Terraforming the moon, before doing Mars or Venus

lol, I find it a bit funny how you go about your topics, making up
about 90% of all the posts, then having to deal with people criticizing
you about it. Seems like it happens a lot.

I'm not implying anything, as a matter of fact I enjoy reading your
posts, as they are informative and offer another view on things.

"Brad Guth" wrote in message
news:fbf13c0c5f67f690a967913e207b7077.49644@mygate .mailgate.org

From: Z 1 Y 0 N 3 X
lol, I find it a bit funny how you go about your topics, making up
about 90% of all the posts, then having to deal with people criticizing
you about it. Seems like it happens a lot.

Where's your topic constructive input: ?????????
Got anything worthy to share, besides your crapolla?


I'm not implying anything, as a matter of fact I enjoy reading your
posts, as they are informative and offer another view on things.

You're a serial liar, and that's because you're implying way more than
your fair share, while you're also the pagan born-again sort of liar
(just like our resident LLPOF warlord GW Bush), as well as you're also
the infomercial spewing bigot of a liar and the brown-nosed minion to
the Jewish Third Reich at the same time. Way to go LLPOF "Z 1 Y 0 N 3
X".

Unlike yourself and those of your kind, I'm sharing the absolute best
available truth and nothing but the truth, whereas you "Z 1 Y 0 N 3 X"
don't even exist as a real person, you're not even a very good MI6/NSA
spook, much less rusemaster certified.

As I'd said directly to our warm and fuzzy NASA collective as of 7 years
ago and counting, there's other intelligent life existing/coexisting on
Venus.

The laws of physics simply haven't changed, and the replicated science
has only gotten better.

The gauntlet of topic/author stalking, bashings and banishments has also
gotten a whole lot better at deploying their spermware/****ware at my
poor old PC.

Besides the laws of physics and replicated science that's on my side,
I've got my observationology of deductive interpretations as to those
nifty SAR pictures, whereas they've got less than squat, it's that
simple, except you're too much of a village idiot moron to even realize
that much.

The intellectual and/or scientific blockage isn't mine, and at least
unlike the mainstream status quo (much like yourself) that'll eat their
own kind, I always flush after using the toilet.
-
Brad Guth


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

"Brad Guth" wrote in message
news:fbf13c0c5f67f690a967913e207b7077.49644@mygate .mailgate.org

Mailgate/Usenet is still terribly slow to impossible, if not getting
itself a little too stealth moderated, for getting much of anything from
our lord and all-knowing GOOGLE/NOVA/Usenet to show as updated. Sorry
about that.

From: Z 1 Y 0 N 3 X
lol, I find it a bit funny how you go about your topics, making up
about 90% of all the posts, then having to deal with people criticizing
you about it. Seems like it happens a lot.

Where's your supposed better than my topic constructive input: ?????????
Got anything worthy to share, besides your NASA infomercial or
whatever's faith-based crapolla?


I'm not implying anything, as a matter of fact I enjoy reading your
posts, as they are informative and offer another view on things.

Yes you and others of your kind are in fact implying lots. You're
actually a serial liar, and that's because for starters your actions
alone are implying way more than your fair share, while you're also the
pagan born-again sort of liar (just like our resident LLPOF warlord GW
Bush), as well as you're also the infomercial spewing bigot of a liar
and the brown-nosed minion to the Jewish Third Reich at the same time.
Way to go LLPOF "Z 1 Y 0 N 3 X".

It's the butt sitters like yourself is exactly what made the likes of
Hitler and our resident LLPOF warlord(GW Bush) as controlling and
powerful as they are. Those nice Cathars were also exterminated because
of folks like yourself, and the list goes on and on. You claim to know
better, but instead you accomplish nothing that'll save the day, or much
less another soul.

Unlike yourself and those of your kind that are so afraid of your own
shadow, I'm sharing the absolute best available truth and nothing but
the truth, whereas you "Z 1 Y 0 N 3 X" don't even exist as a real
person, and you're not even a very good MI6/NSA spook, much less
rusemaster certified.

As I'd said directly and rather nicely to our warm and fuzzy NASA
collective, as of 7 years ago and counting, there's other intelligent
life existing/coexisting on Venus, and it's plain as day unless you're a
braille astronomer or one of those braille MI6/NSA spooks that spotted
all of those Muslim/Islamic WMD, jet can't manage to locate big old
Usama bin Laden and his GW Bush posy.

In case you folks haven't noticed, the laws of physics simply haven't
changed, and the replicated science has only gotten better. However,
the gauntlet of your topic/author stalking, bashings and banishments has
gotten a whole lot better at deploying spermware/****ware at nailing my
poor old PC.

Besides the laws of physics and replicated science that's clearly on my
side, I've also got my observationology of deductive interpretations as
to those nifty SAR pictures, whereas my opposition has got less than
squat, it's that simple, except you're too much of a village idiot moron
to even realize that much.

The intellectual and/or scientific blockage isn't mine, and at least
unlike the mainstream status quo (much like yourself) that'll knowingly
eat their own kind or having allowed others to put the likes of Jesus
Christ on a stick, whereas I always flush after using the toilet.
-
Brad Guth


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

"Brad Guth" wrote in message
news:c1c9806fff82c2fa95371aac99678943.49644@mygate .mailgate.org

Unlike our foreign exchange moon that's merely a bit salty and otherwise
extremely nasty to your DNA, Venus is still offering more than a toasty
hot-foot, though it's from the inside out:

What we need is a good robotic VL2 outpost, of a viable halo
station-keeping sort of Clarke Station as our next ISS platform that's
good for the safe keeping of a crew for at least 19 months at a time.
Technically, I believe this task is affordably obtainable, possibly even
via Robert Bigelow’s POOF.

As I'd thoughtfully shared so many times before, that for other than
establishing my LSE-CM/ISS before China or Russia does, notions of
terraforming the moon (though technically doable) is a seriously bad
sort of idea, especially when we've got the ready made-to-order likes of
our not so old Venus cruising so nearby, that's merely a little extra
surface toasty in spots but otherwise perfectly good to go as is.
Fortunately, Venus needs no stinking terraforming, that is unless you're
another certified village idiot moron like our resident LLPOF warlord(GW
Bush).

Because you're all so comfy cozy into play acting as though Venus is so
need-to-know or else hocus-pocus taboo, and otherwise you're all so
clearly mainstream snookered and thus easily dumbfounded by way of all
this; In spite of your own perpetrated gauntlet of having stayed the
course of those silly old thousand lights, here's some old but updated
news you can all use to blow off each of your socks, as well as to blow
off your status quo brown noses with.

I've recently learned that supposedly Earth has been getting rid of
roughly 78~79 millijoules/m2 (with a surface area of 5.112e14 m2 = 40e12
J), in that subsequently this amount of energy represents a sustained
minimum/conservative core loss of 40e12 clean joules. I tend to believe
it's worth at least twice if not 2.5 fold that amount, but that's just
my ongoing village idiot honest swag of deductive thinking a little
outside the box, as to considering what the extra amount(s) of inside
and out tidal induced energy has to contribute. As to further think,
what the hell would we ever do with so many extra terajoules worth of
essentially renewable and clean energy?

Venus at 2625 ~ 2650 j/m2 of average solar influx
(global net solar influx = 132 j/m2)
Surface geothermal energy: 21 j/m2
Surface area: 4.6e14 m2
Mass: 4.87x1024 kg
Density: 5.24 g/cm3
Local gravity: 8.87 m/s2
Escape velocity: 10.3 km/s
Albedo: 0.75 ~ 0.85

Just for sharing off another lose cannon worthy shot in the dark;
At an average surface geothermal radiant heat loss of merely 10 j/m2 =
4.6e15 joules of available core energy would have to exist (that's
roughly half the reported worth of the surplus radiated surface energy
of 21 j/m2 as having been obtained by our previous probes). By way of
any planetology standards, that's absolutely impressive energy at even
10% that amount.

Fortunately, according to the existing and ongoing research of others
(including the ESA virtis / venus express mission w/o PFS), the Venusian
solar influx/radiative energy balance has been running at a measured
loss of providing roughly 15% more energy than having been solar
contributed, which I tend to believe has been a good planetology thing
to know and appreciate as to why Venus is not only currently so toasty
but gradually getting itself cooler by each extremely long
daytime/nighttime season.

Energy flux absorbed by the Earth = 1370 x (1-0.3) / 4 = 239.7 W/m2
Energy flux absorbed by the Venus = 2650 x (1-0.8) / 4 = 132.5 W/m2

(a nifty looking document, but slower than hell if not impossible to
load)
http://planetologia.elte.hu/atlasz/6...vironments.pdf

There's lots of other interesting though otherwise perfectly honest
deductive interpretations as soon becoming a bit outdated information
about the Venus atmosphere from John Ackerman.
http://www.firmament-chaos.com/papers/fvenuspaper.pdf

A whole lot better though willfully incomplete cache of info, and of
what there is to behold is somewhat NASA and/or Old Testament skewed in
order to suit their faith-based 'Earth only' mindset as to intelligent
life, and to otherwise support their one and only greenhouse theory as
representing their one and only viable basis for why Venus is so
freaking hot (too bad the regular laws of physics nor the best available
replicated science do not agree with that silly greenhouse analogy).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Venera13Surface.jpg

http://www.atmos.washington.edu/2002...reenhouse.html
"Even though Venus receives more solar energy than the Earth is, its
effective temperature is colder. This is due to the high albedo on
Venus (0.8): 80% of solar radiation is reflected to space and only 20%
is absorbed by the surface."

Actually it's getting primarily diverted and/or absorbed and rather
nicely transferred about by that extremely thick atmosphere of mostly
dry CO2 and a few hundred spare teratonnes worth of those acidic clouds,
and otherwise the solar influx is extensively moderated by the robust
composite layer of S8, and damn little (perhaps 0.015% of 2650 j/m2) of
the visible spectrum ever directly reaches the surface by means much
other than atmospheric conductive/convection (at least that's exactly
what our own and of those Russian probes have always been telling us).

On a clear and sunny terrestrial day that's existing right here on good
mother Earth, we're looking at better than 800 j/m2 (William Mook having
recently specified 62% as 850 j/m2) that's capable of directly impacting
our deck, and that's roughly 60% of the total solar influx which manages
to contain nearly all of the incoming IR spectrum, and that's not to
mention the secondary/recoil worth of whatever's unavoidably derived
from our extremely large and nearby moon's worth of IR/FIR, nor is there
anything tidal related as forced along by the 2e20 joules of the ongoing
orbital existence of our having that pesky moon to deal with as of the
last ice age. Now that's what I'd call greenhouse warming potential
that's nailing us from our badly polluted top down, especially effective
as our soot and various complex gas byproducts having polluted damn near
every atmospheric and terra m3 in sight, and then some.

In other words, Venus on its far outside/exterior is technically upon
average cooler than Earth's thin and relatively IR transparent
atmospheric realm (Venus being especially cooler by way of their
extended season of nighttime with the exception of the 21 j/m2 of
radiated surface energy), though upon average roughly 132 j/m2 of solar
influx gets absorbed by the entire global environment of Venus (mostly
accommodated within its robust atmosphere that otherwise reflects ~80%),
whereas there's actually a measured 153 j/m2 of nighttime radiated
energy to deal with.

It's all pretty much the killer geothermal realm of its smoking hot
surface of 21 j/m2, along with the impressive atmospheric thermal
contribution that we have to worry about if we're ever planing to walk
upon that toasty orb, getting especially hot-spot/zone nasty in many
geothermal locations of active lava, mud/plastic flows of raw minerals
or worse yet if near or forbid situated upon any of those pesky
geothermal forced S8/CO2 gas vents that should by rights be literally
hotter than hell, and going like a bat out of hell as having been kindly
pointed out to us by John Ackerman.

Of course, so much unlike our wet environment with its relatively clear
and thus solar transparent atmospheric realm of Earth, whereas so much
of the solar IR influx directly reaches our surface, as opposed to the
Venus surface environment being rather well shielded by the fully
clouded atmosphere that also includes a substantial reflective internal
boundary layer of thermal and IR spectrum isolating S8, whereas the
actual solar influx reaching the surface via direct sunlight is thereby
extensively IR filtered/moderated long before reaching that surface, and
otherwise the visual spectrum isn't hardly worth 39 j/m2 at high noon
(the average illumination being at something far less while obviously on
the sunny side, as otherwise of what's mostly local near-IR and IR/FIR
illuminated within their extended season of nighttime), and to be
certain there's hardly any significant amount of incoming solar energy
that's going to be of the IR spectrum.

This leaves us with all of those Venusian departing boat loads of
geothermal energy, of roughly 21 j/m2 that's primarily responsible for
the vast bulk of why it's so freaking toasty on that newish planetology
active deck. Of course, in physics that's a darn good thing to realize
because, via those regular laws of physics is where all sorts of nifty
alternatives for extracting from such renewable energy while you're
sequestered upon Venus becomes doable, making it entirely possible to
sustain as much ice cold beer and even a few indoor ice skating rinks if
you'd like.

Too bad this continually naysay and otherwise anti-think-tank of our
status quo Usenet, that's formulated from within the one and only actual
hell on Earth, that for some pathetic reason(s) can't manage to pull its
infomercial spewing butt-cheeks of its very own faith-based load of
disinformation spewing brains out of the nearest space-toilet,
especially if it's having anything to do with Venus, much less with our
very own physically dark and nearby orbiting mascon of our otherwise GW
worthy moon, that's so unusually massive in its ratio to Earth.
-
Brad Guth


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

In no way did I mean to offend you or anything. I am not posessed by
infomercials, and most definitely blinded by religion. Ziyonex is just
my hacker alias, and I perfer it to my actual name, which is why I use
it, nothing more. I don't quite understand what you mean by calling me
a Liar Liar Pants on Fire... but whatever. I will try to contribute
more to the discussion, and do more research.

I am a little limited by my environment as well, being surrounded by
Montanan hick, redneck morons who, blatently, don't know ****. I am
trying my hardest to get out of here. But anyway, enough with defending
myself.

"Z 1 Y 0 N 3 X" wrote in message
ups.com

In no way did I mean to offend you or anything. I am not posessed by
infomercials, and most definitely blinded by religion. Ziyonex is just
my hacker alias, and I perfer it to my actual name, which is why I use
it, nothing more. I don't quite understand what you mean by calling me
a Liar Liar Pants on Fire... but whatever. I will try to contribute
more to the discussion, and do more research.

Sorry about my lose cannon shot at your private parts. That's very good
to know, and I'll be the first to appreciate and fully credit all that
you can manage to research and share.


I am a little limited by my environment as well, being surrounded by
Montanan hick, redneck morons who, blatently, don't know ****. I am
trying my hardest to get out of here. But anyway, enough with defending
myself.

What are some of your expertise or best interest that I obviously don't
know about?
-
Brad Guth


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

"Brad Guth" wrote in message
news:c1c9806fff82c2fa95371aac99678943.49644@mygate .mailgate.org

I see that our Usenet index has managed to lock out as much user
friendly search features that pertains to Brad Guth, at least as much as
possible has been accomplished without terminating their ongoing Old
Testament thumping ruse/sting of the century.

In case you folks haven't quite noticed, the old "Moon Landing a
Hoax??!! Real Evidence here" topic is just another prime
damage-control example of their intended ruse/sting of our mutually
perpetrated cold-war century, that has recently turned itself into a
global energy domination fiasco which isn't about to end until our fat
lady sings, or otherwise as long as we're in the process of taking as
much Muslim oil as we can before they ever manage to realize just how
dumb and dumber Muslims and Islamics have been snookered all along.

Actual facts as based upon actual history is what supersedes science.

However, nothing supersedes the laws of physics.

Ever since I started in as of 7+ years ago, Venus has been getting more
and more taboo/nondisclosure worthy than our moon. This is rather odd,
being that there's nothing all that insurmountable about Venus, and at
times it's so nearby with the very same moon like face of Venus aligned
with Earth.

However, on behalf of sticking much closer to our home world that's
going GW postal, and otherwise GW Bush postal; If you are surrounded by
the bare minimum of 3.14e6 m2 of somewhat significant mass (especially
if it's of greater density than water), and if there's next to nothing
between yourself and all of that surrounding terrain of naked mass (such
as being situated upon our physically dark moon that should by rights be
deep in meteorite debris and secondary impact shards of everything solar
and cosmic you can think of, including the kitchen sink), whereas the
incoming solar and cosmic energy (as often nasty as that may be) is
going to unavoidably cause the natural secondary/recoil birth of
soft-X-rays, hard-X-rays and gamma radiation like nowhere other.

Human DNA as physically protected by a given spacesuit isn't going to
buy all that much attenuation of said TBI(total body irradiation)
dosage, whereas DNA/RNA damage beyond the point of no return will in
short order transpire regardless of whatever infomercial mainstream
science as based upon those conditional laws of physics has to say. The
status quo of what we've been told will NOT save your sorry moonsuit
butt for long, especially if you're standing upon a modus hill and
thereby exposed to 314e6 m2 if not just as easily trekking upon much
higher terrain that'll buy you 31.4e9 m2 of what's surrounding as
physically hot and nasty in more ways than being merely passive solar
influx and secondary IR/FIR toasty. Therefore, you simply do not
require all that much lethal radiation potential as derived per m2 in
order to amount to getting nailed by a truly great deal of what's there
to behold.

Other than those temporary Chapel Bell deployments on behalf of our
NASA/Apollo fiasco, too bad we still have not so much as once
established a robotic science platform cruising efficiently within the
interactive MEL1/(moon L1) zone that's roughly upon average 58,000 km
from the moon's CG, whereas all sorts of moon and Earth science could
have been affordably and very nicely accomplished as of four decades
ago.

Much like a poofy version of Clarke Station, Bigelow’s proposed Nautilus
station (aka POOF) simply isn't sufficiently shielded nor configured
with an adequate amount of forced heat-exchanging in order to deal with
accommodating us humans along with the 95+% solar + 50% lunar
secondary/recoil of IR/FIR. However, Venus L2 offers quite another
matter that's worth more than a few good arguments on behalf of those
POOF configured space depots, whereas frail human DNA can actually
survive the 19 month onboard stint better off than the to/from commute.
-
Brad Guth


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

"Brad Guth" wrote in message
news:c1c9806fff82c2fa95371aac99678943.49644@mygate .mailgate.org

Accomplishing Venus L2 before our moon's L1 may become the next best
thing to having zero-g sex in space. However, for the moment we seem to
be running ourselves out of talent and resources, not to mention the
necessary loot.

I'm also thinking faith-based science can be a very good thing, as a
common club/cult like binder of moral intentions and motivation as based
upon the remorse of our past that hasn't always gone according to plan,
and otherwise for accomplishing the greater good on behalf of humanity
and that of salvaging our badly failing environment. Earth is
supposedly a complex community of interrelated life like nowhere other
that we know of, yet group after group is into doing all that it can to
take from others while making the future survival of such others as
difficult and/or as spendy as can be accomplished.

Unfortunately, there's nothing all that simple about it, except that it
takes at least two to tango, doesn't it. The question of the day is;
How many ideological faith-based wars are you folks willing to accept
and/or allow to transpire over lies?

Born-again liars seldom if ever tell on one another, do they. Just look
at what the Jews did on behalf of getting and/or allowing Jesus Christ
(one of their own kind) or any other trouble makers to being put on a
stick, or especially at what a Catholic Pope did to those nice Cathars,
and then each group proceeded to lie their born-again infomercial
spewing butts off as though they had the likes of our resident
born-again LLPOF warlord(GW Bush) at the helm.

As per topic/author stalking usual, it's the status quo of "send in the
clowns" of spooks/moles and MIB damage control borgs, or simply
utilizing the sorts of dumbfounded fools like yourself doing their level
best at trying to keep those silly perpetrated cold-war lids on tight,
and of otherwise protecting that fleet of their good ship USS LOLLIPOPs
from sinking into their own cesspools of NASA's infomercial crapolla.

Of course the Russian/USSR space-race and moon efforts were essentially
into doing the very same to their own kind, and if anything it's
currently more so into snookering as much of their kind for all they're
worth, and then some. It's pretty much what absolute *******s of a kind
do best, isn't it?

In spite of all their infomercial spewing gauntlets of mainstream status
quo flak, I think we've been rather nicely snookered (some of us to
death and/or into the poor-house) by those having "the right stuff", and
by that of our mutually perpetrated cold-war(s) that has cost us
precious decades of having badly diverted our best talents, spent our
limited resources and obviously trillions upon trillions of hard earned
dollars, that has now turned itself into a bloody global energy
domination fiasco, plus yet another round of a rather nasty global
inflation that's currently in the task of our taking Muslim oil. At
least that's what I think.

I'm not the least bit anti-moon, it's just that we don't need to walk
upon the physically dark and nasty moon (at least not in person), just
establish and hold onto the moon's L1 zone or gravity nullification
pocket is way more than good enough, that is unless you don't mind China
or perhaps Russia having that sweet spot all to themselves, and that's
pretty much what I and anyone with so much as half a village idiot brain
should think.

By my best interpretation, there was in fact no such moon landings in
the manner suggested by our NASA/Apollo fiasco, whereas that silly
"moontruth" movie was obviously a good spoof on behalf of folks just
like yourself, although it further demonstrates that such impressive
infomercial alternatives were in fact doable, as were many other
photographic examples of what at the time was equally hocus-pocus
MI6/NSA business as per cold-war cloak and dagger usual. As based upon
the regular laws of physics and of the best available science that's
replicated, there's actually 1000% better proof positive that we hadn't
walked on that physically dark and nasty moon of ours, and it's pretty
much of the very same ongoing reasons why it's going to take us another
decade if ever before anyone of our kind actually walks on that
earthshine illuminated moon for a few minutes (possibly a few hours
worth) before reaching their career TBI dosage limits.

Besides accomplishing the moon itself, too bad that EML1/MEL1 (moon's
L1) is still so gosh darn taboo or need-to-know, if not nondisclosure
rated.

EML1 Considerations / by: Rand Simberg

http://mygate.mailgate.org/mynews/sc...ma ilgate.org

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.s...5d992607bb0431

Oddly it's still by far the most payload efficient parking orbit in
town, always in view of Earth, always in view of our side of the moon,
nearly always in the sun, plus getting loads of extra IR/FIR energy off
the moon, as well as getting the full secondary share or gauntlet of
lunar gamma and hard-X-rays that have got to be good for something
besides terminating our frail DNA.

L1 is even close enough that an Apache Point 3.5 meter class of
instrument with an extra 10X projection lens and the 1.5 micron CCD
could easily pull in Apollo details of their original surface
expeditions by way of those various impact deployments, although it
would also put the likes of the Hubble/SST to shame by a good 100 fold
improved resolution at nearly twice the light gathering potential, and
there's certainly no image stacking problems of getting the PhotoShop
composite image resolution of our earthshine illuminated moon down to
well below 1 meter (similar to what KECK can manage if they masked off
99% of each primary mirror).

Remember that in L1 there's almost no limitation as to the focal length
of that secondary mirror, whereas it could just as easily become a full
km if not 1000 km, or perhaps going for the moon itself at 58,000 km
seems entirely doable (there could be a south pole, north pole and the
east/west horizon placements of such secondary mirrors).

L1 as the VLA portion of an SAR image receiving via terrestrial radar
transmitters is of course out of this silly world impressive, not that
it couldn't easily accommodate the entire SAR do-everything of something
10 fold or larger than our shuttle bay configured alternative that from
LEO pulled in 1.5 meter raw image resolutions of Earth, and even that
accomplishment was as of nearly a decade ago.

Perhaps soon enough China will accomplish their initial place-holding
version of my LSE-CM/ISS, thereby control most all of the moon's L1 and
damn near everything related, including the physically dark and salty
moon itself that supposedly has all of that nifty He3 that's so fusion
invaluable, plus offering a cosmic morgue worth of other nifty elements
and a few of those weird ET spores to spare.

The following topic is chuck full of nifty ideas and more than a few
notions for utilizing our moon's L1 (though I've got lots more to say
about L1 than they do). Too bad that it's still so taboo/nondisclosure
rated, with little mention of myself and I believe nothing of any Clarke
Station, other than via my contributions that are excluded and/or in
banishment mode because I tend to ask too many of those pesky questions,
and I otherwise impose too much of the truth and nothing but the truth,
along with my fair share of deductive common sense and a touch of
remorse on behalf of benefiting the lower 99.9% of humanity and perhaps
salvaging our otherwise failing environment to boot.

Location, Location, Location! / by: Space Cadet

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.s...115186067c3a94
-
Brad Guth


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

"Brad Guth" wrote in message
news:c1c9806fff82c2fa95371aac99678943.49644@mygate .mailgate.org

Faith Based Scientists are just paranoid about everything that rocks
their good ship LOLLIPOP, including their own shadows. At least
terraforming our moon or simply digging into that sucker for obtaining a
safe habitat is technically doable from within our own back yard of
known expertise and resources, and best of all we taxpayers can keep a
close eye upon where each and every hard earned dollar is going.

The ongoing notions of utlizing our moon as one of the supposed
"Footsteps to Mars", sorry to say my ass, whereas I'm especially going
naysay postal on this one, especially since we can't seem to mange the
few and affordable steps on behalf of accomplishing our moon's L1, much
less those rather spendy and somewhat lethal steps upon our naked moon.

For your continuing entertainment, I've further edited and hopefully
improved upon the following rant as to what I and others should care the
most about:

Here's a little something extra special for Discovery Communications
and/or GOOGLE/NOVA to ponder their pay-per-infomercial spewing way
through. In other words, if I could pay as well as MI/NSA~NASA, they'd
gladly produce whatever as though it was the one and only truth on
Earth.

Instead of our going for the absolutely daunting and unavoidably time
comsuming as well as spendy task of our accomplishing the moon itself,
perhaps instead we or perhaps China should simply go for taking the
moon's L1 because, at least that's entirely doable and extremely
valuable as a space depot and science platform.

As I've often shared this one befo
If we're ever going to walk upon that physically dark and nasty moon of
ours that's via gravity tidal energy and a touch of IR/FIR keeping our
environment as so anti-ice-age extra warm, as such we'll need the
following basics for an earthshine illuminated mission that'll most
likely demand some banked bone marrow and possibly a few spare stem
cells in order to survive the mission gauntlet.

In order to accomplish the moon, and live to tell about it, as such
they'll need a fully mascon mapped moon, plus fully modulated (at least
8 bit computer fly-by-wire driven) set of those fuel consuming reaction
thrusters (besides their modulated rated thrusters, this should only
require butt loads of nifty sensors and a minimum of four extremely fast
rad-hard computers), plus incorporating a few (at least three) powerful
momentum reaction wheels, as well as having sufficient deorbit and
down-range energy reserves, and something a whole lot better off than a
wussy 60:1 ratio of primary rocket/payload that had nearly a 30% inert
GLOW to start off with (that's not even including whatever spare tonnes
of inital ice loading).

Geoffrey A. Landis:
Let me emphasize, the human lander is by far the hardest part of the
Mars mission. A vehicle for getting down to the surface and back up
again is the one piece that we have to develop from scratch.
Everything else is, more or less, stuff we can put together from
pieces that already have been developed.

You folks out there in Usenet's dumbfounded land of snookered fools and
village idiots do realize there's still no such proven fly-by-rocket
lander as pilot rated and certified as crew safe and sane for
accomplishing our extremely nearby moon, not even in R&D prototype
format. However, there's still time to get in on that NASA contest of
demonstrating the first such prototype fly-by-rocket lander.
Unfortunately, thus far every known and what-if trick in the book hasn't
worked out according to plan. Perhaps what they need are a few of those
smart Jewish Third Reich rocket scientists, just like they had to work
with way back in them good old mutually perpetrated cold-war days.

BTW; On behalf of a relatively short mission exposure worth of
defending their frail DNA and especially all of that radiation sensitive
Kodak film could have used a minimum of 50 g/cm2 worth of shielding,
though 100 g/cm2 would have been a whole lot safer for keeping their TBI
mission dosage under 50 rads. Their having a personal cache of banked
bone marrow back on Earth as their plan-B would also have been a damn
wise thing to do, especially since the hundreds of rads per EVA should
have been well past their bone marrow's point of no return.

BTW No.2; Since there's no possible argument as to the DR(dynamic
range) of their Kodak film having easily recorded Venus and our
physically dark moon within the same FOV, therefore in whatever's your
best 3D simulator format, where the heck is Venus as of missions A11,
A14 and A16? (from EVA or from orbit)

What if anything is stopping or in any way diverting the very same solar
and cosmic energy plus whatever's physical flak from collecting upon
and/or penetrating into the moon, as otherwise collects within our
magnetosphere's Van Allen belts?

Honest analogy; Shouldn't the gravity and robust substance of the moon
itself sort of outperform our magnetosphere's ability to collect and
hold onto such nasty solar and cosmic stuff?

In addition to getting directly roasted and otherwise full-spectrum TBI
by the sun and of whatever's cosmic, there's also the secondary IR/FIR
energy that's potentially coming right at you from as many as each of
those surrounding 3.14e8 m2, not to mention each of those square meters
having their fair share of those local gamma and pesky hard-X-rays via
secondary/recoil to share and share alike, and as for yourself in that
wussy moonsuit to deal with.

At any one time it was technically impossible for such lunar surface
EVAs to have not been continually surrounded by a bare minimum of 3.14e6
m2, and of course from such a nearby orbit there's nothing but the
physically dark and TBI dosage nasty moon to look at for as far as the
DNA/RNA frail eye could see from being at 100+ km off the deck, and
that's one hell of a solar/cosmic plus unavoidably secondary/recoil
worth of TBI exposure to deal with, wouldn't you say?
-

NOM: "The level of cosmic radiation on the moon is barely different from
the radiation at the International Space Station. They seem to manage
space walks there OK."

From what I can learn, they/ISS actually do NOT manage very well at all,
whereas ISS EVAs tend to be relatively short and those EVAs still tend
to devour into their 50 rad per mission and subsequently impact upon
their career 500 rad dosage limits real fast, and at that they have to
avoid the SAA-05 contour like the worst known plague. The solar wind
that's extensively diverted by those nifty though lethal Van Allen belts
do accomplish a fairly good job of defending ISS from the otherwise L1
naked trauma of solar and cosmic influx, and besides the ISS itself
doesn't hardly represent significant density or any amount of
secondary/recoil square meters compared to the bare minimum of 3.14e6 m2
that's existing for the moon landing and EVAs, along with easily
receiving as much as 3.14e8 m2 worth of exposure to all that's reactive
and/or radioactive as being entirely possible.

A deployed ISS/(Clarke Station) at our moon's L1 would actually be as
much as 97.6% solar and otherwise nearly 100% cosmic nailed, but instead
our existing ISS is nearly 50% shielded from whatever's solar or cosmic
via Earth and rather nicely protected by a substantial magnetosphere,
whereas because of Earth's thin but extensive enough atmosphere is
hardly the least bit reactive substance like our naked moon that's
covered in heavy meteorite debris and of it's own considerable density
that makes for producing secondary/recoil dosage that apparently isn't
the least bit moderated by way of an atmosphere.

http://www.lpi.usra.edu/publications...aryland01b.pdf
This fancy enough "Clarke Station" document that's rather interesting
but otherwise a touch outdated, not to mention way under-shielded for
long term habitat unless incorporating 8+ meters of water plus having
somehow established an artificial magnetosphere, or perhaps 16+ meters
of h2o if w/o magnetosphere that's necessary because it's parked within
58,000 km from our physically dark and otherwise highly reactive moon
that's providing the not so DNA friendly TBI(total body irradiation)
dosage worth of gamma and hard-X-rays that are only a touch worse off by
lunar day, is simply a downright deficient document about sharing upon
all the positive science and habitat/depot considerations for others
utilizing the moon's L1/MEL1.

As for any mission command module orbiting our moon from 100 km isn't
exactly playing it DNA/RNA safe, nor more than half the time is it
representing a cool orbit or even all that mascon free of all those
pesky side to side and ups and downs because for its size the moon's
gravity is so irregular (possibly suggesting a badly distorted hallow
core).

There is however a fairly substantial sodium atmosphere that reaches out
past 9r (not to mention the comet like sodium trail of some 900,000 km),
but apparently it's not of sufficient density from 100 km down to the
deck as to significantly moderate the incoming or outgoing trauma of
gamma and hard-X-rays. Therefore, just the secondary IR/FIR has got to
be downright mission pesky to deal with, especially considering how
efficiently our moon reflects the IR and FIR spectrum, and the matter of
fact that it has to get rid of all of whatever it receives, which means
that a good 50% of the solar influx is getting returned to the same
sunny half side of space that a given mission orbiting its command
module has to survive while getting summarily roasted and otherwise TBI
traumatised from both directions, plus a little of whatever's earthshine
and of good old cosmic whatever else to boot.

On behalf of moderating whatever's incoming as well as unavoidably of
secondary/recoil outgoing radiation, what our naked moon environment
needs rather badly is an artificially forced atmosphere of almost any
sort, even if it's mostly co2 and a touch Radon toxic.
-
Brad Guth


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"Brad Guth" wrote in message
news:c1c9806fff82c2fa95371aac99678943.49644@mygate .mailgate.org

Instead of terraforming our moon as is, which is technically doable
(especially from the LSE-CM/ISS perspective of what China could easily
accomplish on our behalf), whereas we could simply relocate that sucker
to Earth L1, and thereby call our global warming fiasco to a freaking
halt once and for all, along with having created shade to burn (sort of
speak).

We'd obviously give up having such a downright reactive pesky moon
that's a little too darn close for our own good, and instead we'd have
for ourselves a nifty planetoid that's efficiently cruising within
Earth's L1, that is unless we decide otherwise.

This 7.35e22 kg planetoid of 3476 km diameter would also help block or
fend off a few of those nasty halo CMEs that are getting more and more
lethal as our ongoing demise of our magnetosphere continues to fail us
and that of our frail DNA at -0.05%/year.

Best of all, our good old once upon a time moon of such warm and fuzzy
global warming tidal forced energy would still be within easy range of
our access, made a whole lot safer for walking on that full earthshine
illuminated deck of what's physically chuck full of dark and nasty
cosmic and a few otherwise invaluable solar substances (such as He3),
though still a touch salty and otherwise extremely electrostatic dusty
(tens of meters deep in places), and yet the LSE-CM/ISS tether dipole
element could still be allowed to reach if need be to within 4r of
Earth. The 256e6 tonne and 1e9 m3 CM/ISS as our gateway abode/depot
itself is certainly much better off, and of the anchor tethers would
have become POOF suitable as for accommodating whomever is seriously
rich and hasn't all that much quality time to live anyway.
-
Brad Guth


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG