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So will they ever be able to get the old unit back to see what went wrong? I
don't see any obvious way to do it unless they want to take it apart on orbit or something. Brian -- From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active |
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JF Mezei wrote on 12/27/2013 :
On 13-12-27 16:30, Brian Gaff wrote: So will they ever be able to get the old unit back to see what went wrong? I don't see any obvious way to do it unless they want to take it apart on orbit or something. I doubt very much they would allow anything that had ammonia in it to go indoors and travel with a soyuz down. Perhaps if they could have put the unit into a sealed plastic bag, they may have been able to bring it in the airlock and then put it into a sealed briefcase before re-pressurizing the airlock. That might have provided sufficient protection against any ammonia leaking into cabin atmosphere. Does Dragon offer any downmass already ? when is the next dragon ? NET Feb 22, 2014 according to NASA.gov The spacesuit that malfunctioned in July was supposed to be down mass on that flight. That may still be planned, even though it worked well this time around. I imagine that the ground folk are making sure there's space for the pump in the down manifest. That's one of the reasons it was put in storage, I believe. (External storage, that is.) The pressurized portion of Dragon will be filled with science racks. I think the pump would be too big for the Soyuz return capsule even if it hadn't been filled with ammonia; downmass on that vehicle is rather limited due to the cramped space, IIRC. No science racks on that ride; I don't know how many "shoeboxes" of samples they can return. /dps -- I have always been glad we weren't killed that night. I do not know any particular reason, but I have always been glad. _Roughing It_, Mark Twain |
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Remember when Snidely bragged outrageously? That was Friday:
JF Mezei wrote on 12/27/2013 : On 13-12-27 16:30, Brian Gaff wrote: So will they ever be able to get the old unit back to see what went wrong? I don't see any obvious way to do it unless they want to take it apart on orbit or something. I doubt very much they would allow anything that had ammonia in it to go indoors and travel with a soyuz down. Perhaps if they could have put the unit into a sealed plastic bag, they may have been able to bring it in the airlock and then put it into a sealed briefcase before re-pressurizing the airlock. That might have provided sufficient protection against any ammonia leaking into cabin atmosphere. Does Dragon offer any downmass already ? when is the next dragon ? NET Feb 22, 2014 according to NASA.gov The spacesuit that malfunctioned in July was supposed to be down mass on that flight. That may still be planned, even though it worked well this time around. I imagine that the ground folk are making sure there's space for the pump in the down manifest. That's one of the reasons it was put in storage, I believe. (External storage, that is.) The pressurized portion of Dragon will be filled with science racks. I think the pump would be too big for the Soyuz return capsule even if it hadn't been filled with ammonia; downmass on that vehicle is rather limited due to the cramped space, IIRC. No science racks on that ride; I don't know how many "shoeboxes" of samples they can return. 2 stations flights before that: OSC's Antares (slipped from Dec 11 due to the pump problem), and Progress 54. In between is the TDRS-L launch on YANA5. /dps -- The presence of this syntax results from the fact that SQLite is really a Tcl extension that has escaped into the wild. http://www.sqlite.org/lang_expr.html |
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So how will they get it into a Dragon? Being a pressurised unit it would
mean bringing the pump in. I'm not sure it would actually fit through the door, it certainly won't on a Progress, but I suppose if you could open an unpressurised Dragon and then seal it and pressurise it, but it seems rather dangerous to me, its big and heavy and not really what you would want banging about inside a spacecraft at re entry. Looks like a candidate for a test of an inflatable re entry system to me! Brian -- From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active "Snidely" wrote in message news:mn.dc517ddcda32b4e2.127094@snitoo... JF Mezei wrote on 12/27/2013 : On 13-12-27 16:30, Brian Gaff wrote: So will they ever be able to get the old unit back to see what went wrong? I don't see any obvious way to do it unless they want to take it apart on orbit or something. I doubt very much they would allow anything that had ammonia in it to go indoors and travel with a soyuz down. Perhaps if they could have put the unit into a sealed plastic bag, they may have been able to bring it in the airlock and then put it into a sealed briefcase before re-pressurizing the airlock. That might have provided sufficient protection against any ammonia leaking into cabin atmosphere. Does Dragon offer any downmass already ? when is the next dragon ? NET Feb 22, 2014 according to NASA.gov The spacesuit that malfunctioned in July was supposed to be down mass on that flight. That may still be planned, even though it worked well this time around. I imagine that the ground folk are making sure there's space for the pump in the down manifest. That's one of the reasons it was put in storage, I believe. (External storage, that is.) The pressurized portion of Dragon will be filled with science racks. I think the pump would be too big for the Soyuz return capsule even if it hadn't been filled with ammonia; downmass on that vehicle is rather limited due to the cramped space, IIRC. No science racks on that ride; I don't know how many "shoeboxes" of samples they can return. /dps -- I have always been glad we weren't killed that night. I do not know any particular reason, but I have always been glad. _Roughing It_, Mark Twain |
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Brian Gaff presented the following explanation :
So how will they get it into a Dragon? Being a pressurised unit it would mean bringing the pump in. I'm not sure it would actually fit through the door, it certainly won't on a Progress, but I suppose if you could open an unpressurised Dragon and then seal it and pressurise it, but it seems rather dangerous to me, its big and heavy and not really what you would want banging about inside a spacecraft at re entry. Looks like a candidate for a test of an inflatable re entry system to me! Dragon has an unpressurized section. /dps -- Maybe C282Y is simply one of the hangers-on, a groupie following a future guitar god of the human genome: an allele with undiscovered virtuosity, currently soloing in obscurity in Mom's garage. Bradley Wertheim, theAtlantic.com, Jan 10 2013 |
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After serious thinking Brian Gaff wrote :
Yes, but can it be secured within it? I'm going to say "yes", even if that changes what pallets are setnt aloft. Remember the cargo in that section has to be secured for launch, too. /dps -- Ieri, oggi, domani |
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on 12/28/2013, JF Mezei supposed :
On 13-12-28 04:43, Snidely wrote: Dragon has an unpressurized section. Doubt very much Dragon's unpressurised section comes back to earth (and if it does, would likely expose the downmass to melting temperatures. Just how big is the actual failed component in the pump assembly ? Wouldn't have thought that a pump or valve would have been that big. Look at the pictures of the astronauts moving it around. The long dimension seems to be about 6-8 feet, the other 2 dimensions 4-6 feet. I think I've seen 750 kg for the mass. I'm sure you can find actual size on the NASA web site. There may even be a cutaway drawing in some obscure PDF. /dps -- I have always been glad we weren't killed that night. I do not know any particular reason, but I have always been glad. _Roughing It_, Mark Twain |
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On 12/29/2013 1:32 AM, JF Mezei wrote:
On 13-12-28 04:43, Snidely wrote: Dragon has an unpressurized section. Doubt very much Dragon's unpressurised section comes back to earth (and if it does, would likely expose the downmass to melting temperatures. Yeah I agree with that. http://www.spacex.com/dragon The "unpressurized" section, aka the trunk, is jettisoned shortly before atmospheric re-entry. No return path here.... Just how big is the actual failed component in the pump assembly ? Wouldn't have thought that a pump or valve would have been that big. If they even have the ability to further disassemble it. Well in theory its possible with enough force to disassemble almost anything, :-) but I think we are up against practical limits here. Dave |
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Snidely noted that:
I imagine that the ground folk are making sure there's space for the pump in the down manifest. That's one of the reasons it was put in storage, I believe. (External storage, that is.) Seems I misread or misguessed on that. Froma NASA Spaceflight News: quote Leaving the failed PM on the POA long-term is not desired since engineers believe the failed PM could be re-used in the future, since only one small component inside it (the FCV – Flow Control Valve) is failed, and thus an external FCV could be fabricated in the future, and connected to the PM in order to return it to service. /quote [url=http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2013/12/astronauts-new-pump-module-iss-eva25/] /dps -- Maybe C282Y is simply one of the hangers-on, a groupie following a future guitar god of the human genome: an allele with undiscovered virtuosity, currently soloing in obscurity in Mom's garage. Bradley Wertheim, theAtlantic.com, Jan 10 2013 |
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