paragraph (especially the 40-45M(Sun),
lower limit for direct black hole formation) are uncertain because the
progenitor mass dependence of the neutrino explosion mechanism (see below)
is unknown [88, 150]."
http://www.emis.de/journals/LRG/Arti...new/node9.html


However JohnZ we should stop throwing books at each other,and
discuss things. You started it so you have to end it.. My books are
heavier than yours,and I can add more pages to it for sure. Bert




  #8  
Old January 25th 04, 10:44 PM
G=EMC^2 Glazier
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JohnZ Using far less words than you because the books I read come
right to the point. The Chandrasekhar mass is roughly 1.4 suns,and just
above this limit gravity squeezes the electrons and protons together. We
call this density a neutron star. Yes I do have the book and page
number. Well I do know a neutron star has 3 times less mass than a
blackhole. So that might help your saying 40 times a sun
mass.(hopefully) JohnZ why do you have to always be negative? Bert

  #9  
Old January 26th 04, 12:53 AM
John Zinni
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"G=EMC^2 Glazier" wrote in message
...
JohnZ Using far less words than you because the books I read come
right to the point. The Chandrasekhar mass is roughly 1.4 suns,and just
above this limit gravity squeezes the electrons and protons together. We
call this density a neutron star. Yes I do have the book and page
number. Well I do know a neutron star has 3 times less mass than a
blackhole. So that might help your saying 40 times a sun
mass.(hopefully) JohnZ why do you have to always be negative? Bert


A reminder of your original statement ...

Our sun would end up as a
neutron star if it had 50% more mass.


This is simply untrue.

A Main Sequence star with a mass below ~8M(Sun) is destined to end its life
as a White Dwarf with a mass 1.4M(Sun).

A Main Sequence star with a mass between ~8M(Sun) and ~20-25M(Sun) is
destined to end its life as a Neutron Star with a mass between 1.4M(Sun) and
~2-3M(Sun).

A Main Sequence star with a mass above ~20-25M(Sun) is destined to end its
life as a Black Hole with a mass ~2-3M(Sun).

Check your "Heavy Books" yet again.


  #10  
Old January 26th 04, 05:12 AM
Greysky
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"G=EMC^2 Glazier" wrote in message
...
Why does the sun expand out as far as Jupiter before it contracts all
the way back to becoming a White Dwarf?


Action / reaction. The core contracts inwards and the rest of the sun will
have to go the other way. Over its lifetime, as the sun begins to sputter
out just before it begins to go from burning hydrogen to helium, the sun's
outer envelope will expand outwards as the core contracts. Eventually, when
there is no further elemental burning possible for our sun, the core
collapses to a pukey Neutron star and the rest of the sun just keeps
expanding forever in the form of a planetary nebule. If you want to know
more, get our alien friends in Regulus to e-mail you some pretty pictures of
other stars that end their life with not a bang but a whimper.

Greysky

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