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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
An Australian sound engineer has used technology to
decipher the ' a ' in Armstrongs quote. It was actually there but was spoken about 10 times too fast to be audible on the tape the we all heard. Neil has insisted for decades that he spoke the word. |
#2
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
Mick wrote:
An Australian sound engineer has used technology to decipher the ' a ' in Armstrongs quote. It was actually there but was spoken about 10 times too fast to be audible on the tape the we all heard. Neil has insisted for decades that he spoke the word. It was actually stolen from Kennedy's "ein." -- Brian Tung The Astronomy Corner at http://astro.isi.edu/ Unofficial C5+ Home Page at http://astro.isi.edu/c5plus/ The PleiadAtlas Home Page at http://astro.isi.edu/pleiadatlas/ My Own Personal FAQ (SAA) at http://astro.isi.edu/reference/faq.html |
#3
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
I (Brian Tung) wrote:
It was actually stolen from Kennedy's "ein." Of course, I'm being unfair to Kennedy. He said what he meant to say-- the "ein" isn't wrong--but it is often thought to be. -- Brian Tung The Astronomy Corner at http://astro.isi.edu/ Unofficial C5+ Home Page at http://astro.isi.edu/c5plus/ The PleiadAtlas Home Page at http://astro.isi.edu/pleiadatlas/ My Own Personal FAQ (SAA) at http://astro.isi.edu/reference/faq.html |
#4
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
"CeeBee" ceebee@novalidmail wrote in message 2.164... "micheel" wrote in sci.astro.amateur: An Australian sound engineer has used technology to decipher the ' a ' in Armstrongs quote. It was actually there but was spoken about 10 times too fast to be audible on the tape the we all heard. Neil has insisted for decades that he spoke the word. Nice. (But even if no one had ever deciphered it, we all would haven known for sure what he really meant nevertheless.) Not so. It is written as recorded. The original recording was scrutinized 'till the cows came home but it was always the same result. The media had no choice but to print the quote as heard even though grammatically it made as much sense as chinese. |
#5
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
"Brian Tung" wrote in message
... I (Brian Tung) wrote: It was actually stolen from Kennedy's "ein." Of course, I'm being unfair to Kennedy. He said what he meant to say-- the "ein" isn't wrong--but it is often thought to be. I thought it was the "Berliner" that was thought to be wrong -- that is, a pastry. -- Rick Evans ---------------------------------------------------------------- Lat +42° 11' 07" Lon -71° 04' 35" ---------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.chempensoftware.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- http://mysite.verizon.net/hiltonevan...troimaging.htm |
#6
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
I (Brian Tung) wrote:
It was actually stolen from Kennedy's "ein." Of course, I'm being unfair to Kennedy. He said what he meant to say-- the "ein" isn't wrong--but it is often thought to be. I thought it was the "Berliner" that was thought to be wrong -- that is, a pastry. -- Rick Evans An urban legend? See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ich_bin...urban_le gend Dennis |
#7
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
"Brian Tung" wrote
Of course, I'm being unfair to Kennedy. He said what he meant to say-- the "ein" isn't wrong--but it is often thought to be. "Rick Evans" wrote: I thought it was the "Berliner" that was thought to be wrong -- that is, a pastry. My understanding was that the use of "ein" as describing personal association leads to an ambiguity. In German, one typically says "I am Berliner". The confusion arises from English where we say "I am a Berliner", and the fact that there is a jelly donut of the same name. So although it's grammatically correct in German to add the "ein", its uncommon use when referring to citizenship leads one to snicker about claiming to be a pastry instead. ============= - Dale Gombert (SkySea at aol.com) 122.38W, 47.58N, W. Seattle, WA http://flavorj.com/~skysea |
#8
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
Rick Evans wrote:
I thought it was the "Berliner" that was thought to be wrong -- that is, a pastry. Well, yes and no. You might think it's like saying "I am a danish," but I doubt that people in Denmark call our danish a danish (that is, if they call it anything at all). Similarly, people in Berlin in the 1960s did eat a kind of pastry, and it was called a Berliner in some parts of Germany--but not in Berlin itself. Kennedy's phrasing was correct, though it would also not have been wrong to say it without the "ein," either. Now, his *pronunciation*--that was a different matter altogether. It seems he spoke German with (understandably) a rather pronounced New England accent. So the middle syllable of Berliner came out rather a bit more palatalized than was appropriate. At any rate he did thank his translator in the next sentence, and there really was no confusion. The Berliners themselves did not think it particularly funny, although apparently there were at least some West Germans who did. -- Brian Tung The Astronomy Corner at http://astro.isi.edu/ Unofficial C5+ Home Page at http://astro.isi.edu/c5plus/ The PleiadAtlas Home Page at http://astro.isi.edu/pleiadatlas/ My Own Personal FAQ (SAA) at http://astro.isi.edu/reference/faq.html |
#9
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
"Dennis Woos" wrote in message
... I (Brian Tung) wrote: It was actually stolen from Kennedy's "ein." Of course, I'm being unfair to Kennedy. He said what he meant to say-- the "ein" isn't wrong--but it is often thought to be. I thought it was the "Berliner" that was thought to be wrong -- that is, a pastry. -- Rick Evans An urban legend? Nein. See the paragraph: " The name "Berliner" is based on etymologic travel: other parts of Germany picked up the pastry under the name of Berliner Pfannkuchen (= pancake from Berlin), which in turn has been shortened to Berliner. That name has travelled further abroad and is now known in some English-speaking regions. In the 1960s however the term "Berliner" for the pastry sounded strange to people in Berlin. " That's why I used the word pastry and NOT "jelly donut" in my comment. -- Rick Evans ---------------------------------------------------------------- Lat +42° 11' 07" Lon -71° 04' 35" ---------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.chempensoftware.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- http://mysite.verizon.net/hiltonevan...troimaging.htm |
#10
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Neil Armstrong Vindicated
micheel wrote:
"CeeBee" ceebee@novalidmail wrote in message 2.164... "micheel" wrote in sci.astro.amateur: An Australian sound engineer has used technology to decipher the ' a ' in Armstrongs quote. It was actually there but was spoken about 10 times too fast to be audible on the tape the we all heard. Neil has insisted for decades that he spoke the word. Nice. (But even if no one had ever deciphered it, we all would haven known for sure what he really meant nevertheless.) Not so. It is written as recorded. The original recording was scrutinized 'till the cows came home but it was always the same result. The media had no choice but to print the quote as heard even though grammatically it made as much sense as chinese. If one were to actually try to *say* "One small step for a man, one giant leap for mankind", one might notice that the "a" before man will likely be pronounced "uh", and is likely to be unvoiced. If you're talking to someone face to face, it's no big deal. They can see your lips move, and so they'll "hear" the "a" even though possibly no sound actually issued forth from your mouth for it. So I don't think one should *need* to scrutinize the original recording to print the quote as it was obviously intended. We can take Armstrong's word for it that he moved his tongue and his lips at the time, knowing that sound doesn't always come out for every word people attempt to speak - and an "a" following an "r" sound happens to be one of the worst cases. John Savard |
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