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Bacteria in spaeships



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 23rd 18, 11:51 PM posted to sci.space.policy
jacob navia
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Posts: 341
Default Bacteria in spaeships

NASA got a bad day some weeks ago.

A microbiologist discovered that Acetinobacter can eat the desinfectant
that NASA sprays in their clean rooms...

A soil bacteria.

Now, NASA is selecting the hardest microbes to send to space... All
other normal microbes are dead, and Actetinobacter has no competition.

Arrived to destination (say Mars) Acetinobacter could be devasting for a
local biota. Since it is extremely resistant, it could spread unchecked.

Is it a good idea to desinfect spaceships?

Or it would be better to have as much as possible of weak, normal
bacteria that are surely dead if confronted to space?

Or coat the spaceships with very fragile bacteria that would prevent
Acetinobacter to thrive and would be immediately dead in space?

What is important is that in space no earth bacteria survive unchecked.
  #2  
Old June 24th 18, 03:41 PM posted to sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_6_]
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Posts: 2,307
Default Bacteria in spaeships

In article ,
says...

NASA got a bad day some weeks ago.

A microbiologist discovered that Acetinobacter can eat the desinfectant
that NASA sprays in their clean rooms...

A soil bacteria.

Now, NASA is selecting the hardest microbes to send to space... All
other normal microbes are dead, and Actetinobacter has no competition.

Arrived to destination (say Mars) Acetinobacter could be devasting for a
local biota. Since it is extremely resistant, it could spread unchecked.


There is zero proof that Mars has actual living "local biota".
Furthermore, I am unaware of any earth microbes which would "thrive" in
the extremely thin atmosphere and radiation environment of Mars.

Is it a good idea to desinfect spaceships?


If you want the crew on the inside to stay healthy, yes. Otherwise it's
like locking them inside a dank basement for the duration of the trip
and hoping they don't get sick.

Or it would be better to have as much as possible of weak, normal
bacteria that are surely dead if confronted to space?

Or coat the spaceships with very fragile bacteria that would prevent
Acetinobacter to thrive and would be immediately dead in space?

What is important is that in space no earth bacteria survive unchecked.


Inside ISS, where they try to combat microbes for the health of the
crew, is not the same as outside ISS in vacuum. Inside the spacecraft
is also not the same as outside in the very thin atmosphere of Mars.

Jeff
--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.
  #3  
Old June 24th 18, 10:36 PM posted to sci.space.policy
jacob navia
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 341
Default Bacteria in spaeships

Le 24/06/2018 Ã* 16:41, Jeff Findley a écritÂ*:
In article ,
says...

NASA got a bad day some weeks ago.

A microbiologist discovered that Acetinobacter can eat the desinfectant
that NASA sprays in their clean rooms...

A soil bacteria.

Now, NASA is selecting the hardest microbes to send to space... All
other normal microbes are dead, and Actetinobacter has no competition.

Arrived to destination (say Mars) Acetinobacter could be devasting for a
local biota. Since it is extremely resistant, it could spread unchecked.


There is zero proof that Mars has actual living "local biota".


What?

NASA has disclosed the presence of organics in Mars. Furthermore the
methane cycle has seasonal variations and points to local biota that is
breathing.

Apparently, mars organics ad life look similar to earth's life. A
microbiologist published comparisons between fossil looking formations
in Mars and earthly, older microbial formations that look VERY similar
to those mars "rocks"...

All this evidence points to life in Mars.


Furthermore, I am unaware of any earth microbes which would "thrive" in
the extremely thin atmosphere and radiation environment of Mars.


NASA selects those bacteria by killing all others and leaving them a
space where they find no competition for nutrients and space. All other
bacteria are dead.

Is it a good idea to desinfect spaceships?


If you want the crew on the inside to stay healthy, yes.


There is zero proof that a Mars-able ship is doable with today's
technology. No prototypes have been ever constructed, and Americans
aren't able to return to the moon any more.

They speak a lot about Mars, and send regularly machines to that planet.

Otherwise it's
like locking them inside a dank basement for the duration of the trip
and hoping they don't get sick.


There is the radiation problem. No atmosphere and no planetary magnetic
field leave the crew unshielded in space, that is full of harmful
radiation. The crew is in a suicide mission with today's technology.

Or it would be better to have as much as possible of weak, normal
bacteria that are surely dead if confronted to space?

Or coat the spaceships with very fragile bacteria that would prevent
Acetinobacter to thrive and would be immediately dead in space?

What is important is that in space no earth bacteria survive unchecked.


Inside ISS, where they try to combat microbes for the health of the
crew, is not the same as outside ISS in vacuum. Inside the spacecraft
is also not the same as outside in the very thin atmosphere of Mars.


Of course. I am speaking of unmanned machines, since, as I said above,
no humans have ever attempted to cross that void.

Of course I was trying to discuss from a scientific point of view, and I
know science is not well seen in some american circles, in a country
without a science advisor since more than a year.


Jeff



  #4  
Old June 25th 18, 12:03 AM posted to sci.space.policy
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,018
Default Bacteria in spaeships

jacob navia wrote on Sun, 24 Jun 2018
23:36:22 +0200:

Le 24/06/2018 à 16:41, Jeff Findley a écrit*:
In article ,
says...

NASA got a bad day some weeks ago.

A microbiologist discovered that Acetinobacter can eat the desinfectant
that NASA sprays in their clean rooms...

A soil bacteria.

Now, NASA is selecting the hardest microbes to send to space... All
other normal microbes are dead, and Actetinobacter has no competition.

Arrived to destination (say Mars) Acetinobacter could be devasting for a
local biota. Since it is extremely resistant, it could spread unchecked.


There is zero proof that Mars has actual living "local biota".


What?


What he said. Go read it again.


NASA has disclosed the presence of organics in Mars.


Which PROVES nothing.


Furthermore the
methane cycle has seasonal variations and points to local biota that is
breathing.


Well, no.


Apparently, mars organics ad life look similar to earth's life. A
microbiologist published comparisons between fossil looking formations
in Mars and earthly, older microbial formations that look VERY similar
to those mars "rocks"...


Another 'no'.


All this evidence points to life in Mars.


COULD point to life. Which part of the word "proof" is it that is
eluding you?


Furthermore, I am unaware of any earth microbes which would "thrive" in
the extremely thin atmosphere and radiation environment of Mars.


NASA selects those bacteria by killing all others and leaving them a
space where they find no competition for nutrients and space. All other
bacteria are dead.


So your argument is that we need to protect a biota that doesn't exist
(because if it did there wouldn't be "no competition")?

Is it a good idea to desinfect spaceships?


If you want the crew on the inside to stay healthy, yes.


There is zero proof that a Mars-able ship is doable with today's
technology. No prototypes have been ever constructed, and Americans
aren't able to return to the moon any more.


But there is better evidence for that than there is for life on Mars.


They speak a lot about Mars, and send regularly machines to that planet.


Yes, they do. If men aren't going, let's stop wasting that money.

Otherwise it's
like locking them inside a dank basement for the duration of the trip
and hoping they don't get sick.


There is the radiation problem. No atmosphere and no planetary magnetic
field leave the crew unshielded in space, that is full of harmful
radiation. The crew is in a suicide mission with today's technology.


False.

Or it would be better to have as much as possible of weak, normal
bacteria that are surely dead if confronted to space?

Or coat the spaceships with very fragile bacteria that would prevent
Acetinobacter to thrive and would be immediately dead in space?

What is important is that in space no earth bacteria survive unchecked.


Inside ISS, where they try to combat microbes for the health of the
crew, is not the same as outside ISS in vacuum. Inside the spacecraft
is also not the same as outside in the very thin atmosphere of Mars.


Of course. I am speaking of unmanned machines, since, as I said above,
no humans have ever attempted to cross that void.


Then you need to learn to formulate your ideas more clearly.


Of course I was trying to discuss from a scientific point of view, and I
know science is not well seen in some american circles, in a country
without a science advisor since more than a year.


Gee, **** you very much, too. You might want to look to where all the
Nobel prizes go, Mr Scientist.


--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
-- Thomas Jefferson
  #5  
Old June 25th 18, 12:23 PM posted to sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_6_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,307
Default Bacteria in spaeships

In article ,
says...

Le 24/06/2018 à 16:41, Jeff Findley a écrit*:
In article ,

says...

NASA got a bad day some weeks ago.

A microbiologist discovered that Acetinobacter can eat the desinfectant
that NASA sprays in their clean rooms...

A soil bacteria.

Now, NASA is selecting the hardest microbes to send to space... All
other normal microbes are dead, and Actetinobacter has no competition.

Arrived to destination (say Mars) Acetinobacter could be devasting for a
local biota. Since it is extremely resistant, it could spread unchecked.


There is zero proof that Mars has actual living "local biota".


What?

NASA has disclosed the presence of organics in Mars. Furthermore the
methane cycle has seasonal variations and points to local biota that is
breathing.


None of this is conclusive evidence. So called "organic" molecules can
be, and are, formed by processes not involving life.

Apparently, mars organics ad life look similar to earth's life. A
microbiologist published comparisons between fossil looking formations
in Mars and earthly, older microbial formations that look VERY similar
to those mars "rocks"...

All this evidence points to life in Mars.


Not at all conclusively. And even if we accept that these are fossils
from millions of years ago (again, there isn't conclusive evidence of
this), that does *not* mean that life still exists on Mars in its
current state of an atmosphere that's nearly vacuum.

Furthermore, I am unaware of any earth microbes which would

"thrive" in
the extremely thin atmosphere and radiation environment of Mars.


NASA selects those bacteria by killing all others and leaving them a
space where they find no competition for nutrients and space. All other
bacteria are dead.

Is it a good idea to desinfect spaceships?


If you want the crew on the inside to stay healthy, yes.


There is zero proof that a Mars-able ship is doable with today's
technology. No prototypes have been ever constructed, and Americans
aren't able to return to the moon any more.


Bull****. Crewed Mars ships are quite possible. There is no bit of
technology we don't have to land a crew on Mars. It's just that we have
not built one yet due to the high cost and the unwillingness of
politicians to pay for the program. I can't blame them considering
NASA's string of financial and/or programmatic failures post-Apollo.

Hopefully SpaceX will change that in the next 10 years or so because
NASA sure as heck isn't going to be able to afford it with SLS/Orion
sucking up several billions of dollars each and every year with nothing
to show for it so far.

Jeff
--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.
  #6  
Old June 26th 18, 06:26 AM posted to sci.space.policy
William Elliot[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 86
Default Bacteria in spaeships

What are we going to do about preventing Earth bacteria
from contamenating Mars biota when we set foot on Mars?

A microbiologist discovered that Acetinobacter can eat the
desinfectant that NASA sprays in their clean rooms...

A soil bacteria.

Now, NASA is selecting the hardest microbes to send to space... All
other normal microbes are dead, and Actetinobacter has no competition.

Arrived to destination (say Mars) Acetinobacter could be devasting for
a local biota. Since it is extremely resistant, it could spread
unchecked.

Is it a good idea to desinfect spaceships?

Or it would be better to have as much as possible of weak, normal
bacteria that are surely dead if confronted to space?

Or coat the spaceships with very fragile bacteria that would prevent
Acetinobacter to thrive and would be immediately dead in space?

What is important is that in space no earth bacteria survive
unchecked.

  #7  
Old June 26th 18, 08:37 AM posted to sci.space.policy
jacob navia
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 341
Default Bacteria in spaeships

Le 26/06/2018 Ã* 07:26, William Elliot a écritÂ*:
What are we going to do about preventing Earth bacteria
from contamenating Mars biota when we set foot on Mars?


There is NO WAY to desinfect a human. A human body is a full ecosystem
with fungi, bacteria, viruses, and many organisms that live in it using
the rests of skin, and secretions to feed themselves.

This means that if we send humans we contaminate the planet where we
send them. That is why I am against any Mars colonization until it is
100% sure that no organisms live there.

Much worst is the fact that humans RETURN to earth, contrary to machines
that stay there. If any marsian bugs exist, they could hitch a ride from
Mars to Earth with uncalculable consequences. Contamination, of course,
goes both ways!

  #8  
Old June 26th 18, 11:52 AM posted to sci.space.policy
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,018
Default Bacteria in spaeships

William Elliot wrote on Mon, 25 Jun 2018 22:26:12
-0700:


What are we going to do about preventing Earth bacteria
from contamenating Mars biota when we set foot on Mars?


What 'Mars biota'? Do you seriously believe that bacteria evolved for
Earth conditions are going to out-compete stuff that evolved for the
conditions that exist on Mars?


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn
  #10  
Old June 27th 18, 05:44 AM posted to sci.space.policy
William Elliot[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 86
Default Bacteria in spaeships

On Tue, 26 Jun 2018, Jeff Findley wrote:
What are we going to do about preventing Earth bacteria
from contamenating Mars biota when we set foot on Mars?


You're assuming that there is an actual living Mars biota. This has
not been proven. There are signs that Mars may have had life in the
distant past, but we do not have any definitive evidence that proves
life exists on Mars today.


Isn't my assumption. It's NASA's.
 




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