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Saturn Ring Sample Return Mission?
A planetary probe should be able to fly in and sample Saturn's ring material
and analysis it and/or return a sample to Earth. The relative velocity between the probe and ring material would be almost zero if the probe is in-plane near circular. Has anyone proposed or is working on a Saturn Ring Sample mission? -- Craig Fink Courtesy E-Mail Welcome @ |
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Saturn Ring Sample Return Mission?
On Apr 9, 12:21�am, Craig Fink wrote:
A planetary probe should be able to fly in and sample Saturn's ring material and analysis it and/or return a sample to Earth. The relative velocity between the probe and ring material would be almost zero if the probe is in-plane near circular. Has anyone proposed or is working on a Saturn Ring Sample mission? -- Craig Fink Courtesy E-Mail Welcome @ all the money goes to shuttle and its replacement, dead last is science. dead last in priority and money/ wonder how this appeared in policy but my first attempt went to the moderated group?? |
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Saturn Ring Sample Return Mission?
sci.space.moderated removed, because the rest of us are simply not
allowed to post into that "moderated" group. Craig Fink wrote: A planetary probe should be able to fly in and sample Saturn's ring material and analysis it and/or return a sample to Earth. The relative velocity between the probe and ring material would be almost zero if the probe is in-plane near circular. Has anyone proposed or is working on a Saturn Ring Sample mission? -- Craig Fink Courtesy E-Mail Welcome @ Too bad there's not even any local research data of hard/objective science related to such ice existing for whatever short amount of time while situated within 1 AU space, such if that objective test sample of whatever block or sphere of solid ice were having to coexist within the moon's L1 is obviously another taboo/nondisclosure situation of need-to-know, of which the public and greater body of science expertise clearly isn't being allowed to know squat. It has nothing to do with NASA, that of their shuttle fiasco or of their supposedly going back to the moon. It has to do with those mostly Semitic faith-based puppeteers in charge of our private parts, as well as their being in charge of spending our hard earned loot on whatever they damn well feel like, of which only the likes of passive science as to inert eye-candy or the pathetic likes of Mars are not on their NO FLY list. .. - Brad Guth |
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Saturn Ring Sample Return Mission?
wrote in message ... On Apr 9, 12:21�am, Craig Fink wrote: A planetary probe should be able to fly in and sample Saturn's ring material and analysis it and/or return a sample to Earth. The relative velocity between the probe and ring material would be almost zero if the probe is in-plane near circular. Has anyone proposed or is working on a Saturn Ring Sample mission? -- Craig Fink Courtesy E-Mail Welcome @ all the money goes to shuttle and its replacement, dead last is science. dead last in priority and money/ wonder how this appeared in policy but my first attempt went to the moderated group?? ========================== Oops, Microsoft's OE didn't mark the later lines in the message I'm responding to. Mine starts here. If I were designing a mission out to Saturn for ring samples, I'd want the mission to serve other objectives too. Several objectives sharing the cost, improves its business structure. An interesting question is, just how would your machine go about getting those samples? My guess is, I'd want it in an orbit inclined slightly to the rings, so it passed through slowly and could observe and collect samples while in the ring plane. I think you'd want to start near the rings inner edge and stepwise increase the machine's orbital diameter, thus getting a radial range of samples. You start at the inside working out so you make two passes in Saturn's well, once inward and once outward. Those rings are a wonderful sight. I wonder if you could bring back some stuff and sell it to very rich people here as jewelry, thus to pay much of the cost of the mission? But I don't feel enthusiastic about this rings samples ideas. My reason for this is, as soon as we know enough about space to go out and put settlements there, we ought to do it. Because, one of the things we have from modern astronomy, is space is a very violent place; and things happen. Common sense and prudence say we ought to have viable settlements and a whole life and business network out there as soon as we have the technology to do it; and space is a better place to explore space from anyhow. So we should do that, and in fact, the technology is in hand now to do it. Ever since the 1960's. But back in the 1960's, Apollo was killed to free up more money for the Vietnam war, the first of our major Washington pork wars. However, that's all another topic. Re Saturn's rings, isn't there a strong magnetosphere out there around Saturn, and some serious VanAllen belts? Where life would be hard because you'd have to stay inside three or four meters of water and stone, except for very quick passages in and out? So if we had an orbital settlement out there around Saturn, how close in to Saturn could it be placed? Titeotwawki -- mha [sci.space.policy 2008 Apr 16] |
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Saturn Ring Sample Return Mission?
On Apr 16, 10:54 am, "Martha Adams" wrote:
wrote in message ... On Apr 9, 12:21�am, Craig Fink wrote: A planetary probe should be able to fly in and sample Saturn's ring material and analysis it and/or return a sample to Earth. The relative velocity between the probe and ring material would be almost zero if the probe is in-plane near circular. Has anyone proposed or is working on a Saturn Ring Sample mission? -- Craig Fink Courtesy E-Mail Welcome @ all the money goes to shuttle and its replacement, dead last is science. dead last in priority and money/ wonder how this appeared in policy but my first attempt went to the moderated group?? ========================== Oops, Microsoft's OE didn't mark the later lines in the message I'm responding to. Mine starts here. If I were designing a mission out to Saturn for ring samples, I'd want the mission to serve other objectives too. Several objectives sharing the cost, improves its business structure. An interesting question is, just how would your machine go about getting those samples? My guess is, I'd want it in an orbit inclined slightly to the rings, so it passed through slowly and could observe and collect samples while in the ring plane. I think you'd want to start near the rings inner edge and stepwise increase the machine's orbital diameter, thus getting a radial range of samples. You start at the inside working out so you make two passes in Saturn's well, once inward and once outward. Those rings are a wonderful sight. I wonder if you could bring back some stuff and sell it to very rich people here as jewelry, thus to pay much of the cost of the mission? But I don't feel enthusiastic about this rings samples ideas. My reason for this is, as soon as we know enough about space to go out and put settlements there, we ought to do it. Because, one of the things we have from modern astronomy, is space is a very violent place; and things happen. Common sense and prudence say we ought to have viable settlements and a whole life and business network out there as soon as we have the technology to do it; and space is a better place to explore space from anyhow. So we should do that, and in fact, the technology is in hand now to do it. Ever since the 1960's. But back in the 1960's, Apollo was killed to free up more money for the Vietnam war, the first of our major Washington pork wars. However, that's all another topic. Re Saturn's rings, isn't there a strong magnetosphere out there around Saturn, and some serious VanAllen belts? Where life would be hard because you'd have to stay inside three or four meters of water and stone, except for very quick passages in and out? So if we had an orbital settlement out there around Saturn, how close in to Saturn could it be placed? Titeotwawki -- mha [sci.space.policy 2008 Apr 16] At $100 trillion in our hard earned public loot, and of decades upon decades down the R&D road, you've got to be insanely kidding about establishing any sort of Saturn orbital outpost/gateway. Am I right? . - Brad Guth |
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Saturn Ring Sample Return Mission?
snip At $100 trillion in our hard earned public loot, and of decades upon decades down the R&D road, you've got to be insanely kidding about establishing any sort of Saturn orbital outpost/gateway. Am I right? .. - Brad Guth No. -- mha [sci.space.policy 2008 Apr 17] |
#8
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Saturn Ring Sample Return Mission?
Martha Adams wrote:
wonder how this appeared in policy but my first attempt went to the moderated group?? I posted to both the moderated and this group, and set the reply group to the moderated one. You can reply to all the groups or just the one reply group. The moderated one. ========================== Oops, Microsoft's OE didn't mark the later lines in the message I'm responding to. *Mine starts here. If I were designing a mission out to Saturn for ring samples, I'd want the mission to serve other objectives too. * Several objectives sharing the cost, improves its business structure. Yes, this would be the best way. The Sample return vehicle is, or could be, an Aerobraking/Ion Engine space tug. Such a vehicle in Earth orbit would be economically valuable today for taking cargo to the GEO, the Moon and Mars. It would more than double the payload of every launch vehicle that uses it to take payloads higher than LEO. An interesting question is, just how would your machine go about getting those samples? *My guess is, I'd want it in an orbit inclined slightly to the rings, so it passed through slowly and could observe and collect samples while in the ring plane. *I think you'd want to start near the rings inner edge and stepwise increase the machine's orbital diameter, thus getting a radial range of samples. *You start at the inside working out so you make two passes in Saturn's well, once inward and once outward. Just stay in the Rings, to collect samples the probe would have to rendezvous with the target, especially the big ones. I agree Starting at the inner edge of the ring would be the way to go, it makes maximum use of the Aerobrake Return vehicle. As the vehicle slowly climb, scan the rings above looking for it's next target to sample as it passes at a slower orbital velocity just above the vehicle. Those rings are a wonderful sight. *I wonder if you could bring back some stuff and sell it to very rich people here as jewelry, thus to pay much of the cost of the mission? Returning several thousand kilograms, there would be plenty of material to sell. It would be nice to get exploration and learning working on a different economic model that the current one. One where researchers beg bureaucrats to take money from the people to pay for their fun. Some people don't like being forced to pay for other people's fun. Hallerb for example. -- Craig Fink Courtesy E-Mail Welcome @ |
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