Paranoid end of Heavens above?

Hi All,

Yes they do still run visits, at least as of last June when the York AS had
a great tour and presentation. It's an impressive thing to see. We were
given a presentation about the history, purpose and operation of the
"Pyramid", taken in to the main control room to see the equipment in action,
and given a "demo" of a real "event".

This "event" was the unannounced launch of a French ICBM test from the bay
of Biscay. Apparently the French like to do this sort of thing without
telling anyone! Within 60 seconds the monitoring crew had identified the
launch, confirmed the launch, verified their equipment was working
correctly, and passed the launch location time, and destination, etc to the
UK HQ at High Wycombe, and the US system across the water. That is the end
of their job with respect to surprise launches.

Their other roles are to track orbiting objects ranging from spanners to the
ISS, and to advise anyone on the best times to launch orbital missions to
minimise the risk if impact with "objects". And by anyone I mean not just
the western allies, but even the Chinese, etc.

Afterwards we were given a tour behind the active array itself, where each
of the small dipoles can be seen from behind, complete with electrical feeds
and copper piped cooling water systems.

It was a most interesting and informative day out and highly recommended for
any AS. We were allowed to film outside the entrance to the main Pyramid
building, but all cameras are left with the guard at the main door when we
entered.

Very best wishes and clear, dark skies

--

/Paul B, York, UK. - Chairman York AS.
http://homepages.tesco.net/paul.buglass/astrohome.htm
York Astronomical Society
www.yorkastro.co.uk


"Sayf Connary" wrote in message
...
Martin Brown wrote:
Sayf Connary wrote:

Mark Underwood wrote:

It really is time that the Free world did something about the
paranoid culture of the USA . Europe has suffered greater terror
threats and deeds, American funded IRA to name but one, in the past
without this sort of parotid rubbish.

We are almost at the point I feel where enough is enough !


Blah, blah, blah. Take this political BS somewhere else.


But you can't deny that the Americans have become completely paranoid
post 9/11. One minor improvement for the UK is that now the IRA have to
rob banks to get money instead of sponging off gullible Americans.

You are right, but is this the right forum for discussing it? Since
everyone seems to think so I'll give my own opinion:

rant You also can't deny that the current British gov't aren't doing
similar things. Just look at some of the policies they are trying to
push through Parliament right now.

It seems like it's en vogue to blame the worlds problems on the American
gov't. They are any easy scape-goat. And I'll be the first to admit that
they do deserve blame for many things. This was one of the reasons I
moved to the UK after Bush was elected. I could see the disgrace coming
quickly. I, fortunately, married a British woman and she was able to
open my eyes to how the world really works. I was blinded by the media
and gov't for many years and I always had considered myself
knowledgeable on world affairs. Becoming enlightened has been an
infuriating experience, both because of what has been done in the name
of "freedom" and at myself for being duped. The rest of the world needs
to realise that I'm not the only one who has been misled. Many, many
Americans (and I'm not just talking about the ones who voted for Bush)
also are unaware of what's going on, although this may be slowly
changing. Americans aren't gullible, they can only react to the
information they are given. If that info is bad or misleading then they
will react badly or be misled. Making sweeping generalisations about all
Americans is insulting, bigoted and just plain not good. Maybe I was
gullible or maybe I just didn't try to get all the information I could
from every source available. I suppose I trusted the media in general to
tell me the truth and not distort information for their own purposes.
/rant

I hope that all makes sense, but if it doesn't then I apologise. Speak
to me about it off-group. I'm not going to respond any further on that
topic. For those who like to get the last word in, feel free to do so.

Any agency capable of deploying effective anti satellite measures will
be perfectly well able to track and acquire their target(s) with or
without a published ephemeris. Withholding this information just
inconveniences amateur space enthusiasts.

Agreed. It is sad indeed.

It wasn't so long ago that you could by prior arrangement visit BMEWS
Site 3 (RAF Fylingdales) as a group tour and go stand inside the golf
balls (now long gone). If they do still offer organised visits then it
is an interesting day out for an astrosoc. Their ground based images of
satellites are very interesting.

There is an astonishing selection of space junk that they catalogue
ranging from astronauts gloves to explosive bolt parts in low Earth
orbit as well as the more obvious spy birds.

Sounds interesting, I would be curious to see if they still allowed
visits to such a place.

Regards,
Martin Brown


--
~Sayf

Sayf Connary wrote:

Martin Brown wrote:
But you can't deny that the Americans have become completely paranoid
post 9/11. One minor improvement for the UK is that now the IRA have
to rob banks to get money instead of sponging off gullible Americans.

You are right, but is this the right forum for discussing it?

Not really but we do sometimes end up off topic. It is a lot worse in
the international astronomy groups where anti science dittoheads and the
religious right try to peddle Young Earth Creationism etc.

rant You also can't deny that the current British gov't aren't doing
similar things. Just look at some of the policies they are trying to
push through Parliament right now.

I certainly do not defend the UK government. I don't like the prospect
of being locked up forever without trail on the say so of a Home
Secretary just because he has some "intelligence" from MI5 or thinks my
eyes are too close together.

It seems like it's en vogue to blame the worlds problems on the American
gov't. They are any easy scape-goat. And I'll be the first to admit that
they do deserve blame for many things. This was one of the reasons I
moved to the UK after Bush was elected.

Bush did a surprisingly good job immediately post 9/11. Going after the
terrorist training camps in Afghanistan was eminently sensible and
supported worldwide. That support was unfortunately squandered by
blundering into Iraq.

topic. For those who like to get the last word in, feel free to do so.

Only to say that as Brit I agree with most of what you have said above.

It wasn't so long ago that you could by prior arrangement visit BMEWS
Site 3 (RAF Fylingdales) as a group tour and go stand inside the golf
balls (now long gone).

Sounds interesting, I would be curious to see if they still allowed
visits to such a place.

I don't know. I haven't heard of anyone going for a visit in quite a
while. I will ask around to see if it is still possible. My guess would
be that it isn't any more since they are in the midst of controversy
about becoming a son of StarWars site (Menwith Hill takes more heat).

From BBC North Yorks it looks like they no longer do public trips.
However, there are a few pictures of inside the base online (something I
find amazing since it is a very strictly no cameras zone).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/northyorkshire/...es/index.shtml

NB the panorama isn't worth the effort of downloading.

Regards,
Martin Brown

Martin Brown wrote:

NB the panorama isn't worth the effort of downloading.

Regards,
Martin Brown

You're right, it wasn't worth it, but I'm paying for this damned
broadband, so I better use it. ;-)

--
~Sayf

"Sayf Connary" wrote in message
...
Martin Frey wrote:
Sayf Connary wrote:
Anyone know of any good forums/lists about astronomy where politics don't
come into play? I've already dumped sci.astro.amateur because that's all
they seem to discuss lately. If I wanted to read about it I would have
subscribed to alt.politics!! Martin was right to post the link to that
article as it was on-topic, but do we really need to hear about
everyone's hatred for a certain country or that political group or which
is tastier plain or peanut M&M's???
Hang on - here we have a direct (and utterly silly) political
curtailment of liberty of particular relevance to astronomers - they
are taking from us accurate predictions of ISS or Iridiums, even the
ability to know what it was that transited my bit of sky (if I ever
get a chance to see it).
We can passively accept such stupid nonsense by keeping silent - but I
really see nowt wrong with saying streuth this has gone far enough
already. Any terrrrist clever enough to make terrrrist use of the
information from sites like Heavens Above is going to be clever enough
not to need Heavens Above to achieve his act or terrrrr.
I don't disagree with anything you've said. Just the place you are saying
it. :-) Maybe I'm being overly anal, but I'm just getting sick of reading
about everyone's political gripes. I think GK started it and he's put me
in a bad mood for the week. From now on I blame the world's problems on
him.

Quite right. I won't be purchasing any GK products either.
Grim

"Martin Frey" wrote in message
...
[snip]
Let's at least make a voice be heard from here for freedom of
astronomical information that has no relevance to terrrrsts
whatsoever.

Hang on! If terrorists can work out when to shoot down satellites, shuttles,
the ISS and so on without Heavens Above, then what do we need Heavens Above
for?
Grim

"Mark Underwood" wrote in message
...
It really is time that the Free world did something about the paranoid
culture of the USA . Europe has suffered greater terror threats and deeds,
American funded IRA to name but one, in the past without this sort of
parotid rubbish.

We are almost at the point I feel where enough is enough !

I've made a start by boycotting all usan products (that I know of). My
friend is disappointed that I no longer turn up with a case of coke, but has
decided this is a necessary sacrifice. She is also experiencing fewer
headaches!
Grim

"Robert Geake" wrote in message
...
Lets face it , are we not just letting the terrorists win by changing the
way we live in order to avoid getting blown up???

If they want to hurt us no amount of security will stop them(aside from
killing every member of every fanatical religion).

We could make a fairly comprehensive start just by killing Bush and co.
Grim

"Grimble Gromble" wrote in message
...

"Robert Geake" wrote in message
...
Lets face it , are we not just letting the terrorists win by changing the
way we live in order to avoid getting blown up???

If they want to hurt us no amount of security will stop them(aside from
killing every member of every fanatical religion).

We could make a fairly comprehensive start just by killing Bush and co.
Grim

lol I've already been supposed reported to the American FBI & SS for
suggesting that a few times myself.

Might be about the time to boycott Meade, Celestron etc me thinks...

Mark Underwood wrote

Personally if its political to say enough is enough to the American
Government and their paranoid rantings over an issue that affect my hobby
then let it be political... Sadly the world is moving that way that
regardless of the subject...it becomes political.... Remember the RGO
everyone ? Did anyone say ,'This is not astronomy, its political, let's
keep silent' ?

Politicians undermine astronomy every time they sanction public lighting
schemes. Looking wider, they undermine astronomy by sanctioning a
fossil-fuel economy which converts buried hydrocarbons into atmospheric
particulates, greenhouse gases and more light pollution.

--
Hil

Mark Underwood wrote

We could make a fairly comprehensive start just by killing Bush and co.

lol I've already been supposed reported to the American FBI & SS for
suggesting that a few times myself.

Why? Removing Bush and Bliar would be a huge step forward for world
peace and progress.

--
Hil