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Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?



 
 
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  #321  
Old October 15th 18, 08:35 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Gary Harnagel
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Posts: 659
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 1:26:57 PM UTC-6, Martin Brown wrote:

On 15/10/2018 13:37, Gary Harnagel wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 3:57:04 AM UTC-6, Martin Brown wrote:

On 15/10/2018 05:03, Gary Harnagel wrote:

That's an assumption from a parochial perspective. Why would you
believe aliens billions of years ahead of us would be as self-centered
as we are?

I expect if they existed they would be supremely indifferent to us.
In much the same was as we might look down on an amoeba.

They would be more interested in their own peer group of civilisations
that have full interstellar travel capabilities (if that is possible).


That's a conclusion based upon our own proclivities. Suppose intelligent
life is indeed very rare, as some here have asserted, but suppose one
developed early in the universe and have seeded other worlds throughout
the universe. In that case we would be their children and they would
have a specific interest in our development.


I could just about accept that if they really were Gods and were able to
truly play God then we are actually resident in a simulated universe of
their making and that they prefer to watch the ones with interesting
emergent behaviour. I see no evidence at all that they do any meddling.


https://art-soulworks.com/pages/prin...peace-painting

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_Is_for_Real

Multiverse theory permits an infinite universe to sample all parameters
with only the interesting ones ever getting to more complex phases.

ISTR a conjecture that iff it proves possible to build a non-trivial
quantum computer in this universe it considerably shortens the odds that
we are actually inside a simulation in someone else's hyper computer.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown


"Computer, end program" :-)
  #322  
Old October 15th 18, 09:53 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
palsing[_2_]
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Posts: 3,068
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 12:35:55 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

https://art-soulworks.com/pages/prin...peace-painting


In rebuttal I offer...

https://art-soulworks.com/collections/jesus-artwork

.... where, as a True Believer, you can spend up to $3300 for your very own copy of Akiane Kramarik's paintings, a really nice incentive to pull the wool over your eyes, don't you think?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_Is_for_Real


From that Wiki article... "By April 2012, more than one million ebooks had been sold,[1] and more than 10 million copies had been sold by 2014.[2] A feature film based on the book was released on April 16, 2014, earning $101 million at the box office.[3]"

Pretty good reason to 'make up' a story, right?

"The essence of science is that it is always willing to abandon a given idea for a better one; the essence of theology is that it holds its truths to be eternal and immutable."
- H. L. Mencken
  #323  
Old October 16th 18, 04:32 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Gary Harnagel
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Posts: 659
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 2:53:40 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 12:35:55 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

https://art-soulworks.com/pages/prin...peace-painting


In rebuttal I offer...

https://art-soulworks.com/collections/jesus-artwork

... where, as a True Believer, you can spend up to $3300 for your very own
copy of Akiane Kramarik's paintings, a really nice incentive to pull the wool
over your eyes, don't you think?


36" x 48" is a bit BIG, don't you think?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_Is_for_Real


From that Wiki article... "By April 2012, more than one million ebooks had
been sold,[1] and more than 10 million copies had been sold by 2014.[2] A
feature film based on the book was released on April 16, 2014, earning $101
million at the box office.[3]"

Pretty good reason to 'make up' a story, right?


So you go for the hoax explanation. Suspicious type, I guess.

"The essence of science is that it is always willing to abandon a given
idea for a better one; the essence of theology is that it holds its truths
to be eternal and immutable." - H. L. Mencken


This wasn't true of primitive Christianity. It is generally true of
so-called Christianity today because Constantine put the last nail in the
coffin of the original religion.

"There is no regularly constituted church of Christ on earth, nor any
person qualified to administer any church ordinances; nor can there be
until new apostles are sent by the Great Head of the Church for whose
coming I am seeking." -- Roger Williams
  #324  
Old October 16th 18, 06:29 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
palsing[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,068
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 8:32:39 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:
On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 2:53:40 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 12:35:55 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

https://art-soulworks.com/pages/prin...peace-painting


In rebuttal I offer...

https://art-soulworks.com/collections/jesus-artwork

... where, as a True Believer, you can spend up to $3300 for your very own
copy of Akiane Kramarik's paintings, a really nice incentive to pull the wool
over your eyes, don't you think?


36" x 48" is a bit BIG, don't you think?


Sure, it's big, but it is the size of the original and after all, it *is* all about the money, IMHO. Money trumps religion, just ask those TV evangelists...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_Is_for_Real


From that Wiki article... "By April 2012, more than one million ebooks had
been sold,[1] and more than 10 million copies had been sold by 2014.[2] A
feature film based on the book was released on April 16, 2014, earning $101
million at the box office.[3]"

Pretty good reason to 'make up' a story, right?


So you go for the hoax explanation. Suspicious type, I guess.


Yeah, when it comes to organized religions (all 4200 of them, as per Wiki), I am *very* suspicious. What sane person wouldn't be suspicious?

"The essence of science is that it is always willing to abandon a given
idea for a better one; the essence of theology is that it holds its truths
to be eternal and immutable." - H. L. Mencken


This wasn't true of primitive Christianity. It is generally true of
so-called Christianity today because Constantine put the last nail in the
coffin of the original religion.


"There is no regularly constituted church of Christ on earth, nor any
person qualified to administer any church ordinances; nor can there be
until new apostles are sent by the Great Head of the Church for whose
coming I am seeking." -- Roger Williams


I think that H.L. Mencken could kick Roger Williams' butt any day of the week when it comes to quotes :)

"Why assume so glibly that the God who presumably created the universe is still running it? It is certainly perfectly conceivable that He may have finished it and then turned it over to lesser gods to operate. In the same way many human institutions are turned over to grossly inferior men. This is true, for example, of most universities, and of all great newspapers."
H.L. Mencken
  #325  
Old October 16th 18, 11:45 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Quadibloc
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Posts: 7,018
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 11:29:25 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

I think that H.L. Mencken could kick Roger Williams' butt any day of the week

when it comes to quotes :)

"Why assume so glibly that the God who presumably created the universe is

still running it? It is certainly perfectly conceivable that He may have
finished it and then turned it over to lesser gods to operate. In the same way
many human institutions are turned over to grossly inferior men. This is true,
for example, of most universities, and of all great newspapers."
H.L. Mencken


Actually, that's not inconsistent with his theory at all.

First, there's a supernatural First Cause, the One God of theology, Who created
the Universe causing the first Big Bang...

and then He left running it to those advanced aliens the other poster is talking
about.

John Savard
  #326  
Old October 16th 18, 12:54 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Gary Harnagel
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 659
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 11:29:25 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 8:32:39 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 2:53:40 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 12:35:55 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

https://art-soulworks.com/pages/prin...peace-painting

In rebuttal I offer...

https://art-soulworks.com/collections/jesus-artwork

... where, as a True Believer, you can spend up to $3300 for your very own
copy of Akiane Kramarik's paintings, a really nice incentive to pull the
wool over your eyes, don't you think?


36" x 48" is a bit BIG, don't you think?


Sure, it's big, but it is the size of the original and after all, it *is* all
about the money, IMHO. Money trumps religion, just ask those TV evangelists...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg


That's disgusting. See below.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_Is_for_Real

From that Wiki article... "By April 2012, more than one million ebooks had
been sold,[1] and more than 10 million copies had been sold by 2014.[2] A
feature film based on the book was released on April 16, 2014, earning
$101 million at the box office.[3]"

Pretty good reason to 'make up' a story, right?


So you go for the hoax explanation. Suspicious type, I guess.


Yeah, when it comes to organized religions (all 4200 of them, as per Wiki),
I am *very* suspicious. What sane person wouldn't be suspicious?


I agree, but you should read the book or watch the movie "Heaven is for Real"
before you dismiss it. That $101 million box office receipts didn't go to
the Burpos, you know.

"The essence of science is that it is always willing to abandon a given
idea for a better one; the essence of theology is that it holds its truths
to be eternal and immutable." - H. L. Mencken


This wasn't true of primitive Christianity. It is generally true of
so-called Christianity today because Constantine put the last nail in the
coffin of the original religion.

"There is no regularly constituted church of Christ on earth, nor any
person qualified to administer any church ordinances; nor can there be
until new apostles are sent by the Great Head of the Church for whose
coming I am seeking." -- Roger Williams


I think that H.L. Mencken could kick Roger Williams' butt any day of the
week when it comes to quotes :)

"Why assume so glibly that the God who presumably created the universe is
still running it? It is certainly perfectly conceivable that He may have
finished it and then turned it over to lesser gods to operate. In the same
way many human institutions are turned over to grossly inferior men. This
is true, for example, of most universities, and of all great newspapers."
H.L. Mencken


Everyone comes to the God-table with his own set of prejudices and system
of beliefs. I have mine, you have yours and Mencken has his. Concepts of
God can be divided into several categories. For example:

1. There is no God and everything happens according to the laws of physics.

2. There is a God, but he is PART of the universe. He brought order to the
chaos.

3. There is a God who created the universe but then cut out, so everything
happens by the laws of physics (motion, relativity, quantum mechanics, etc.)
from that point on.

4. God created the universe and is involved only in "the big picture."

5. God created the universe and is intimately concerned about each person.

And there are subheadings and combinations of the last four. So when you
talk about God, you bring certain assumptions about who He is to the table
that aren't explicitly stated. This is true even for #1. Mencken is
probably in that category but pretends to be in #3 or #4. I'm in a variant
of #5 with a dash of #2. You might ask, "How could God have created the
universe yet be a part of it?" There is a way :-)
  #327  
Old October 16th 18, 01:09 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Gary Harnagel
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 659
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Tuesday, October 16, 2018 at 4:45:07 AM UTC-6, Quadibloc wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 11:29:25 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

I think that H.L. Mencken could kick Roger Williams' butt any day of
the week when it comes to quotes :)

"Why assume so glibly that the God who presumably created the universe is
still running it? It is certainly perfectly conceivable that He may have
finished it and then turned it over to lesser gods to operate. In the
same way many human institutions are turned over to grossly inferior men.
This is true, for example, of most universities, and of all great
newspapers."
H.L. Mencken


Actually, that's not inconsistent with his theory at all.

First, there's a supernatural First Cause, the One God of theology, Who
created the Universe causing the first Big Bang...

and then He left running it to those advanced aliens the other poster is
talking about.

John Savard


Or He is still overseeing the ETs as in Clarke's "Childhood's End."

Or the ET civilizations are resurrected people from this and other earths
plus worlds in a mortal state. As to a first cause, I'm partial to a
variation of the ekpyrotic concept where branes interact to create a genesis.
  #328  
Old October 17th 18, 06:33 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
palsing[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,068
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Tuesday, October 16, 2018 at 4:54:30 AM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:
On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 11:29:25 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 8:32:39 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 2:53:40 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 12:35:55 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

https://art-soulworks.com/pages/prin...peace-painting

In rebuttal I offer...

https://art-soulworks.com/collections/jesus-artwork

... where, as a True Believer, you can spend up to $3300 for your very own
copy of Akiane Kramarik's paintings, a really nice incentive to pull the
wool over your eyes, don't you think?

36" x 48" is a bit BIG, don't you think?


Sure, it's big, but it is the size of the original and after all, it *is* all
about the money, IMHO. Money trumps religion, just ask those TV evangelists...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg


That's disgusting. See below.


Of course it's disgusting, it's about scumbag televangalists!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_Is_for_Real

From that Wiki article... "By April 2012, more than one million ebooks had
been sold,[1] and more than 10 million copies had been sold by 2014.[2] A
feature film based on the book was released on April 16, 2014, earning
$101 million at the box office.[3]"

Pretty good reason to 'make up' a story, right?

So you go for the hoax explanation. Suspicious type, I guess.


Yeah, when it comes to organized religions (all 4200 of them, as per Wiki),
I am *very* suspicious. What sane person wouldn't be suspicious?


I agree, but you should read the book or watch the movie "Heaven is for Real"
before you dismiss it. That $101 million box office receipts didn't go to
the Burpos, you know.


Not all of it did, but this family is beyond rich these days...

https://www.idolnetworth.com/todd-bu...t-worth-189111

.... I would say that $42 million is certainly a nice return for a fantasy yarn. As always, Gary... "Follow the Money"! By the way, here is a well-thought-out expose about Burpo that you should read...

https://nathandickey.wordpress.com/2...n-is-for-real/

.... you might even modify your thinking about all of this.

"The essence of science is that it is always willing to abandon a given
idea for a better one; the essence of theology is that it holds its truths
to be eternal and immutable." - H. L. Mencken


This wasn't true of primitive Christianity. It is generally true of
so-called Christianity today because Constantine put the last nail in the
coffin of the original religion.

"There is no regularly constituted church of Christ on earth, nor any
person qualified to administer any church ordinances; nor can there be
until new apostles are sent by the Great Head of the Church for whose
coming I am seeking." -- Roger Williams


I think that H.L. Mencken could kick Roger Williams' butt any day of the
week when it comes to quotes :)

"Why assume so glibly that the God who presumably created the universe is
still running it? It is certainly perfectly conceivable that He may have
finished it and then turned it over to lesser gods to operate. In the same
way many human institutions are turned over to grossly inferior men. This
is true, for example, of most universities, and of all great newspapers."
H.L. Mencken


Everyone comes to the God-table with his own set of prejudices and system
of beliefs. I have mine, you have yours and Mencken has his. Concepts of
God can be divided into several categories. For example:


1. There is no God and everything happens according to the laws of physics.


As far as I am concerned, you can stop right there. Bingo!

... So when you talk about God, you bring certain assumptions about who He is to the table that aren't explicitly stated. This is true even for #1.


Well, here I disagree completely. I think your #1 is self-explanatory, and it is pretty dang straightforward, to me.

I understand that your mileage may vary.

  #329  
Old October 17th 18, 08:10 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Gary Harnagel
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 659
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Tuesday, October 16, 2018 at 11:33:30 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Tuesday, October 16, 2018 at 4:54:30 AM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 11:29:25 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

Sure, it's big, but it is the size of the original and after all, it
*is* all about the money, IMHO. Money trumps religion, just ask those
TV evangelists...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg


That's disgusting. See below.


Of course it's disgusting, it's about scumbag televangalists!


Who are scumbags because they make a lot of money huckstering according to
you. So what about those who claim some divine revelation but make no
money and, in fact, are persecuted for it and die ignominiously broke?
Should you not embrace their claims?

Yeah, when it comes to organized religions (all 4200 of them, as per
Wiki), I am *very* suspicious. What sane person wouldn't be suspicious?


I agree, but you should read the book or watch the movie "Heaven is for
Real" before you dismiss it. That $101 million box office receipts didn't
go to the Burpos, you know.


Not all of it did, but this family is beyond rich these days...

https://www.idolnetworth.com/todd-bu...t-worth-189111

... I would say that $42 million is certainly a nice return for a fantasy
yarn. As always, Gary... "Follow the Money"! By the way, here is a well-
thought-out expose about Burpo that you should read...

https://nathandickey.wordpress.com/2...n-is-for-real/


It's obvious that Dickey doesn't have an open mind. All of his "objections"
amount to speculation and parochial thinking. When you fold in the Akiane
story it gets MUCH more difficult to explain.

... you might even modify your thinking about all of this.


Actually, I've modified my thinking about YOU. Since you have previously
claimed to be an agnostic, it's refreshing to see that you have come out
of THAT closet.

I think that H.L. Mencken could kick Roger Williams' butt any day of the
week when it comes to quotes :)

"Why assume so glibly that the God who presumably created the universe is
still running it? It is certainly perfectly conceivable that He may have
finished it and then turned it over to lesser gods to operate. In the same
way many human institutions are turned over to grossly inferior men. This
is true, for example, of most universities, and of all great newspapers."
H.L. Mencken


Everyone comes to the God-table with his own set of prejudices and system
of beliefs. I have mine, you have yours and Mencken has his. Concepts of
God can be divided into several categories. For example:


1. There is no God and everything happens according to the laws of physics.


As far as I am concerned, you can stop right there. Bingo!


Yep. Refreshing that you finally admit it.

... So when you talk about God, you bring certain assumptions about who
He is to the table that aren't explicitly stated. This is true even for #1.


Well, here I disagree completely. I think your #1 is self-explanatory, and
it is pretty dang straightforward, to me.

I understand that your mileage may vary.


You've tried desperately to deny all the evidence about early civilizations,
so it's pretty dang clear that you fall close to this category:

"He is a self-made man and worships his creator." - John Bright

Rather than this one:

“I can see how it might be possible for a man to look down upon the
earth and be an atheist, but I cannot conceive how he could look up
into the heavens and say there is no God.” – Abraham Lincoln

BTW, I read Ruppelt's "The Report on Unidentified Flying Objects" in
the fifties and came away allowing that there might well be some substance
to UFOs. A few years ago, I read a 2nd edition of it which had two extra
chapters, the last one pointing out that all instances where photos of
radarscopes were taken, the "unknowns" were explained. That caused me to
being a "nonbeliever." Then THIS happened:

https://video.search.yahoo.com/searc...f&action=click

So that refutes Ruppelt's claim. Maybe they ARE here after all :-)
  #330  
Old October 18th 18, 05:57 AM posted to sci.astro.amateur
palsing[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,068
Default Neil DeGrasse Tyson headed down same loony road as Carl Sagan?

On Wednesday, October 17, 2018 at 12:10:54 PM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:
On Tuesday, October 16, 2018 at 11:33:30 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

On Tuesday, October 16, 2018 at 4:54:30 AM UTC-7, Gary Harnagel wrote:

On Monday, October 15, 2018 at 11:29:25 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:

Sure, it's big, but it is the size of the original and after all, it
*is* all about the money, IMHO. Money trumps religion, just ask those
TV evangelists...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg

That's disgusting. See below.


Of course it's disgusting, it's about scumbag televangalists!


Who are scumbags because they make a lot of money huckstering according to
you. So what about those who claim some divine revelation but make no
money and, in fact, are persecuted for it and die ignominiously broke?
Should you not embrace their claims?


Well, you are the guy who has promoted the word 'huckster', and it could not be more appropriate. As per Webster...

: HAWKER, PEDDLER
especially : one who sells or advertises something in an aggressive, dishonest, or annoying way

Do you really think that a religious huckster could be considered anything but a scumbag? I don't either... and regarding those who claim divine revelation without compensation? I suppose they just don't have the proper huckster chops.

Yeah, when it comes to organized religions (all 4200 of them, as per
Wiki), I am *very* suspicious. What sane person wouldn't be suspicious?

I agree, but you should read the book or watch the movie "Heaven is for
Real" before you dismiss it. That $101 million box office receipts didn't
go to the Burpos, you know.


Not all of it did, but this family is beyond rich these days...

https://www.idolnetworth.com/todd-bu...t-worth-189111

... I would say that $42 million is certainly a nice return for a fantasy
yarn. As always, Gary... "Follow the Money"! By the way, here is a well-
thought-out expose about Burpo that you should read...

https://nathandickey.wordpress.com/2...n-is-for-real/


It's obvious that Dickey doesn't have an open mind. All of his "objections"
amount to speculation and parochial thinking. When you fold in the Akiane
story it gets MUCH more difficult to explain.


Much like Burpo's story is just speculation and parochial thinking. Not much substance there, in my view... and I doubt that I am alone in this thinking. It seems to me that you very much *want* to believe this stuff, while I, on the other hand, demand evidence as defined by the scientific method, that is, repeatable experiments and/or observations. Do you happen to have any of thse?

Follow the money, Gary, and all will become clear.

... you might even modify your thinking about all of this.


Actually, I've modified my thinking about YOU. Since you have previously
claimed to be an agnostic, it's refreshing to see that you have come out
of THAT closet.


There is a fine line between an atheist and an agnostic. If the concept of a god could be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, like all good scientists, I would change my evil ways... but the odds are very long that this will ever happen.

I think that H.L. Mencken could kick Roger Williams' butt any day of the
week when it comes to quotes :)

"Why assume so glibly that the God who presumably created the universe is
still running it? It is certainly perfectly conceivable that He may have
finished it and then turned it over to lesser gods to operate. In the same
way many human institutions are turned over to grossly inferior men.. This
is true, for example, of most universities, and of all great newspapers."
H.L. Mencken

Everyone comes to the God-table with his own set of prejudices and system
of beliefs. I have mine, you have yours and Mencken has his. Concepts of
God can be divided into several categories. For example:


1. There is no God and everything happens according to the laws of physics.


As far as I am concerned, you can stop right there. Bingo!


Yep. Refreshing that you finally admit it.


I'm happy that you are refreshed.

... So when you talk about God, you bring certain assumptions about who
He is to the table that aren't explicitly stated. This is true even for #1.


Well, here I disagree completely. I think your #1 is self-explanatory, and
it is pretty dang straightforward, to me.

I understand that your mileage may vary.


You've tried desperately to deny all the evidence about early civilizations,
so it's pretty dang clear that you fall close to this category:


Uh, just which early civilizations am I supposed to have desperately denied? I don't recall ever doing such a thing... please refresh my memory.

"He is a self-made man and worships his creator." - John Bright

Rather than this one:

“I can see how it might be possible for a man to look down upon the
earth and be an atheist, but I cannot conceive how he could look up
into the heavens and say there is no God.” – Abraham Lincoln


Lincoln was no scientist, so he can be forgiven for saying what he said. Just because *he* couldn't conceive of such a thing does not mean that others cannot. Lincoln did say... "if I were two-faced, would I be wearing this one?", and that I can believe!

BTW, I read Ruppelt's "The Report on Unidentified Flying Objects" in
the fifties and came away allowing that there might well be some substance
to UFOs. A few years ago, I read a 2nd edition of it which had two extra
chapters, the last one pointing out that all instances where photos of
radarscopes were taken, the "unknowns" were explained. That caused me to
being a "nonbeliever." Then THIS happened:

https://video.search.yahoo.com/searc...f&action=click

So that refutes Ruppelt's claim. Maybe they ARE here after all :-)


However, maybe some flyboys thought they would stir the pot, just for laughs. It is definitely within the realm of possibility and has been done before umpteen times. Who knows? I sure don't, and neither do you. I am too much of a skeptic to fall for a single claimed incident. If the 'observation' is singular and has never been repeated, I say 'beware', and so should you! The current thinking is that the distances are just too far to be considered realistic and that no other beings could have possibly ever been here, and this is what a vast majority of scientists say today, and that is good enough for me, at this point in time.

Remember these guys?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barney_and_Betty_Hill

A whole lot of folks still believe this is god's truth. How about you?

 




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