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Tabby's Star Dimming Again



 
 
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  #11  
Old March 30th 18, 11:55 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Razzmatazz
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Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 5:49:29 PM UTC-5, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:

Until Mommy and Daddy pass away, and you can't live in the basement
any more, anyway.


You know something, what you wrote above could be taken as an indication of a lack of intellect, and sets a very poor example if you really want to convince people of your ideas. Why not elevate your dialog and come out looking reasonably intelligent instead of acting like a 3rd grader. Debate the ideas and forget the insults.

Razzy
  #12  
Old March 31st 18, 12:39 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Chris L Peterson
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Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 15:50:23 -0700 (PDT), Razzmatazz
wrote:

The U.S. economy is a disaster.


The US economy is not a disaster.


That does, of course, depend on the metrics we use to evaluate it. I
don't place much value on GDP, on employment. We have massive and
growing wealth disparity, we have massive amounts of capital being
held out of circulation by corporations, we have a significant
percentage of our population living under poorer conditions than their
parents lived under, we have crumbling infrastructure, we spend more
than we collect.

By my assessment, that's a disaster. It's unsustainable, and when it
collapses it isn't going to be pretty.
  #13  
Old March 31st 18, 01:10 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Razzmatazz
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Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 6:39:50 PM UTC-5, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 15:50:23 -0700 (PDT), Razzmatazz
wrote:

The U.S. economy is a disaster.


The US economy is not a disaster.


That does, of course, depend on the metrics we use to evaluate it. I
don't place much value on GDP, on employment. We have massive and
growing wealth disparity, we have massive amounts of capital being
held out of circulation by corporations, we have a significant
percentage of our population living under poorer conditions than their
parents lived under, we have crumbling infrastructure, we spend more
than we collect.

By my assessment, that's a disaster. It's unsustainable, and when it
collapses it isn't going to be pretty.


But I already told you why. It's in the voting pattern of Americans. Nearly a third of Americans cannot name a single branch of government, and almost 40 percent are unable to cite a right guaranteed by the First Amendment. Only a handful of states require proficiency in civics and government as a condition of graduation. The educational system, with its fear of confrontational topics and its corporate-driven emphasis on STEM, has failed them. On top of that, educating young people is not held in high esteem here, unlike other advanced nations.

On top of that, a lot of people consider all politicians to be crooks, and don't have the reasoning ability to sort truth from propaganda. That cynicism has cost them dearly and will continue to do so until we take education seriously and teach people how to think and reason.

Take a look at the political cycle in the USofA:
https://thenib.com/the-corruption-cycle
  #14  
Old March 31st 18, 01:25 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Razzmatazz
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Posts: 265
Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 7:10:26 PM UTC-5, Razzmatazz wrote:
On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 6:39:50 PM UTC-5, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 15:50:23 -0700 (PDT), Razzmatazz
wrote:

The U.S. economy is a disaster.

The US economy is not a disaster.


That does, of course, depend on the metrics we use to evaluate it. I
don't place much value on GDP, on employment. We have massive and
growing wealth disparity, we have massive amounts of capital being
held out of circulation by corporations, we have a significant
percentage of our population living under poorer conditions than their
parents lived under, we have crumbling infrastructure, we spend more
than we collect.

By my assessment, that's a disaster. It's unsustainable, and when it
collapses it isn't going to be pretty.


But I already told you why. It's in the voting pattern of Americans. Nearly a third of Americans cannot name a single branch of government, and almost 40 percent are unable to cite a right guaranteed by the First Amendment. Only a handful of states require proficiency in civics and government as a condition of graduation. The educational system, with its fear of confrontational topics and its corporate-driven emphasis on STEM, has failed them. On top of that, educating young people is not held in high esteem here, unlike other advanced nations.

On top of that, a lot of people consider all politicians to be crooks, and don't have the reasoning ability to sort truth from propaganda. That cynicism has cost them dearly and will continue to do so until we take education seriously and teach people how to think and reason.

Take a look at the political cycle in the USofA:
https://thenib.com/the-corruption-cycle


Here's another Sorensen: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/1f/4d...409fc6f917.jpg
  #15  
Old March 31st 18, 06:10 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Chris L Peterson
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Posts: 10,007
Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 17:10:23 -0700 (PDT), Razzmatazz
wrote:

On top of that, a lot of people consider all politicians to be crooks, and don't have the reasoning ability to sort truth from propaganda. That cynicism has cost them dearly and will continue to do so until we take education seriously and teach people how to think and reason.


We need to recognize that the government is us, not them. We need an
educated populace. We need an informed populace.

Realistically, I don't see any of those things happening. I think a
collapse is the most likely scenario.
  #16  
Old March 31st 18, 07:10 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Chris.B[_3_]
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Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Saturday, 31 March 2018 07:10:30 UTC+2, Chris L Peterson wrote:

Realistically, I don't see any of those things happening. I think a
collapse is the most likely scenario.


A good government is always open to constructive criticism.
A bad government takes revenge for criticism.

A good government realizes that 50% of the people are unrepresented.
A bad government has wealthy lobbyists as "best friends."

A good government has no need of private funding.
A bad government is always in debt to the sociopathic rich.

A good government serves all its people.
A bad government employs lip service to the people's needs.

A good government constantly tries to do better.
A bad government is constantly afraid of the truth coming out.

A good government has a strong news service.
A bad government has no news service [at all.]

A good government sees the people as a vital resource to be nurtured.
A bad government sees the people as a resource to be exploited.

A good government is respected. So needs no vast armed forces budget.
A bad government will sell arms and cannon fodder to anyone.

A good government aids each fledgling democracy to flourish.
A bad government seeks only to steal their national resources.

A good government abhors abuse and slavery.
A bad government employs both practices routinely.

A good government cherishes its national parks and its environment.
A bad government exploits its "wastelands" for private profit.

A good government contributes to international science.
A bad government throws taxpayer's cash at weapons development.

A good government enjoys international respect.
A bad government demands respect at gunpoint.

A good government enjoys low crime figures by sharing wealth.
A bad government has full prisons and nobody is safe.

A good government has no need of superheroes for justice.
A bad government has laws and lawyers to protect itself from justice.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43601557

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-43596812

  #17  
Old March 31st 18, 01:16 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Gary Harnagel
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Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 11:38:17 AM UTC-6, Chris L Peterson wrote:

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 05:16:30 -0700 (PDT), Gary Harnagel
wrote:

On Thursday, March 29, 2018 at 4:38:28 PM UTC-6, Chris L Peterson wrote:

On Thu, 29 Mar 2018 14:47:31 -0700 (PDT), RichA
wrote:

P.S. U.S. economy (you know, something that actually matters, as
opposed to gold-digging whores) is doing FANTASTIC!

Not really. The economy is in pretty poor shape, with wealth disparity
increasing and more and more people in deep **** due to medical
expenses.

Businesses are generally doing fine. That's a lousy metric for the
economy.


Really? Do you mean businesses that provide actual JOBS and health
benefits for those "poor" folk? Or are you talking about those people
that work for US in gov't. jobs?


Businesses provide jobs. They shouldn't be allowed to provide health
benefits; that's one of our problems.


At least when businesses provide health benefits, they make sure they're
not losing money, like Uncle Sam is. Healthcare by gov't. edict is
unsustainable. THAT'S the real disaster.

And throughout my career, I was thankful to have healthcare through my
employers. There wasn't any other kind.

But having a job doesn't mean you're in a good position. Employment is
also a poor indicator of economic health.


Agreed because it doesn't account for wage disparity; however, bare wages
tend higher with age. An honest metric would be to measure wage disparity
within age groupings. I don't believe things would look so grim. We
seem to worry a lot about the top 1% having in 90% of the wealth, or
whatever, but is that really an honest metric?

A lot of the wage disparity is due to education and lack thereof, and that
disparity has a lot to do with personal choice/ability.

The U.S. economy is a disaster.


I'm with Razzy on that. There has ALWAYS been the rich and the poor,
and there always will be until people themselves become perfect. One
attribute of a "perfect" person is a significant contribution to that
ol' GDP. If that happened there would still be wage disparity, but it
wouldn't matter because goods would be essentially free. Not sure
about services, though. We need to make some serious advances in robotic
engineering for that to happen, in which case robots would be just more
free goods.
  #18  
Old March 31st 18, 03:02 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Chris L Peterson
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Posts: 10,007
Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Fri, 30 Mar 2018 23:10:27 -0700 (PDT), "Chris.B"
wrote:

A good government realizes that 50% of the people are unrepresented.


In a good government, 100% of the people are represented. Because is a
good government, the representatives represent their entire
constituency, not just the ones who voted for them.
  #19  
Old March 31st 18, 03:05 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Chris L Peterson
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Posts: 10,007
Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Sat, 31 Mar 2018 05:16:25 -0700 (PDT), Gary Harnagel
wrote:

At least when businesses provide health benefits, they make sure they're
not losing money, like Uncle Sam is. Healthcare by gov't. edict is
unsustainable. THAT'S the real disaster.


I'm not sure what "healthcare by government edict" means. But I do
know that the best healthcare systems in the world are all paid for by
public funds, and are operating sustainably.

I'm with Razzy on that. There has ALWAYS been the rich and the poor,
and there always will be until people themselves become perfect.\


And there should be. But we can limit how rich and how poor using
smart public policy.
  #20  
Old March 31st 18, 04:42 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Razzmatazz
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Posts: 265
Default Tabby's Star Dimming Again

On Saturday, March 31, 2018 at 7:16:28 AM UTC-5, Gary Harnagel wrote:
At least when businesses provide health benefits, they make sure they're
not losing money, like Uncle Sam is. Healthcare by gov't. edict is
unsustainable. THAT'S the real disaster.


Since I own a business and am over 65 I am both a provider of health insurance and a beneficiary of socialized medicine. I can tell you that having to pay for private health insurance is a disaster for small business, especially manufacturing. We cannot compete on the world market when a huge portion of our cost is the amount we have to fork over to health insurance companies who raise their rates at double digits every year while cutting coverage to boot.

At the same time I have Medicare which is a godsend at my age. Although I'm relatively healthy, my experience with socialized medicine is totally positive. The few times that I needed an expensive procedure, it was paid for without Sturm und Drang and I received no bills and was not hassled about which doctor or which hospital could do the procedure.

I cannot imagine what my rate would be if I had to buy private health insurance at my age. I'm sure they are all eager to sign up all us seniors who as a group have massive health problems. I once asked our company insurance agent what it would cost to insure someone in their 70's, and he laughed and said probably your entire salary for the year.

Seniors laugh at young people who vote Republican and deny themselves a more rational health care system like every other advanced country. And at the same time seniors vote Republican in droves because they don't want to pay taxes to fund education for the young. They don't have kids in school so they could not care less - send your kids to private school if you want them educated is their motto.

This kind of thinking will not change any time soon but it is short sighted.. Seniors live on dividends and investments, and it is the young who are working and producing those corporate dividends. Short those young people enough and watch those dividends evaporate.

Razzy
 




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