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Reusable Laser Launcher



 
 
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  #11  
Old May 18th 17, 03:15 AM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.space.policy,sci.optics,sci.physics,sci.military.naval
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,422
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

"Robert Clark" wrote:


"Robert Clark" wrote in message news
The Navy has already tested ship-borne lasers at 30 kW power to shoot down
drones:


Well, no. They have tested shipborne laser (not lasers) at a power
level that will never be actually deployed because it's far too small.

snip


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn
Ads
  #12  
Old May 18th 17, 02:13 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.space.policy,sci.optics,sci.physics,sci.military.naval
Robert Clark[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 237
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
...
================================================== =====
"Robert Clark" wrote:


"Robert Clark" wrote in message news
The Navy has already tested ship-borne lasers at 30 kW power to shoot down
drones:


Well, no. They have tested shipborne laser (not lasers) at a power
level that will never be actually deployed because it's far too small.

snip

================================================== =====

The U.S. Navy is testing a 30 kilowatt laser on the USS Ponce that can take
out small boats and small drones. The plan is to install a more powerful 150
kW laser that can take out larger ships and aircraft:

Military
The Navy Is Going To Test A Big Laser Soon.
150 KILOWATTS OF DIRECTED ENERGY, POINTED AT AN UNKNOWN DATE ON A CALENDAR.
By Kelsey D. Atherton June 24, 2016
http://www.popsci.com/navy-is-going-...big-laser-soon


Bob Clark

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Finally, nanotechnology can now fulfill its potential to revolutionize
21st-century technology, from the space elevator, to private, orbital
launchers, to 'flying cars'.
This crowdfunding campaign is to prove it:

Nanotech: from air to space.
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/n...ce/x/13319568/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  #13  
Old May 18th 17, 02:44 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.space.policy,sci.optics,sci.physics,sci.military.naval
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,422
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

"Robert Clark" wrote:

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
.. .
================================================= ======
"Robert Clark" wrote:


"Robert Clark" wrote in message news
The Navy has already tested ship-borne lasers at 30 kW power to shoot down
drones:


Well, no. They have tested shipborne laser (not lasers) at a power
level that will never be actually deployed because it's far too small.

snip

================================================= ======

The U.S. Navy is testing ...


That's "has tested", not "is testing".


... a 30 kilowatt laser ...


Like I said, A laser at power levels too low to be deployed.


... on the USS Ponce that can take out small boats and small drones.


Very small boats and drones.


The plan is to install a more powerful 150
kW laser that can take out larger ships and aircraft:


That's at least three years out. And any ship that gets one will need
at least half a megawatt of spare electrical capacity. That's quite a
stretch, given that big ships like the ARLEIGH BURKE class only have
7.5 MW total and there is already concern whether they can power
potential radar upgrades.


--
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable
man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore,
all progress depends on the unreasonable man."
--George Bernard Shaw
  #14  
Old May 18th 17, 03:19 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.space.policy,sci.optics,sci.physics,sci.military.naval
Robert Clark[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 237
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
news ==================================================

The U.S. Navy is testing ...

That's "has tested", not "is testing".

... a 30 kilowatt laser ...

Like I said, A laser at power levels too low to be deployed.

... on the USS Ponce that can take out small boats and small drones.

Very small boats and drones.

The plan is to install a more powerful 150
kW laser that can take out larger ships and aircraft:

That's at least three years out. And any ship that gets one will need
at least half a megawatt of spare electrical capacity. That's quite a
stretch, given that big ships like the ARLEIGH BURKE class only have
7.5 MW total and there is already concern whether they can power
potential radar upgrades.
--
================================================== =

The USS Ponce is currently deployed in the Persian Gulf and is authorized to
use its laser to repel attacks from small boats of the type that have been
used to mount terrorist attacks on U.S. ships.

I think you put the decimal point in the wrong place with "7.5 MW total".
The largest nuclear powered ships such as aircraft carriers can have up to
500 megawatt (thermal), 165 megawatt (electric), power plants, more than
enough extra capacity for a half megawatt laser system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...s#Power_plants

And the new Zumwalt-class destroyers will have ca. 75 megawatt power plants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zumwal...d_power_system

Bob Clark

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Finally, nanotechnology can now fulfill its potential to revolutionize
21st-century technology, from the space elevator, to private, orbital
launchers, to 'flying cars'.
This crowdfunding campaign is to prove it:

Nanotech: from air to space.
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/n...ce/x/13319568/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  #15  
Old May 18th 17, 05:10 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.space.policy,sci.optics,sci.physics,sci.military.naval
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,422
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

"Robert Clark" wrote:

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
news ================================================= =

The U.S. Navy is testing ...

That's "has tested", not "is testing".

... a 30 kilowatt laser ...

Like I said, A laser at power levels too low to be deployed.

... on the USS Ponce that can take out small boats and small drones.

Very small boats and drones.

The plan is to install a more powerful 150
kW laser that can take out larger ships and aircraft:

That's at least three years out. And any ship that gets one will need
at least half a megawatt of spare electrical capacity. That's quite a
stretch, given that big ships like the ARLEIGH BURKE class only have
7.5 MW total and there is already concern whether they can power
potential radar upgrades.
--
================================================= ==

The USS Ponce is currently deployed in the Persian Gulf and is authorized to
use its laser to repel attacks from small boats of the type that have been
used to mount terrorist attacks on U.S. ships.


In other words, the testing period is over. That laser isn't big
enough to take down boats that big. When they say 'small boats' they
mean something the size of a destroyer's motor whaleboat with an
exposed gascan.

Hint: USS Ponce is an amphibious ship.


I think you put the decimal point in the wrong place with "7.5 MW total".


Unfortunately for you, reality doesn't seem to much care what you
think. The number is correct for the destroyer class I cited, which
was the ARLEIGH BURKE class. The only ship smaller than an aircraft
carrier with any sort of spare electrical capability is the ZUMWALT
class (and that only because it uses electric propulsion and can swap
power around). The reason USS PONCE was used for the low power laser
testing is because it's an amphibious ship, which means it doesn't
have the sorts of electrically hungry combat systems that surface
combatant ships have.


The largest nuclear powered ships such as aircraft carriers can have up to
500 megawatt (thermal), 165 megawatt (electric), power plants, more than
enough extra capacity for a half megawatt laser system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...s#Power_plants


NIMITZ class and previous don't have any SPARE electrical capability.
The 200 MW the NIMITZ can produce is all being used by existing load.
That's why the FORD class has reactors that can move the ship and
still produce three times the electrical power of the NIMITZ class.


And the new Zumwalt-class destroyers will have ca. 75 megawatt power plants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zumwal...d_power_system


So let's count up the ships with sufficient spare electrical capacity
to start sticking weapon grade lasers on them. We have ONE ZUMWALT
class (and one more building, which is the end of the class). We have
NO FORD class carriers yet. One is undergoing trials, one is under
contruction, and another is planned for delivery out in the 2020's. So
by the mid-2020's we'll have a whopping FIVE ships with sufficient
spare electrical power to load a bunch of combat lasers on them. For
everyone else, you're going to have to turn off half a megawatt worth
of existing systems to get the power to run a laser.


--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
-- Thomas Jefferson
  #16  
Old May 21st 17, 01:18 AM posted to sci.space.policy
Bob Haller
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,197
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

On Thursday, May 18, 2017 at 12:10:09 PM UTC-4, Fred J. McCall wrote:
"Robert Clark" wrote:

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
news ================================================= =

The U.S. Navy is testing ...

That's "has tested", not "is testing".

... a 30 kilowatt laser ...

Like I said, A laser at power levels too low to be deployed.

... on the USS Ponce that can take out small boats and small drones.

Very small boats and drones.

The plan is to install a more powerful 150
kW laser that can take out larger ships and aircraft:

That's at least three years out. And any ship that gets one will need
at least half a megawatt of spare electrical capacity. That's quite a
stretch, given that big ships like the ARLEIGH BURKE class only have
7.5 MW total and there is already concern whether they can power
potential radar upgrades.
--
================================================= ==

The USS Ponce is currently deployed in the Persian Gulf and is authorized to
use its laser to repel attacks from small boats of the type that have been
used to mount terrorist attacks on U.S. ships.


In other words, the testing period is over. That laser isn't big
enough to take down boats that big. When they say 'small boats' they
mean something the size of a destroyer's motor whaleboat with an
exposed gascan.

Hint: USS Ponce is an amphibious ship.


I think you put the decimal point in the wrong place with "7.5 MW total".


Unfortunately for you, reality doesn't seem to much care what you
think. The number is correct for the destroyer class I cited, which
was the ARLEIGH BURKE class. The only ship smaller than an aircraft
carrier with any sort of spare electrical capability is the ZUMWALT
class (and that only because it uses electric propulsion and can swap
power around). The reason USS PONCE was used for the low power laser
testing is because it's an amphibious ship, which means it doesn't
have the sorts of electrically hungry combat systems that surface
combatant ships have.


The largest nuclear powered ships such as aircraft carriers can have up to
500 megawatt (thermal), 165 megawatt (electric), power plants, more than
enough extra capacity for a half megawatt laser system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...s#Power_plants


NIMITZ class and previous don't have any SPARE electrical capability.
The 200 MW the NIMITZ can produce is all being used by existing load.
That's why the FORD class has reactors that can move the ship and
still produce three times the electrical power of the NIMITZ class.


And the new Zumwalt-class destroyers will have ca. 75 megawatt power plants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zumwal...d_power_system


So let's count up the ships with sufficient spare electrical capacity
to start sticking weapon grade lasers on them. We have ONE ZUMWALT
class (and one more building, which is the end of the class). We have
NO FORD class carriers yet. One is undergoing trials, one is under
contruction, and another is planned for delivery out in the 2020's. So
by the mid-2020's we'll have a whopping FIVE ships with sufficient
spare electrical power to load a bunch of combat lasers on them. For
everyone else, you're going to have to turn off half a megawatt worth
of existing systems to get the power to run a laser.


--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
-- Thomas Jefferson


fred just take a chill pill for a moment.

for combat a laser weapon doesnt need continious power..

a pulse weapon, perhaps powered by banks of capacitors can do the job.

after all bang bang bang works for firearms
  #17  
Old May 21st 17, 02:34 AM posted to sci.space.policy
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,422
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

bob haller wrote:

On Thursday, May 18, 2017 at 12:10:09 PM UTC-4, Fred J. McCall wrote:
"Robert Clark" wrote:

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
news ================================================= =

The U.S. Navy is testing ...

That's "has tested", not "is testing".

... a 30 kilowatt laser ...

Like I said, A laser at power levels too low to be deployed.

... on the USS Ponce that can take out small boats and small drones.

Very small boats and drones.

The plan is to install a more powerful 150
kW laser that can take out larger ships and aircraft:

That's at least three years out. And any ship that gets one will need
at least half a megawatt of spare electrical capacity. That's quite a
stretch, given that big ships like the ARLEIGH BURKE class only have
7.5 MW total and there is already concern whether they can power
potential radar upgrades.
--
================================================= ==

The USS Ponce is currently deployed in the Persian Gulf and is authorized to
use its laser to repel attacks from small boats of the type that have been
used to mount terrorist attacks on U.S. ships.


In other words, the testing period is over. That laser isn't big
enough to take down boats that big. When they say 'small boats' they
mean something the size of a destroyer's motor whaleboat with an
exposed gascan.

Hint: USS Ponce is an amphibious ship.


I think you put the decimal point in the wrong place with "7.5 MW total".


Unfortunately for you, reality doesn't seem to much care what you
think. The number is correct for the destroyer class I cited, which
was the ARLEIGH BURKE class. The only ship smaller than an aircraft
carrier with any sort of spare electrical capability is the ZUMWALT
class (and that only because it uses electric propulsion and can swap
power around). The reason USS PONCE was used for the low power laser
testing is because it's an amphibious ship, which means it doesn't
have the sorts of electrically hungry combat systems that surface
combatant ships have.


The largest nuclear powered ships such as aircraft carriers can have up to
500 megawatt (thermal), 165 megawatt (electric), power plants, more than
enough extra capacity for a half megawatt laser system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...s#Power_plants


NIMITZ class and previous don't have any SPARE electrical capability.
The 200 MW the NIMITZ can produce is all being used by existing load.
That's why the FORD class has reactors that can move the ship and
still produce three times the electrical power of the NIMITZ class.


And the new Zumwalt-class destroyers will have ca. 75 megawatt power plants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zumwal...d_power_system


So let's count up the ships with sufficient spare electrical capacity
to start sticking weapon grade lasers on them. We have ONE ZUMWALT
class (and one more building, which is the end of the class). We have
NO FORD class carriers yet. One is undergoing trials, one is under
contruction, and another is planned for delivery out in the 2020's. So
by the mid-2020's we'll have a whopping FIVE ships with sufficient
spare electrical power to load a bunch of combat lasers on them. For
everyone else, you're going to have to turn off half a megawatt worth
of existing systems to get the power to run a laser.


fred just take a chill pill for a moment.


bobbert just take two valium and don't call me in the morning.


for combat a laser weapon doesnt need continious power..


But it does need continuously available power. Or do you just shut
down other combat systems like radars in 'pulses'?


a pulse weapon, perhaps powered by banks of capacitors can do the job.


Pulse it sufficiently infrequently and it doesn't do the job. It's
all about the total energy you can get onto the target, Bobbert. No
magic and you still have to charge those capacitor banks. And when
you need the laser right now, 'charging' is not what you want to see
on your status panel.


after all bang bang bang works for firearms


If it only shoots as infrequently as a gun, why not just stay with the
gun?


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn
  #18  
Old May 21st 17, 03:51 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.space.policy,sci.optics,sci.physics,sci.military.naval
Robert Clark[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 237
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
...
================================================== =========
....
So let's count up the ships with sufficient spare electrical capacity
to start sticking weapon grade lasers on them. We have ONE ZUMWALT
class (and one more building, which is the end of the class). We have
NO FORD class carriers yet. One is undergoing trials, one is under
contruction, and another is planned for delivery out in the 2020's. So
by the mid-2020's we'll have a whopping FIVE ships with sufficient
spare electrical power to load a bunch of combat lasers on them. For
everyone else, you're going to have to turn off half a megawatt worth
of existing systems to get the power to run a laser.
....
================================================== =========

This article discusses the problem of the power level requirements:

US Navy will fire 150 kilowatt laser on a test ship in 2018 and then from
carriers and destroyers in 2019.
brian wang | January 26, 2017 |
http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2017/01...-laser-on.html

It may very well be that only the very largest ships will be able to field
the high power 150 kW lasers.

Still, I wonder if you can instead just combine three of the truck-carried
60 kW laser systems the Army wants to field:

US Army gets world record-setting 60-kW laser.
By: Jen Judson, March 16, 2017 (Photo Credit: Courtesy of Lockheed Martin)
http://www.defensenews.com/articles/...ing-60kw-laser


Bob Clark



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Finally, nanotechnology can now fulfill its potential to revolutionize
21st-century technology, from the space elevator, to private, orbital
launchers, to 'flying cars'.
This crowdfunding campaign is to prove it:

Nanotech: from air to space.
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/n...ce/x/13319568/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  #19  
Old May 21st 17, 07:19 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.space.policy,sci.optics,sci.physics,sci.military.naval
Fred J. McCall[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,422
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

"Robert Clark" wrote:

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
.. .
================================================= ==========
...
So let's count up the ships with sufficient spare electrical capacity
to start sticking weapon grade lasers on them. We have ONE ZUMWALT
class (and one more building, which is the end of the class). We have
NO FORD class carriers yet. One is undergoing trials, one is under
contruction, and another is planned for delivery out in the 2020's. So
by the mid-2020's we'll have a whopping FIVE ships with sufficient
spare electrical power to load a bunch of combat lasers on them. For
everyone else, you're going to have to turn off half a megawatt worth
of existing systems to get the power to run a laser.
...
================================================= ==========

This article discusses the problem of the power level requirements:

US Navy will fire 150 kilowatt laser on a test ship in 2018 and then from
carriers and destroyers in 2019.
brian wang | January 26, 2017 |
http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2017/01...-laser-on.html

It may very well be that only the very largest ships will be able to field
the high power 150 kW lasers.

Still, I wonder if you can instead just combine three of the truck-carried
60 kW laser systems the Army wants to field:


That's essentially what's being done. They're combining two 75 kW
units that are technically very similar to the Army units. Combining
them is not a simple exercise, though, so you can't just stick several
of them on a ship and magically 'combine' them. And you still have to
power them.


US Army gets world record-setting 60-kW laser.
By: Jen Judson, March 16, 2017 (Photo Credit: Courtesy of Lockheed Martin)
http://www.defensenews.com/articles/...ing-60kw-laser


Note that they don't say how they're powering it or how many shots
it's good for before you need to 'recharge'. Given the cited power
levels and efficiency, you'd need around 150 kW to run it. You can
get that out of a dedicated generator, which will weigh around 4
tonnes plus fuel (which may explain why it's installed on a HEMTT and
not some other vehicle).


--
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable
man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore,
all progress depends on the unreasonable man."
--George Bernard Shaw
  #20  
Old June 1st 17, 01:28 AM posted to sci.space.policy
William Mook[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,840
Default Reusable Laser Launcher

Fred's a freaking liar who doesn't give one crap about the truth or reality.. Lasers are deployed as close in weapons systems on naval vessels today. Their use and size are being expanded. If you believe Fred, side arms aren't real weapons because they can't sink a destroyer! lol. Fact is, LASERS are one of many close in weapons system that are IN USE by the US Navy, and other armed forces.

www.dtic.mil/get-tr-doc/pdf?AD=ADA557757

On Sunday, May 21, 2017 at 1:34:45 PM UTC+12, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:

On Thursday, May 18, 2017 at 12:10:09 PM UTC-4, Fred J. McCall wrote:
"Robert Clark" wrote:

"Fred J. McCall" wrote in message
news ================================================= =

The U.S. Navy is testing ...

That's "has tested", not "is testing".

... a 30 kilowatt laser ...

Like I said, A laser at power levels too low to be deployed.

... on the USS Ponce that can take out small boats and small drones.

Very small boats and drones.

The plan is to install a more powerful 150
kW laser that can take out larger ships and aircraft:

That's at least three years out. And any ship that gets one will need
at least half a megawatt of spare electrical capacity. That's quite a
stretch, given that big ships like the ARLEIGH BURKE class only have
7.5 MW total and there is already concern whether they can power
potential radar upgrades.
--
================================================= ==

The USS Ponce is currently deployed in the Persian Gulf and is authorized to
use its laser to repel attacks from small boats of the type that have been
used to mount terrorist attacks on U.S. ships.


In other words, the testing period is over. That laser isn't big
enough to take down boats that big. When they say 'small boats' they
mean something the size of a destroyer's motor whaleboat with an
exposed gascan.

Hint: USS Ponce is an amphibious ship.


I think you put the decimal point in the wrong place with "7.5 MW total".


Unfortunately for you, reality doesn't seem to much care what you
think. The number is correct for the destroyer class I cited, which
was the ARLEIGH BURKE class. The only ship smaller than an aircraft
carrier with any sort of spare electrical capability is the ZUMWALT
class (and that only because it uses electric propulsion and can swap
power around). The reason USS PONCE was used for the low power laser
testing is because it's an amphibious ship, which means it doesn't
have the sorts of electrically hungry combat systems that surface
combatant ships have.


The largest nuclear powered ships such as aircraft carriers can have up to
500 megawatt (thermal), 165 megawatt (electric), power plants, more than
enough extra capacity for a half megawatt laser system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...s#Power_plants


NIMITZ class and previous don't have any SPARE electrical capability.
The 200 MW the NIMITZ can produce is all being used by existing load.
That's why the FORD class has reactors that can move the ship and
still produce three times the electrical power of the NIMITZ class.


And the new Zumwalt-class destroyers will have ca. 75 megawatt power plants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zumwal...d_power_system


So let's count up the ships with sufficient spare electrical capacity
to start sticking weapon grade lasers on them. We have ONE ZUMWALT
class (and one more building, which is the end of the class). We have
NO FORD class carriers yet. One is undergoing trials, one is under
contruction, and another is planned for delivery out in the 2020's. So
by the mid-2020's we'll have a whopping FIVE ships with sufficient
spare electrical power to load a bunch of combat lasers on them. For
everyone else, you're going to have to turn off half a megawatt worth
of existing systems to get the power to run a laser.


fred just take a chill pill for a moment.


bobbert just take two valium and don't call me in the morning.


for combat a laser weapon doesnt need continious power..


But it does need continuously available power. Or do you just shut
down other combat systems like radars in 'pulses'?


a pulse weapon, perhaps powered by banks of capacitors can do the job.


Pulse it sufficiently infrequently and it doesn't do the job. It's
all about the total energy you can get onto the target, Bobbert. No
magic and you still have to charge those capacitor banks. And when
you need the laser right now, 'charging' is not what you want to see
on your status panel.


after all bang bang bang works for firearms


If it only shoots as infrequently as a gun, why not just stay with the
gun?


--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn

 




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