Rebut vs. refute

Looking at the Beagle 2 web site I was amused to see that Colin
Pillinger "refutes" the suggestion that the Beagle 2 project management
were to blame for the loss of Beagle 2. He means "rebut".
--
What have they got to hide? Release the full Beagle 2 report.
Remove spam and invalid from address to reply.

"Jonathan Silverlight" wrote
in message ...
Looking at the Beagle 2 web site I was amused to see that Colin
Pillinger "refutes" the suggestion that the Beagle 2 project management
were to blame for the loss of Beagle 2. He means "rebut".

Since we're in pedant mode "Beagle 2 project management" is a singular
item hence it should have been "Beagle 2 project management _was_ to blame .
.. . /pedant mode

But nobody likes a pedant.

--
What have they got to hide? Release the full Beagle 2 report.
Remove spam and invalid from address to reply.

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Actually, I was going to respond anyway regarding your sig.

I read somewhere that two of the partners are sueing each other and the
report includes commercially and legally sensitive information.
Hence the failure to release the full report.

You may not believe that that is the genuine reason for the suppression, but
there you go.

Owen

"Jonathan Silverlight" wrote
in message ...
Looking at the Beagle 2 web site I was amused to see that Colin
Pillinger "refutes" the suggestion that the Beagle 2 project management
were to blame for the loss of Beagle 2. He means "rebut".

Refute - To disprove and overthrow by argument, evidence, or countervailing
proof; to prove to be false or erroneous; to confute; as, to refute
arguments; to refute testimony; to refute opinions or theories; to refute a
disputant.

Rebut - To refute, especially by offering opposing evidence or arguments, as
in a legal case.

As far as I can see they are synonyms.

Marcus

In message , OG
writes

"Jonathan Silverlight" wrote
in message ...

--
What have they got to hide? Release the full Beagle 2 report.
Remove spam and invalid from address to reply.

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Actually, I was going to respond anyway regarding your sig.

I read somewhere that two of the partners are sueing each other and the
report includes commercially and legally sensitive information.
Hence the failure to release the full report.

Well, according to New Scientist they aren't even releasing the names of
all the authors. As they are all independent there are doubtless
legitimate reasons for not doing so, as you note.

In message , Marcus Fox
writes

"Jonathan Silverlight" wrote
in message ...
Looking at the Beagle 2 web site I was amused to see that Colin
Pillinger "refutes" the suggestion that the Beagle 2 project management
were to blame for the loss of Beagle 2. He means "rebut".

Refute - To disprove and overthrow by argument, evidence, or countervailing
proof; to prove to be false or erroneous; to confute; as, to refute
arguments; to refute testimony; to refute opinions or theories; to refute a
disputant.

Rebut - To refute, especially by offering opposing evidence or arguments, as
in a legal case.

As far as I can see they are synonyms.

Trust a legal definition to confuse things.

According to the Oxford English Dictionary refute is "sometimes used
erroneously to mean 'deny, repudiate'.
Complete Plain Words says "should be confined to the sense of proving
falsity or error".
The Oxford Guide to English Language says "does not mean 'deny' or
'repudiate'.
Fowler's Modern English Usage notes that you can deny, but you can't
refute until you have proof.
I'm aware that Webster's Dictionary of Synonyms disagrees and says they
_are_ synonyms, but I think they are wrong here.

I rest my case, M'lud :-)

"Marcus Fox" wrote in
message ...

Refute - To disprove and overthrow by argument, evidence, or
countervailing
proof; to prove to be false or erroneous; to confute; as, to refute
arguments; to refute testimony; to refute opinions or theories; to refute
a
disputant.

Rebut - To refute, especially by offering opposing evidence or arguments,
as
in a legal case.

As far as I can see they are synonyms.


Afaics
To 'rebut' is to _attempt_ to 'refute'. If you fail, you have still
rebutted, but you haven't refuted.

"OG" wrote:
"Marcus Fox" wrote in
message ...

Refute - To disprove and overthrow by argument, evidence, or
countervailing
proof; to prove to be false or erroneous; to confute; as, to refute
arguments; to refute testimony; to refute opinions or theories; to refute
a
disputant.

Rebut - To refute, especially by offering opposing evidence or arguments,
as
in a legal case.

As far as I can see they are synonyms.

Afaics
To 'rebut' is to _attempt_ to 'refute'. If you fail, you have still
rebutted, but you haven't refuted.

That's my understanding too.

A quick search for "refute rebut" found lots of English usage sites
which agree that the distinction is in the success of the
counter-argument. I'll not give a single reference, go check some out
for yourselves:

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=rebut+refute

Dictionaries are often a poor way to resolve English usage questions
as they provide multiple definitions. Sometimes rebut and refute are
synonymous (and a dictionary would tell you that), but sometimes they
aren't (which a dictionary doesn't make clear). A good English usage
reference (or 5 - it's not exactly a science) is the right tool for
this job.


Tim

p.s. I can't decide whether it should be: "English usage", "English
Usage", "English-usage"... ;-)
--
Love is a travelator.

Tim Auton tim.auton@uton.[groupSexWithoutTheY] wrote:
[snip]
A quick search for "refute rebut" found lots of English usage sites
which agree that the distinction is in the success of the
counter-argument. I'll not give a single reference, go check some out
for yourselves:

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=rebut+refute

Dictionaries are often a poor way to resolve English usage questions
as they provide multiple definitions. Sometimes rebut and refute are
synonymous (and a dictionary would tell you that)

Poor choice of words. They aren't synonymous, but sometimes a rebuttal
can be a refutal and vice-versa. There must be a word for that... ;-)


Tim
--
Love is a travelator.

Jonathan Silverlight
wrote:

I rest my case, M'lud :-)

Justice Cocklecarrot (for it is he): I refute it thus.

Aims savage kick up the rebut

--
Martin Frey
http://www.hadastro.org.uk
N 51 02 E 0 47

In message , Tim Auton
tim.auton@uton.[groupSexWithoutTheY] writes

--
Love is a travelator.

Just to take this thread even further off topic, what's your sig about?
:-)
Google only returns hits for your posts, in an amazing variety of
places.