liquid gauging

Thanks to all of you for the good information. I'll start getting the
material referenced. I did a literature search on my own and turned up some
good stuff but not any of the stuff mentioned in this news group. Thanks

"Pat Flannery" wrote in message
...


Henry Spencer wrote:


You might want to see if you can scare up a copy of Elliot Ring's book
"Rocket propellant and pressurization systems", Prentice-Hall 1964, which
has several possibly-relevant chapters. (The downside is that it's rare
and expensive; check a good technical library before resorting to the
used-book market. My copy is not for sale. :-))


This might help:
http://www.worldcatlibraries.org/wcp...86af058e1.html

Pat

Frank Dodge wrote:
I have a small project with NASA to survey the ways that the volume or
quantity of liquid in the tanks of space vehicles has been determined (or
gauged) in the past. This is especially true for in-space or reduced gravity
conditons but I am also interested in ground applications also (for example,
filling the tanks with cryogenic propellants). If any of you know anything
about this, please reply to this post. And if you could supply a literature
citation or some other kind of reference, that would be a bonus.

Frank Dodge

Here are documents from NASA's NTRS server concerning liquid propellant
sensors:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PROPELLANT QUANTITY GAUGING SYSTEM UNDER ZERO G

NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-119935 , 19710817; AUG 17, 1971
EVALUATION OF CANDIDATE PROPELLANT GAUGING SYSTEMS UNDER
ZERO G FOR USE ON SPACE SHUTTLE VEHICLE

Accession ID: 71N36104
Document ID: 19710026628

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1971026628.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Study of zero-g propellant gauging based on tank electromagnetic
resonances

Bahr, A. J.; Karp, A.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-150270 , 19750401; Apr 1, 1975

Accession ID: 77N78380
Document ID: 19770077160

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1977077160.pdf


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Capacitance propellant gaging study for orbiting spacecraft Final
development report

NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-87496 , 19670601; Jun 1, 1967
Capacitance technique of gauging orbiting spacecraft liquid propellant
tanks in
zero gravity environment

Accession ID: 67N34606
Document ID: 19670025277

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1967025277.pdf


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Calibration of the descent propulsion system propellant tanks and
propellant quantity gauging system

Klaasen, K. P.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-112743; B70-03012 , 19700305; Mar 5, 1970

Accession ID: 79N72542
Document ID: 19790073034

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1979073034.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The performance of point level sensors in liquid hydrogen

Burgeson, D. A.; Pestalozzi, W. G.; Richards, R. J.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-55328; NBS-R-292 , 19630101; Jan 1, 1963
Point level sensor apparatus performance in liquid hydrogen

Accession ID: 64N15881
Document ID: 19640005967

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1964005967.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carbon resistors for cryogenic liquid level measurement

Muhlenhaupt, R. C.; Smelser, P.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-55333; NBS-TN-200 , 19631009; Oct 9, 1963
Carbon resistors for cryogenic liquid-level measurement

Accession ID: 64N14272
Document ID: 19640004358

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1964004358.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

An integrated hot wire-stillwell liquid level sensor system for liquid
hydrogen
and other cryogenic fluids

Olsen, W. A., Jr.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-TN-D-2074 , 19631101; Nov 1, 1963
Hot-wire stillwell liquid level sensor system for use with cryogenic
fluids

Accession ID: 64N10466
Document ID: 19640000557

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1964000557.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Investigation and development of an rf liquid level sensing technique
summary of
laboratory investigation, jul. 1964 - 15 feb. 1965

Lockhart, J. D.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-67313; LMSC-A734537 , 19650215; Feb 15, 1965
Radio frequency, resonant cavity technique to determine liquid level at
zero gravity

Accession ID: 65N35352
Document ID: 19650025751

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1965025751.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Differential temperature cryogenic liquid level sensing system Final
report

Mills, E. D.; Oneil, J. A.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-70317 , 19650415; Apr 15, 1965
Differential temperature cryogenic liquid level sensing system design
and development
Accession ID: 66N17100
Document ID: 19660007811

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1966007811.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RF LIQUID-LEVEL SENSING TECHNIQUE

LOCKHART, J. D.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-74204; LMSC-A785006 , 19660228; FEB 28, 1966
RADIO FREQUENCY LIQUID LEVEL SENSING TECHNIQUE DEVELOPMENT FOR
PROPELLANT TANK APPLICATIONS

Accession ID: 66N23798
Document ID: 19660014509

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1966014509.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Liquid level sensor system for cryogenic propellants Final report

NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-76401 , 19660318; Mar 18, 1966
Cryogenic propellant liquid level sensors - propellant probe, sensor
unit,
and performance testing and calibration

Accession ID: 66N31379
Document ID: 19660022089

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1966022089.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Development of optical liquid level sensor for use in liquid hydrogen
Final report,
Jun. 1964 - Oct. 1965

Dray, W.; Hosford, N.; Lenker, P.; Resh, R.; Shearer, R.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-88885 , 19670608; Jun 8, 1967
Optical liquid level sensor for use in liquid hydrogen

Accession ID: 67N37868
Document ID: 19670028539

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1967028539.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fiber-optic instrumentation: Cryogenic sensor model description; for
measurement
of conditions in cryogenic liquid propellant tanks

Sharma, M. M.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-160448; TR-A001 , 19791125; Nov 25, 1979
An assessment and determination of technology requirements for
developing a demonstration model to evaluate feasibility of practical
cryogenic liquid level, pressure, and temperature sensors is presented.
The construction of a demonstration model to measure characteristics of
the selected sensor and to develop test procedures are discussed as
well as the development of an appropriate electronic subsystem to
operate the sensors.

Accession ID: 80N17848
Document ID: 19800009586

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1980009586.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Optical Cryogenic Tank Level Sensor

Duffell, Amanda
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
The 2004 NASA Faculty Fellowship Program Research Reports,
NASA/CR-2005-213847,
XIV-1 - XIV-6 , 20050101; January 2005
Cryogenic fluids play an important role in space transportation. Liquid
oxygen and hydrogen are vital fuel components for liquid rocket
engines. It is also difficult to accurately measure the liquid level in
the cryogenic tanks containing the liquids. The current methods use
thermocouple rakes, floats, or sonic meters to measure tank level.
Thermocouples have problems examining the boundary between the boiling
liquid and the gas inside the tanks. They are also slow to respond to
temperature changes. Sonic meters need to be mounted inside the tank,
but still above the liquid level. This causes problems for full tanks,
or tanks that are being rotated to lie on their side.

Document ID: 20050215302

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...2005218134.pdf

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Rusty

Frank Dodge wrote:
I have a small project with NASA to survey the ways that the volume or
quantity of liquid in the tanks of space vehicles has been determined (or
gauged) in the past. This is especially true for in-space or reduced gravity
conditons but I am also interested in ground applications also (for example,
filling the tanks with cryogenic propellants). If any of you know anything
about this, please reply to this post. And if you could supply a literature
citation or some other kind of reference, that would be a bonus.

Frank Dodge

Here are some additional PDF documents concerning propellant quantity
measurements:


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Apollo experience report: Service propulsion subsystem

Gibson, C. R.; Wood, J. A.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-TN-D-7375; JSC-S-378 , 19730801; Aug 1, 1973
The significant service propulsion subsystem development,
qualification, and flight experience from the early portion of the
Apollo Program through the first lunar-landing mission is presented.
Particular emphasis is given to problems encountered and solutions used
to eliminate the problems.

Accession ID: 73N31763
Document ID: 19730023031

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1973023031.pdf

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Apollo experience report: Ascent propulsion system

Humphries, C. E.; Taylor, R. E.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-TN-D-7082; MSC-S-341 , 19730301; Mar 1, 1973
The development of the Apollo lunar module ascent propulsion subsystem
is documented. The ascent propulsion subsystem was designed, built, and
tested to provide propulsive power for launching the ascent stage of
the lunar module from the surface of the moon into lunar orbit for
rendezvous with the orbiting command and service module. Because total
redundancy was prohibitive in this subsystem, special emphasis had to
be placed on reliability in design with adequate demonstration short of
an extensive flight-demonstration program. The significant technical
problems encountered during all phases of the program are identified
and the corrective actions are discussed. Based on this experience,
several recommendations are made for any future program with similar
subsystem requirements.

Accession ID: 73N18900
Document ID: 19730010173

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1973010173.pdf

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Apollo experience report: Descent propulsion system

Hammock, W. R., Jr.; Currie, E. C.; Fisher, A. E.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-TN-D-7143; MSC-S-349 , 19730301; Mar 1, 1973
The propulsion system for the descent stage of the lunar module was
designed to provide thrust to transfer the fully loaded lunar module
with two crewmen from the lunar parking orbit to the lunar surface. A
history of the development of this system is presented. Development was
accomplished primarily by ground testing of individual components and
by testing the integrated system. Unique features of the descent
propulsion system were the deep throttling capability and the use of a
lightweight cryogenic helium pressurization system.

Accession ID: 73N19877
Document ID: 19730011150

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1973011150.pdf

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Propulsion subsystem. engineering analysis report, Gemini-Agena target
vehicle

NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-96963; LMSC-A604141; SP-129-64-17 , 19640630; Jun 30, 1964

Accession ID: 79N76535
Document ID: 19790077027

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1979077027.pdf

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONTROL DYNAMICS ANALYSIS OF THE CENTAUR STAGE PROPELLANT UTILIZATION
CONTROL SYSTEM

RINGLAND, R. F.; STUBBLEFIELD, W. O.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-54942; GD/C-DDE-65-007 , 19650501; MAY 1, 1965
STABILITY PROPERTIES OF CENTAUR PROPELLANT UTILIZATION CONTROL SYSTEM
Accession ID: 66N22895
Document ID: 19660013606

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1966013606.pdf

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Saturn 1B/Centaur propulsion systems compatibility study
Traxler, J. J.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-CR-133597; TN-AE-65-106 , 19650806; Aug 6, 1965

Accession ID: 73N73589
Document ID: 19730064347

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1973064347.pdf

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Analysis of Centaur propellant utilization difference bridge

Magrini, O. J.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-TM-X-1440 , 19671001; Oct 1, 1967
Centaur propellant utilization difference bridge performance in
correcting
deviations from desired mass ratio

Accession ID: 67N37302
Document ID: 19670027973

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1967027973.pdf

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Centaur launch vehicle propellant utilization system

Berns, J. A.; Stofan, A. J.; Szabo, S. V., Jr.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-TN-D-4848 , 19681001; Oct 1, 1968
Development, configuration, and operation of Centaur propellant
utilization system
Accession ID: 68N36507
Document ID: 19680027035

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1968027035.pdf

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Orbital investigation of propellant dynamics in a large rocket booster

Buchanan, H. J.; Bugg, F. M.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-TN-D-3968 , 19670501; May 1, 1967
Orbital investigation of liquid hydrogen dynamics in propellant tank of
S-IVB stage
Accession ID: 67N26546
Document ID: 19670017217

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1967017217.pdf

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Rusty

Rusty wrote:

Here are documents from NASA's NTRS server concerning liquid propellant
sensors:



Yeah, I was waiting for the other magnetic spaceboot to drop.
That should keep him busy for a month or so. :-D

"Here he comes...to save the day!
Rusty Barton is - on - the - way!
He will find a printable data file!
He will find them by the pile!
There is no NASA file he can't find!
To get someone out - of - a - bind!
Ignorance must flee away...when Rusty Barton's on the way!"

Pat

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 02:01:19 -0500, Pat Flannery wrote:

"Here he comes...to save the day!
Rusty Barton is - on - the - way!
He will find a printable data file!
He will find them by the pile!
There is no NASA file he can't find!
To get someone out - of - a - bind!
Ignorance must flee away...when Rusty Barton's on the way!"

You wouldn't happen to still have your old 45 rpm copy of
the Mighty Mouse Theme, would you? It has a pink label,
if that helps you find it. Play it on 33 rpm. Sounds like a
bunch of really old drunk guys. One of my earliest childhood
traumas...

Dale

I'm sure this relates to liquid gauging somehow.

Dale wrote:

You wouldn't happen to still have your old 45 rpm copy of
the Mighty Mouse Theme, would you? It has a pink label,
if that helps you find it. Play it on 33 rpm. Sounds like a
bunch of really old drunk guys. One of my earliest childhood
traumas...



Knowing the reputation of animators, that was probably exactly the state
it was written and sung in.
God knows what those Disney guys were on when they started designing and
drawing the Mars life for "Mars And Beyond".
Hunter S. Thompson or William S. Burroughs could have probably told you
the exact pharmaceuticals involved in seeing things like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lag2ooJUZ3E
That video makes Mars look a bit top-heavy with predators.
That thing a 1:28 scared the hell out of me as a kid, and it scares the
hell out of me now.
If I were a Mars astronaut and got out of the lander to see **** like
this going on around me, I'd be heading Earthward inside of ten minutes.
:-D

Pat

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 04:01:51 -0500, Pat Flannery wrote:

God knows what those Disney guys were on when they started designing and
drawing the Mars life for "Mars And Beyond".
Hunter S. Thompson or William S. Burroughs could have probably told you
the exact pharmaceuticals involved in seeing things like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lag2ooJUZ3E
That video makes Mars look a bit top-heavy with predators.
That thing a 1:28 scared the hell out of me as a kid, and it scares the
hell out of me now.
If I were a Mars astronaut and got out of the lander to see **** like
this going on around me, I'd be heading Earthward inside of ten minutes.

You'd be way behind me Did Orson Welles start drinking heavily before he
took that narration gig, or after?

Dale

Dale wrote:

You'd be way behind me Did Orson Welles start drinking heavily before he
took that narration gig, or after?



Damned if I know, but it does look like the DTs to end all DTs, doesn't it?
This thing would fit right into that ecosystem:
http://www.dvdtalk.com/dvdsavant/images/47batrat.jpg
Except for being too normal.
I wonder if the jewel-like growing crystals had any influence on "The
Andromeda Strain"?
The growing rocks are reminiscent of "The Monolith Monsters".
You just know if you keep wandering around on that horrifying place
you're going to meet one of these sooner or later:
http://praxeology.net/SHADOW1.JPG :-)

Pat

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 00:10:27 -0700, in a place far, far away, Dale
made the phosphor on my monitor glow in such a way as to
indicate that:

You wouldn't happen to still have your old 45 rpm copy of
the Mighty Mouse Theme, would you? It has a pink label,
if that helps you find it. Play it on 33 rpm. Sounds like a
bunch of really old drunk guys. One of my earliest childhood
traumas...

Imagine Andy Kaufman lip synching to that version.

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 02:31:30 -0700, Dale wrote:

Did Orson Welles start drinking heavily before he
took that narration gig, or after?

....After. Remember, he was getting product as well as cash for doing
the Paul Masson commercials. Word has it when he did that Nostradamus
flick in the late 70's, he was so plastered he had to be seated the
whole time in order to shoot his scenes.

OM
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