Wobbly Object in Caribbean Sky

Hi,

This group seems to be a serious and active group, so, as a non-astronomer,
I come to you for an explanation.

About ten days ago, my son and I were star gazing on a beach in Punta Cana,
Dominican Republic. We were at what could be called the dividing line
between the Atlantic and the Caribbean, facing roughly east.

Attracting our gaze was what I would call a star.

This "star" was not maintaining its position as were all the other visible
elements. This item was not keeping its position. It would not stay still.
It would "flit" ascribing a random pattern within a small area, moving
randomly within a small area of, I would say, being a rank amateur, maybe
half to a quarter of a pinky nail held at arm's length.

The position of this object was roughly ten degrees right of "twelve
o'clock" and about fifty degrees above the horizon.

It was not remarkable in size or colour--only in its flitting movement.

This object was at the same place doing the same movements twenty-four hours
later.

We also saw meteors, but they all were unmistakable, moving rapidly across
the visual field from left to right and extinguishing themselves in a
second.


What was that object? I usually stargaze in Central Canada, and I have never
seen anything like that flitting star.



Thanks in advance for any information.

V65MagnaFan wrote:

The position of this object was roughly ten degrees right of=20
"twelve o'clock" and about fifty degrees above the horizon.

Hello,

I'm by no means an expert, but I've run my planetarium software=20
for your date and location; could you have been observing the=20
first magnitude star Fomalhaut?

I've included the info. below. It would have appeared more toward=20
your Southeast rather than East.

The "movement" effect could, I speculate, have been a severe=20
example of atmospheric turbulence, where hot and cooler layers of=20
air met and produced pronounced eddies and so forth. Perhaps=20
other NG members would be able to either support or pelt this=20
hypothesis?

Cheers,
Dan


Star
HR 8728 HD216956
Flamsteed Number: 24
Bayer Letter: Alpha
Constellation: Piscis Australis
Visual Magnitude: 1.16
Color Index: 0.09
Spectral Class: A3V
Annual Proper Motion: 0.333 -0.165
FOMALHAUT; Os Piscis Meridiani; Os Piscis Notii; Difda al Auwel;=20
the First Frog

J2000 RA: 22h57m39.10s DE:-29=B037'20.0"
Date RA: 22h57m54.34s DE:-29=B035'50.2"

Santo Domingo 2004-8-24 22h01m ( TU + -4h00m )
Sideral Time : 19h36m
Hour Angle : 20h38m
Azimuth :+133=B051'
Altitude :+21=B039'

Rise : 20h08m Azimuth:+121=B010'
Culmination : 1h27m
Set : 6h46m Azimuth:+238=B050'

---

"V65MagnaFan" wrote:

About ten days ago, my son and I were star gazing on a beach in Punta Cana,
Dominican Republic. We were at what could be called the dividing line
between the Atlantic and the Caribbean, facing roughly east.

Attracting our gaze was what I would call a star.

This "star" was not maintaining its position as were all the other visible
elements. This item was not keeping its position. It would not stay still.
It would "flit" ascribing a random pattern within a small area, moving
randomly within a small area of, I would say, being a rank amateur, maybe
half to a quarter of a pinky nail held at arm's length.

The position of this object was roughly ten degrees right of "twelve
o'clock" and about fifty degrees above the horizon.

It was not remarkable in size or colour--only in its flitting movement.

This object was at the same place doing the same movements twenty-four hours
later.

Was it triangular?

--
Martin Frey
http://www.hadastro.org.uk
N 51 02 E 0 47

Was the movement triangular?

We perceived it as random. I can't say it was triangular.

It would move a bit, pause, move a bit, pause, move, move a bit. At that
time, we did not perceive any pattern.







"Martin Frey" wrote in message
...
"V65MagnaFan" wrote:

About ten days ago, my son and I were star gazing on a beach in Punta
Cana,
Dominican Republic. We were at what could be called the dividing line
between the Atlantic and the Caribbean, facing roughly east.

Attracting our gaze was what I would call a star.

This "star" was not maintaining its position as were all the other
visible
elements. This item was not keeping its position. It would not stay
still.
It would "flit" ascribing a random pattern within a small area, moving
randomly within a small area of, I would say, being a rank amateur, maybe
half to a quarter of a pinky nail held at arm's length.

The position of this object was roughly ten degrees right of "twelve
o'clock" and about fifty degrees above the horizon.

It was not remarkable in size or colour--only in its flitting movement.

This object was at the same place doing the same movements twenty-four
hours
later.

Was it triangular?

--
Martin Frey
http://www.hadastro.org.uk
N 51 02 E 0 47

Thank you for the quick and sincere replies.

The sky was fairly clear, with scattered clouds. To this city guy, the sky
seemed quite filled with stars.

Only one object exhibited the wobbly behaviour. It was surrounded closely
by many other "stars".







"Dan" wrote in message ...
V65MagnaFan wrote:

The position of this object was roughly ten degrees right of
"twelve o'clock" and about fifty degrees above the horizon.

Hello,

I'm by no means an expert, but I've run my planetarium software
for your date and location; could you have been observing the
first magnitude star Fomalhaut?

I've included the info. below. It would have appeared more toward
your Southeast rather than East.

The "movement" effect could, I speculate, have been a severe
example of atmospheric turbulence, where hot and cooler layers of
air met and produced pronounced eddies and so forth. Perhaps
other NG members would be able to either support or pelt this
hypothesis?

Cheers,
Dan


Star
HR 8728 HD216956
Flamsteed Number: 24
Bayer Letter: Alpha
Constellation: Piscis Australis
Visual Magnitude: 1.16
Color Index: 0.09
Spectral Class: A3V
Annual Proper Motion: 0.333 -0.165
FOMALHAUT; Os Piscis Meridiani; Os Piscis Notii; Difda al Auwel;
the First Frog

J2000 RA: 22h57m39.10s DE:-29°37'20.0"
Date RA: 22h57m54.34s DE:-29°35'50.2"

Santo Domingo 2004-8-24 22h01m ( TU + -4h00m )
Sideral Time : 19h36m
Hour Angle : 20h38m
Azimuth :+133°51'
Altitude :+21°39'

Rise : 20h08m Azimuth:+121°10'
Culmination : 1h27m
Set : 6h46m Azimuth:+238°50'

---

"V65MagnaFan" wrote:

This "star" was not maintaining its position as were all the other visible
elements. This item was not keeping its position. It would not stay still.
It would "flit" ascribing a random pattern within a small area, moving
randomly within a small area of, I would say, being a rank amateur, maybe
half to a quarter of a pinky nail held at arm's length.

Did you observe long enough to see whether the object tracked across
the sky with the background stars?

The white strobe lights on helicopters appear (to me anyway) to flash
in a pseudo-random pattern and there is more than one on each
helicopter, which can give the impression of a single point of light
dancing about.


Tim
--
Guns Don’t Kill People, Rappers Do.

In article le.rogers.c
om, V65MagnaFan writes


I'm not sure if it is relevant, but the Arecibo Observatory, on Puerto
Rico (200km east), operate various atmospheric science experiments in
addition to the famous radio instruments. These include several powerful
lasers associated with LIDAR (the optical equivalent of RADAR). The
technical details are he

http://www.naic.edu/aisr/sas/sashomeframe.html

I'm afraid that, apart from the details on the web site, I don't know
what the operational characteristics of this equipment. But, I wouldn't
be too surprised if it was related to what you report.

Anyone familiar with LIDAR operations?

--
David Entwistle

Hi Tim,

To my eyes, the object tracked with the other stars.

It was unremarkable in size, colour, twinkling. It would have been
completely innocous, except for its odd, random flits.

And, we checked the same place in the sky about twenty-four hours later. The
object was easily found, doing the same behaviour.

I took a look at the photo associated with Lidar at Arecibo. The star did
resemble what could be the random movement of a laser beam projected onto a
surface. However, there was no surface and no visible beam. It looked just
like a star.

By the way, I've narrowed the date to around August 20.

Darn, I was going to take my binoculars with me on the trip.


Maybe I'll e-mail Arecibo. I can tell you, though, that watching that object
made my neck hairs stand on end.




Those who beat their swords into plowshares will be enslaved by those who
don't.

"David Entwistle" wrote in message
...
In article le.rogers.c
om, V65MagnaFan writes


I'm not sure if it is relevant, but the Arecibo Observatory, on Puerto
Rico (200km east), operate various atmospheric science experiments in
addition to the famous radio instruments. These include several powerful
lasers associated with LIDAR (the optical equivalent of RADAR). The
technical details are he

http://www.naic.edu/aisr/sas/sashomeframe.html

I'm afraid that, apart from the details on the web site, I don't know
what the operational characteristics of this equipment. But, I wouldn't
be too surprised if it was related to what you report.

Anyone familiar with LIDAR operations?

--
David Entwistle



The website describes use of lasers at sodium D wavelength (580nm, yellow)
and of sounding rockets that release clouds of luminous gas. Arecibo is
almost directly east of the observer's position. So it is possible.
Perhaps if he asked if the system was in use on the nights in question,
Arecibo might be able to confirm.

--
Mike Dworetsky

(Remove "pants" spamblock to send e-mail)

In article , Mike Dworetsky
writes


The website describes use of lasers at sodium D wavelength (580nm, yellow)
and of sounding rockets that release clouds of luminous gas. Arecibo is
almost directly east of the observer's position. So it is possible.
Perhaps if he asked if the system was in use on the nights in question,
Arecibo might be able to confirm.


I passed the question on to the LIDAR team, at Arecibo, and got the
following negative response. Very nice of them to respond...

Dear David,

This was not us. In any case, 50 degree elevation will be much much
higher than any of our beams would be visible from Punta Cana.

--
Jonathan Friedman, Research Associate

--
David Entwistle