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Towards the *fully* 3D-printed electric cars.

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Old July 5th 17, 03:04 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.physics,rec.arts.sf.science,sci.electronics.design
Greg Goss
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Posts: 169
Default Towards the *fully* 3D-printed electric cars.

Jeff Findley wrote:

Also, the other option that 3D printing opens up is more shape optimized
parts. These things are optimized so that "useless" mass is simply gone
from the design. They tend to look "organic" rather than "machined" due
to their complex shapes. I've heard this called "light-weighting" parts
from management types.

Sometimes you light-weight a part too far. Back in 1985, my mechanic
called me in to look at a repair. The new brake disk was much heavier
and much less "organic". But the original one warped because it
didn't have enough mass to absorb the heat till it could be radiated
away, and the manufacturer provided a much simpler but heavier
replacement part.

The new part was so much different looking than the original one that
he wanted my permission to proceed.

(As a 400 pound guy who likes to drive econobox microcars, I always
seem to have alignment and brake problems only on the front left.
We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.
Old July 5th 17, 03:08 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.physics,rec.arts.sf.science,sci.electronics.design
Greg Goss
external usenet poster
Posts: 169
Default Towards the *fully* 3D-printed electric cars.

David Mitchell wrote:


And about the only place where weight matters that much is in things
that fly and in that case useless mass is already gone from the design
without the expense of 3D printing.

Have you ever looked at the interior structures of an aircraft?

3D printing is, and always will be, a niche manufacturing method.

"Nobody needs more than 640K"

I don't really think it's sensible to say "never" wrt technology - you're
judging a very immature technology

The Altair was obsolete in two years. The Apple ][ was obsolete in
five, though genius level reworkings kept it going for what, 12? The
context for that quote was the decision to build a computer with ten
times the memory capacity of the normal business computer out there at
the time, with the expectation that they would totally revamp the
design in a few years. Remember that was the time when Microsoft bet
big on Unix as the next big thing. Nobody expected to be finding ISA
compatible computers running a compatible OS 35 years later.

The biggest problem wrt printing vehicles will, I suspect, be the legislation
governing safety.

We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.
Old July 5th 17, 07:16 AM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.physics
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
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Posts: 9,896
Default Towards the *fully* 3D-printed electric cars.

JF Mezei wrote:

On 2017-07-04 14:19, wrote:

Metal powder deposition and laser or electron beam sintering.

BTW, metal powders tend to be explosive.

Thanks. Does this really produce parts that are on par with those
produced with conventional means when it comes to
force/strength/endurance (especially when it comes to re-usable engines) ?

It appears so as SpaceX uses it, but just wondering if the physics of
melting layers of powder yields the same strength a a solid block that
is machine tooled.

"Compared with a traditionally cast part, a printed valve body has
superior strength, ductility, and fracture resistance, with a lower
variability in materials properties. The MOV body was printed in less
than two days, compared with a typical castings cycle measured in


So with regard to Chimp's claim of 'slower' and your concern about
'weaker', SpaceX says bull****.

Also, if it is powder, how do they make a "roof" over empty spaces (such
a the top of a horizontal cylendrical pipe inside the unit).

Silly question. How do you make an igloo? Same thing but with much
tinier blocks.

"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
--G. Behn
Old July 5th 17, 01:19 PM posted to sci.space.policy,sci.physics,rec.arts.sf.science,sci.electronics.design
Jeff Findley[_6_]
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Posts: 1,826
Default Towards the *fully* 3D-printed electric cars.

In article ,
Landing gear, and all other structural moving parts, is surely another
area on aircraft which could use this technology. Landing gear make up
a significant percentage of an aircraft's total dry mass, so this would
be a likely candidate for shape optimization and 3D printing.

Again, you are talking about niche applications and landing gear are not
that big a part of an aircrafts weight.

From Wikipedia (because I don't have time to look up a "better" source):

The undercarriage is typically 4-5% of the takeoff mass and can
even reach 7%.

That's significant in aerospace.

Have you ever looked at the interior structures of an aircraft?

Yes, many times. I've got a b.s. in aerospace engineering, so I know
the basics. Many of our customers are aerospace, so I have to
understand the domain.

3D printing is, and always will be, a niche manufacturing method.

Handy at times, but certainly not a world changer.

This is quite short sighted. I'm sure the same was said about
composites when they were in their infancy. Today it would be quite
hard (i.e. likely impossible) to point to something commercial that
flies and carries people commercially that has absolutely zero composite

An irrelevant red herring to the subject of 3D printing. There are a HUGE
number of different composite materials out there and it has taken well
over half a century for most aircraft to have even a small fraction of
composite materials in their construction.

Note the word "most".

How is an example of the adoption of new materials/manufacturing
processes not applicable to 3D printing which is another example of the
same thing? Are you deliberately being intellectually dishonest?

I can say that shape optimization coupled with 3D printing is one of the
"bleeding edge" topics in my industry. It's really no secret, you can
surely Google hundreds of articles on the topic. I really can't go into
further details, but my profession is in writing engineering software,
so I ought to know.

Whoopee. It is still niche.

You're posting to sci.space groups. It's quite significant to the
aerospace industry. If you don't like it, find another group to pester.

Does anyone care about a shape optimized 4 slice toaster or filing cabinet?

This isn't sci.toaster.

All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.

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