Lunar lander ideas over the decades

https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...0190031985.pdf
I ended up skimming it after awhile, but a LOT of details.

My only regret is I wish they had more details on some of the Apollo LM
derivatives such as the LM Truck and other ideas for post-Apollo.

In article ,
says...

https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...0190031985.pdf
I ended up skimming it after awhile, but a LOT of details.

My only regret is I wish they had more details on some of the Apollo LM
derivatives such as the LM Truck and other ideas for post-Apollo.

Agreed. This is more of a collection of lunar lander studies done post-
Apollo. What stuck me was the wide variation in solutions. Also the
fact that we've literally been studying this for decades. This is what
analysis paralysis looks like.

Jeff
--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.

Hi all,

Can anyone give me an idea of the size of this file? My browser has downloaded 45 MB and still says its Progress is 0%.

Is there a lower-resolution version somewhere?

Thanks and regards
Frank

On Jun/19/2020 at 04:13, wrote :
Hi all,

Can anyone give me an idea of the size of this file? My browser has downloaded 45 MB and still says its Progress is 0%.

Is there a lower-resolution version somewhere?

Thanks and regards
Frank

467.1 MB


Alain Fournier

On 6/17/2020 9:03 PM, Greg (Strider) Moore wrote:
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...0190031985.pdf
I ended up skimming it after awhile, but a LOT of details.

My only regret is I wish they had more details on some of the Apollo LM
derivatives such as the LM Truck and other ideas for post-Apollo.

I just finished binge watching the 1998 HBO Series "From the Earth To
The Moon" and besides being amused over seeing a very young Tom Hanks, I
enjoyed most of it. Not that impressed with the story angle taken for
the episode about Apollo 13, focusing on the media rather than the
mission itself. But hey, Hanks had done the movie already (1995). The
rest were good. I esp. enjoyed the episode dealing with Apollo 15.

In any case in the episode devoted to the Lunar Module (LM, aka Lunar
Excursion Module - LEM) goes through in some detail all the design
decisions made that evolved the Apollo lander. It was very interesting
to watch. As always I'm sure there are better books out there too.

I like how it was shed, shed, shed. From circular base for the Decent
Module to the adapted octagonal design, from the removal of the seats
which changed the view ports (or vice versa), removal of the forward
docking adapter, meaning the LM crew could no longer directly observe or
mate for docking with the Command Module (CM). To the thinning of the
walls of the LM to make it as light as possible.

Then to have the rover available in later missions. Etc. I had forgotten
that when the TV camera moved from stationary to the rover, it took
longer to get video from the moon, but man when it came in, it was
awesome! We had a relatively new color TV and it was just incredible to
see those live pictures on the moon! I know most people had tuned out
but as a kid I was a space nut. I just couldn't believe at the time
people were not watch this! At least CBS was carrying most of it, the
other networks not so much! Remember, no NASA TV in those days! Got to
watch Apollo 17 taking off from the moon as well! An incredible act of
remote camera operation given the delays involved. The series made that
clear enough!

Any thoughts on if you believe any of these follow-on LM ideas will come
to fruition under Artemis?

I've just finished downloading the doc. Haven't looked at it yet.

Dave

On Jun/19/2020 at 15:18, David Spain wrote :
On 6/17/2020 9:03 PM, Greg (Strider) Moore wrote:
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...0190031985.pdf
I ended up skimming it after awhile, but a LOT of details.

My only regret is I wish they had more details on some of the Apollo
LM derivatives such as the LM Truck and other ideas for post-Apollo.

I just finished binge watching the 1998 HBO Series "From the Earth To
The Moon" and besides being amused over seeing a very young Tom Hanks, I
enjoyed most of it. Not that impressed with the story angle taken for
the episode about Apollo 13, focusing on the media rather than the
mission itself. But hey, Hanks had done the movie already (1995). The
rest were good. I esp. enjoyed the episode dealing with Apollo 15.

In any case in the episode devoted to the Lunar Module (LM, aka Lunar
Excursion Module - LEM) goes through in some detail all the design
decisions made that evolved the Apollo lander. It was very interesting
to watch. As always I'm sure there are better books out there too.

I like how it was shed, shed, shed. From circular base for the Decent
Module to the adapted octagonal design, from the removal of the seats
which changed the view ports (or vice versa), removal of the forward
docking adapter, meaning the LM crew could no longer directly observe or
mate for docking with the Command Module (CM). To the thinning of the
walls of the LM to make it as light as possible.

Then to have the rover available in later missions. Etc. I had forgotten
that when the TV camera moved from stationary to the rover, it took
longer to get video from the moon, but man when it came in, it was
awesome! We had a relatively new color TV and it was just incredible to
see those live pictures on the moon! I know most people had tuned out
but as a kid I was a space nut. I just couldn't believe at the time
people were not watch this! At least CBS was carrying most of it, the
other networks not so much! Remember, no NASA TV in those days! Got to
watch Apollo 17 taking off from the moon as well! An incredible act of
remote camera operation given the delays involved. The series made that
clear enough!

Wow, you actually saw the moon missions live. You must be an old man.
Ugh, well... I remember during the Apollo XI mission, we were moving, a
2500 km trip. My dad was, as you say, a space nut. So we were always
searching for some place with a TV to see the next Apollo news special.
At the time, many hotels had a TV in their rooms but not all. So that
was a must when searching for a hotel room. My mother insisted that she
wanted a hotel without cockroaches, but for my dad the important point
was that it needed to have a TV. Of course if the next Apollo news
special was at 17h00, we would start to search for a hotel at about
13h00, just in case it would be hard to find a hotel with TVs in that
part of the country. And the next morning we couldn't leave the hotel
before seeing the next news update. A 2500 km road trip is long, a 2500
km road trip with a space nut during Apollo XI takes longer than the
Apollo mission. The second half of the trip went much faster.


Alain Fournier

On 2020-06-19 7:46 PM, Alain Fournier wrote:
Wow, you actually saw the moon missions live. You must be an old man.

Not to mention witnessing, in person, the launch of Columbia on STS-1.

Dave

In article , says...

On 2020-06-19 7:46 PM, Alain Fournier wrote:
Wow, you actually saw the moon missions live. You must be an old man.

Not to mention witnessing, in person, the launch of Columbia on STS-1.

I'm 51, so don't remember Apollo at all. But I do remember STS-1 and
beyond. STS-1 was ground breaking for its time. Unfortunately, the
press never picked up on the many things that went wrong with STS-1
besides perhaps the obvious missing silica tiles that fall off. Even
NASA still isn't terribly forthcoming about all of the issues. Cite:

https://www.nasa.gov/centers/dryden/...lls_sts-1.html

No mention of the body flap (that was almost a very bad day) or the
flight control system issues. Here is a cite for the body flap issue:

First Time Lucky: The Space Shuttle?s Dicey Inaugural Mission
BY TERRY DUNN ON JAN. 16, 2018 AT 8 A.M.
The story of STS-1.
https://tinyurl.com/ybvsthrh

Cite for the flight control system issue (Mary Shafer used to be a
regular poster here):

Extraction of stability and control derivatives from orbiter flight data
Author and Affiliation:
Iliff, Kenneth W. (NASA Hugh L. Dryden Flight Research Facility,
Edwards, CA, United States)
Shafer, Mary F. (NASA Hugh L. Dryden Flight Research Facility,
Edwards, CA, United States)
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=19940006252
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/c...9940006252.pdf

Jeff
--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.

On 6/21/2020 12:09 PM, Jeff Findley wrote:
In article , says...

On 2020-06-19 7:46 PM, Alain Fournier wrote:
Wow, you actually saw the moon missions live. You must be an old man.

Not to mention witnessing, in person, the launch of Columbia on STS-1.

I'm 51, so don't remember Apollo at all. But I do remember STS-1 and
beyond. STS-1 was ground breaking for its time.

When I was in high school our family went to Orlando / Disney World /
Kennedy Space Center for a Christmas holiday one year. It was after
Apollo 17 but before Skylab. There was a bit of a lull at the Cape and
during that time, visitors to KSC got a tour inside the VAB. Something
they stopped doing once shuttle got going because of stacking SRB
segments inside. So that was amazing. The vertical height of the
building and the Florida humidity would combine to cause misting and
even a very light drizzle INSIDE the VAB I remember being told as cooler
air inside condensed water in the warmer air brought in from the
outside. An amazing experience.

Dave

Jeff,

Thanks for the links. Should make for very good reading!

Dave