Zubrin: Obama readies to blast NASA

On Oct 28, 5:31*pm, "Val Kraut" wrote:
"

More important, NASA officials have denied the rumours
started by Mr Zubrin:

Unfortunately this is the way most of my favorite Horror Movies start with
Government Officials denying that Giant Ants, Giant Spiders, or some other
monsters exist in the adjacent desert. As they're all laughing the subject
monsters destroy half the town. The NASA guys have to spout the party line
or be replaced by someone who will. You can't trust Washington!

* * * * * * * * * * Val Kraut

Can we at least trust those oligarchs and Rothschilds telling
Washington what they can or can not do?

"Hop" wrote in message
...
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...to-blast-nasa/

Sure hope Zubrin is wrong.


Perhaps we should review a few facts about
the universe;

1) The chances there aren't plenty of Earth like
planets out there is almost exactly nill, nada
or zero.

2) The chances we're alone in the universe is
almost exactly nill, nada or zero.

3) Our 'origins' are a Mona-Lisa like cloud of uncertainty
and happens to be the ONE-AND-ONLY place
objective science can't see, measure, equate
photograph, sniff or otherwise stick with a fork.

Now some facts of life;

1) The general public has accepted the above as facts
since about 1980. The last since about 19 AD.

2) Rockets to Nowhere are the least efficient jobs program
imaginable.

3) Space colonies only make sense if they can support
a few billion people.

4) The age of pure exploration is over, we've seen that
and been there. The age of space e x p l o i t a t i o n
needs to begin. Seeing how the world is in turmoil.

Now let's search the various NASA projects and see
if we can't find one that does make sense, given ALL of
the above facts.

Well, below is a project that could accomplish much of
the following;

Revolutionize the second largest market on Earth.
Produce thousands of high paying, high tech jobs.
Provide lots of payloads for civilian launchers.
Provide a primary solution to Climate Change.
Convert America into the world's largest energy...producer.
Bring opportunity and prosperity to billions in poverty.
End wars over oil.
Save the World.

The technology already exists, is simple and has
essentially no moving parts. And oh, this project will
Light-Up-The-Night-Sky with large, magnificent and
cash-generating engineering projects in space.

Anyone that can't sell this plan, can't sell!

SERT
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1

Space Energy Inc.
http://spaceenergy.com/


But maybe NASA should "just keep looking up" in it's
Faithful search for god knows what. And keep launching
their Gilded Safaris for the select and few, while the
world burns!

Why does this issue always give me mental images
of an oblivious Louis XVI happily playing tennis
right up until the mobs charge the net?

NASA needs to stop looking to the distant reaches for
little green men, and stop reconstructing the ancient past
looking for God. And start thinking about the future.
And how to make it ..better. How to keep the promise
of space.

The plan is already sitting on the shelf for Chrissakes.


Jonathan


s

On Oct 27, 12:25*pm, Hop wrote:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...eadies-to-blas...

Sure hope Zubrin is wrong.

It's looking as though our JWST is a dead horse that's currently worth
3.5+ billions and counting, with a 2018 launch plus another 5.2+
billions to go.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/nation...LKM_story.html

Why has it taken President BHO so long to shut this kind of
systematically dysfunctional NASA down?

http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”

On Oct 28, 9:56*pm, "Jonathan" wrote:
"Hop" wrote in message

...

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...eadies-to-blas...

Sure hope Zubrin is wrong.

Perhaps we should review a few facts about
the universe;

1) The chances there aren't plenty of Earth like
* * *planets out there is almost exactly nill, nada
* * *or zero.

2) The chances we're alone in the universe is
* * almost exactly nill, nada or zero.

3) Our 'origins' are a Mona-Lisa like cloud of *uncertainty
* * *and happens to be the ONE-AND-ONLY place
* * *objective science can't see, measure, equate
* * *photograph, sniff or otherwise stick with a fork.

Now some facts of life;

1) The general public has accepted the above as facts
* * *since about 1980. The last since about 19 AD.

2) *Rockets to Nowhere are the least efficient jobs program
* * *imaginable.

3) Space colonies only make sense if they can support
* * *a few billion people.

4) *The age of pure exploration is over, we've seen that
* * * *and been there. *The age of space e x p l o i t a t i o n
* * * *needs to begin. Seeing how the world is in turmoil.

Now let's search the various NASA projects and see
if we can't find one that does make sense, given ALL of
the above facts.

Well, below is a project that could accomplish much of
*the following;

Revolutionize the second largest market on Earth.
Produce thousands of high paying, high tech jobs.
Provide lots of payloads for civilian launchers.
Provide a primary solution to Climate Change.
Convert America into the world's largest energy...producer.
Bring opportunity and prosperity to billions in poverty.
End wars over oil.
Save the World.

The technology already exists, is simple and has
essentially no moving parts. And oh, this project will
Light-Up-The-Night-Sky with large, magnificent and
cash-generating engineering projects in space.

Anyone that can't sell this plan, can't sell!

SERThttp://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1

Space Energy Inc.http://spaceenergy.com/

But maybe NASA should "just keep looking up" in it's
Faithful search for god knows what. And keep launching
their Gilded Safaris for the select and few, while the
world burns!

Why does this issue always give me mental images
of an oblivious Louis XVI happily playing tennis
right up until the mobs charge the net?

NASA needs to stop looking to the distant reaches for
little green men, and stop reconstructing the ancient past
looking for God. And start thinking about the future.
And how to make it ..better. How to keep the promise
of space.

The plan is already sitting on the shelf for Chrissakes.

Jonathan

s

Expecting our mainstream status-quo (aka good old boys and those
having all the right stuff that always get to obfuscate their public
funded butts off) to use common sense, think and act on behalf of
others, is extremely optimistic of yourself.

I totally agree with exploitation of space, and especially of
exploiting whatever’s extremely nearby (at least to start off with).
Our new and improved DARPA/NASA has to give us options of significant
off-world advantages, such as those our moon and the extremely nearby
planet Venus can provide. DARPA, NASA and DoE must consolidate, and
start getting 50% of their all-inclusive funding from private sources.

The next gold-rush era of significant rewards and technical
advancements needs to happen now, starting with cleaner and cheaper
energy, along with a greatly improved national infrastructure. If
this takes Presidential executive orders, then so be it.

President BHO needs to start kicking public-funded butt and
terminating those either responsible for holding us back or incapable
of moving us forward. Corruption in government needs to be classified
as treason. Corruption against government or the republic needs to be
classified as treason.

Our Pentagon and DoD must deal with 10% cuts in funding per year, as
well as repeated for the next ten years. The number of government
agencies or public-funded groups needs to be cut in half, or better
(same goes for military, homeland and borders).

Of course I can support most of what you have proposed, plus I have
many other solutions and demands, that like all of the above will
never happen in our lifetimes, because for most of us it’s already
game over and the reason why 9/11 happened.

Yourself and others can pretend this mess is not faith-based nor cult/
cabal motivated by those we do not even elect.

http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”

"Brad Guth" wrote in message
...
On Oct 28, 9:56 pm, "Jonathan" wrote:


Why does this issue always give me mental images
of an oblivious Louis XVI happily playing tennis
right up until the mobs charge the net?

NASA needs to stop looking to the distant reaches for
little green men, and stop reconstructing the ancient past
looking for God. And start thinking about the future.
And how to make it ..better. How to keep the promise
of space.

The plan is already sitting on the shelf for Chrissakes.

Jonathan

s


Expecting our mainstream status-quo (aka good old boys and those
having all the right stuff that always get to obfuscate their public
funded butts off) to use common sense, think and act on behalf of
others, is extremely optimistic of yourself.


It makes me go mental! I'm not much for conspiracies, but
this issue makes me wonder if big money has been shooting
down the concept for ages. Certainty anyone from Texas
or big oil wouldn't want a new energy competitor. And big aero
has showed clearly they prefer a new assembly line of very
expensive one-shot 'Saturn V's' and lunar landers.

And if you think about why they'd want the Moon, there'd
only be the pressure of 'getting there'. They wouldn't have to
worry at all about producing a cost-effective or practical result.
Like the ISS, profit and other tangible accomplishments are
really just an aside. With Space Solar Power they'd have to
be held more to the standards of the private sector that requires
a certain pay-off by some date certain.

With the Moon, Mars and asteroids there's no such expectations.
It'd be like a military contract, whatever the over-runs are gets
paid by someone else. They make a profit no matter what.

SSP would force them back into the real world.


I totally agree with exploitation of space, and especially of
exploiting whatever's extremely nearby (at least to start off with).
Our new and improved DARPA/NASA has to give us options of significant
off-world advantages, such as those our moon and the extremely nearby
planet Venus can provide. DARPA, NASA and DoE must consolidate, and
start getting 50% of their all-inclusive funding from private sources.


It's starting to look like turning the shuttle replacement, the X-37b, over
to Darpa has been a good idea. No funding squabbles and they can and are
rushing the project as a national security issue. And another funny
thing, no one around here seems to accept the fact the X-37b IS
the shuttle replacement. In denial maybe?



The next gold-rush era of significant rewards and technical
advancements needs to happen now, starting with cleaner and cheaper
energy, along with a greatly improved national infrastructure. If
this takes Presidential executive orders, then so be it.


If is wasn't for the wars and great stock market crash, I think the
time for SSP would be quite ripe. NASA needs a new reason
for being, and technology advances, and oil price increases
has pushed SSP far closer to being cost effective. But what few
seem to accept is that SSP could travel places conventional
base load power could never reach. In particular the rural
third world areas that are still off the grid and Internet. Which
equates to being in the stone-age.

The ease of placing down a rectenna means on the receiving end
the costs are orders of magnitude cheaper than a conventional
power plant, and all the roads and railroads etc they need.
And since conventional power can't get there, SSP really wouldn't
have any competitors. They can charge what they need to.
For instance, would Japan post earthquake quibble over a
few cents per kw/h? Or the military in the field? Or if it was
the difference between half your crops spoiling...etc etc.

Not to mention energy is the second largest market of all.
It's a Gigantic marketplace! If you want to reinvigorate
all things NASA and space programs, connect it to
boatloads of cash. The first one to make a profit from
space energy is going to be the next Bill Gates, but of
the energy market. A market far larger than computers.

I want it to be America.

President BHO needs to start kicking public-funded butt and
terminating those either responsible for holding us back or incapable
of moving us forward. Corruption in government needs to be classified
as treason. Corruption against government or the republic needs to be
classified as treason.


The whole deregulation movement of the Bush era is coming
back to haunt us now with all the runaway corruption.
If the Wall Street protesters seem unfocused it's because the
effects of corruption have spread throughout. If you were
standing outside a movie theater where some anonymous
voice had just yelled fire, all you're gonna see is a disaster
once the dust the settled. Once someone has started a nasty
rumor about a teetering market, all the outsiders are going
to see is a sudden bankruptcy with no discernible 'smoking gun'
to blame.

Those protesters need to articulate their anger and position
much better, they have plenty of perfectly sound reasons
to protest.


Our Pentagon and DoD must deal with 10% cuts in funding per year, as
well as repeated for the next ten years. The number of government
agencies or public-funded groups needs to be cut in half, or better
(same goes for military, homeland and borders).


The big draw down can come after N. Korea, Iran and China
finally come around. Once the world is full of free market
democracies, the prospect of large wars will become a thing
of the past.


Of course I can support most of what you have proposed, plus I have
many other solutions and demands, that like all of the above will
never happen in our lifetimes, because for most of us it's already
game over and the reason why 9/11 happened.


The primary reason I settled on Space Solar Power is that
of all the pie-in-the-sky dreams from the moon, mars and
asteroids etc, all the great world-changing goal, Space Solar Power
is the ...only one... that can become a reality in our lifetimes.

I believe the 'equation' for Saving the World is to maximize
two quantities. How much the project can help the human
race, and how fast? And the icing on the cake would be
to also connect directly to the space program and NASA.

When you compare a colony on Mars for six people at the
end of a very long and expensive forty year project.
To a new, clean and inexhaustible energy source that can
start up in some five years from the check signing.
There's no contest at all.

I can't think of any other project that can do as much as
fast as Space Solar Power. Even if it wasn't limited
to the NASA and the space program, I still can't think
of a better solution to that equation given how far and
wide energy effects the planet.


Jonathan


a


http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / "Guth Usenet"

On 28/10/2011 6:25 AM, Hop wrote:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...to-blast-nasa/

Sure hope Zubrin is wrong.

Do they have a different April Fool's day in the US?

Early termination of a mission that is already in space?

I don't think so.

Sylvia.

On Oct 28, 6:53*am, jacob navia wrote:

Looking at the content of this newspaper it is obvious that this is a
republican only newspaper, geared to the campaign against Obama.

It's worse than that. Yes, the Washington Times is a very conservative
newspaper - which sometimes leads to some good articles about things
other papers miss, but which also leads to other articles that are not
so good - but its most famous attribute is its connection to South
Korea's Unification Church. As in Sun Myung Moon.

John Savard

On Oct 31, 3:31*pm, "Jonathan" wrote:

I can't think of any other project that can do as much as
fast as Space Solar Power. Even if it wasn't limited
to the NASA and the space program, I still can't think
of a better solution to that equation given how far and
wide energy effects the planet.

But to make space solar power practical, one would need L-5 colonies.
That requires an immense investment - not a bad thing, necessarily,
since the result would be to open up the whole Solar System, allowing
such things as a manned landing on Mars to be thrown in as inexpensive
extras.

But that means it's a visionary program - comparable to the quest for
fusion power. Our immediate energy needs can be addressed far more
simply: breeder reactors, and the Thorium breeder to increase our fuel
supply beyond the supply of Uranium. That will keep civilization going
long enough to do things like space solar power.

John Savard

On Nov 1, 9:36*am, Quadibloc wrote:
On Oct 31, 3:31*pm, "Jonathan" wrote:

I can't think of any other project that can do as much as
fast as Space Solar Power. Even if it wasn't limited
to the NASA and the space program, I still can't think
of a better solution to that equation given how far and
wide energy effects the planet.

But to make space solar power practical, one would need L-5 colonies.
That requires an immense investment - not a bad thing, necessarily,
since the result would be to open up the whole Solar System, allowing
such things as a manned landing on Mars to be thrown in as inexpensive
extras.

But that means it's a visionary program - comparable to the quest for
fusion power. Our immediate energy needs can be addressed far more
simply: breeder reactors, and the Thorium breeder to increase our fuel
supply beyond the supply of Uranium. That will keep civilization going
long enough to do things like space solar power.

John Savard

The Earth-moon L1 (aka Selene L1) is by far the easiest and most
payload efficient location to deploy whatever, and it's extremely
efficient for station-keeping it there. This location is better than
97% solar illuminated (up to 100% with a halo station-keeping orbit),
plus half the time getting secondary IR from our physically dark
moon. So, what's not to like?

How many extra TW would you like, and where would you like it
delivered?

http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”

On Oct 31, 4:31*pm, "Jonathan" wrote:
"Brad Guth" wrote in message

...
On Oct 28, 9:56 pm, "Jonathan" wrote:


Why does this issue always give me mental images
of an oblivious Louis XVI happily playing tennis
right up until the mobs charge the net?

NASA needs to stop looking to the distant reaches for
little green men, and stop reconstructing the ancient past
looking for God. And start thinking about the future.
And how to make it ..better. How to keep the promise
of space.

The plan is already sitting on the shelf for Chrissakes.

Jonathan

s
Expecting our mainstream status-quo (aka good old boys and those
having all the right stuff that always get to obfuscate their public
funded butts off) to use common sense, think and act on behalf of
others, is extremely optimistic of yourself.

It makes me go mental! *I'm not much for conspiracies, but
this issue makes me wonder if big money has been shooting
down the concept for ages. Certainty anyone from Texas
or big oil wouldn't want a new energy competitor. And big aero
has showed clearly they prefer a new assembly line of very
expensive one-shot 'Saturn V's' and lunar landers.

And if you think about why they'd want the Moon, there'd
only be the pressure of 'getting there'. They wouldn't have to
worry at all about producing a cost-effective or practical result.
Like the ISS, profit and other tangible accomplishments are
really just an aside. With Space Solar Power they'd have to
be held more to the standards of the private sector that requires
a certain pay-off by some date certain.

With the Moon, Mars and asteroids there's no such expectations.
It'd be like a military contract, whatever the over-runs are gets
paid by someone else. They make a profit no matter what.

SSP would force them back into the real world.

I totally agree with exploitation of space, and especially of
exploiting whatever's extremely nearby (at least to start off with).
Our new and improved DARPA/NASA has to give us options of significant
off-world advantages, such as those our moon and the extremely nearby
planet Venus can provide. *DARPA, NASA and DoE must consolidate, and
start getting 50% of their all-inclusive funding from private sources.

It's starting to look like turning the shuttle replacement, the X-37b, over
to Darpa has been a good idea. No funding squabbles and they can and are
rushing the project as a national security issue. And another funny
thing, no one around here seems to accept the fact the X-37b IS
the shuttle replacement. In denial maybe?

The next gold-rush era of significant rewards and technical
advancements needs to happen now, starting with cleaner and cheaper
energy, along with a greatly improved national infrastructure. *If
this takes Presidential executive orders, then so be it.

If is wasn't for the wars and great stock market crash, I think the
time for SSP would be quite ripe. NASA needs a new reason
for being, and technology advances, and oil price increases
has pushed SSP far closer to being cost effective. But what few
seem to accept is that SSP could travel places conventional
base load power could never reach. In particular the rural
third world areas that are still off the grid and Internet. Which
equates to being in the stone-age.

The ease of placing down a rectenna means on the receiving end
the costs are orders of magnitude cheaper than a conventional
power plant, and all the roads and railroads etc they need.
And since conventional power can't get there, SSP really wouldn't
have any competitors. They can charge what they need to.
For instance, would Japan post earthquake quibble over a
few cents per kw/h? Or the military in the field? Or if it was
the difference between half your crops spoiling...etc etc.

Not to mention energy is the second largest market of all.
It's a Gigantic marketplace! If you want to reinvigorate
all things NASA and space programs, connect it to
boatloads of cash. The first one to make a profit from
space energy is going to be the next Bill Gates, but of
the energy market. A market far larger than computers.

I want it to be America.

President BHO needs to start kicking public-funded butt and
terminating those either responsible for holding us back or incapable
of moving us forward. *Corruption in government needs to be classified
as treason. *Corruption against government or the republic needs to be
classified as treason.

The whole deregulation movement of the Bush era is coming
back to haunt us now with all the *runaway corruption.
If the Wall Street protesters seem unfocused it's because the
effects of corruption have spread throughout. If you were
standing outside a movie theater where some anonymous
voice had just yelled fire, all you're gonna see is a disaster
once the dust the settled. *Once someone has started a nasty
rumor about a teetering market, all the outsiders are going
to see is a sudden bankruptcy with no discernible 'smoking gun'
to blame.

Those protesters need to articulate their anger and position
much better, they have plenty of perfectly sound reasons
to protest.

Our Pentagon and DoD must deal with 10% cuts in funding per year, as
well as repeated for the next ten years. *The number of government
agencies or public-funded groups needs to be cut in half, or better
(same goes for military, homeland and borders).

The big draw down can come after N. Korea, Iran and China
finally come around. Once the world is full of free market
democracies, the prospect of large wars will become a thing
of the past.

Of course I can support most of what you have proposed, plus I have
many other solutions and demands, that like all of the above will
never happen in our lifetimes, because for most of us it's already
game over and the reason why 9/11 happened.

The primary reason I settled on Space Solar Power is that
of all the pie-in-the-sky dreams from the moon, mars and
asteroids etc, all the great world-changing goal, *Space Solar Power
is the ...only one... that can become a reality in our lifetimes.

I believe the 'equation' for Saving the World is to maximize
two quantities. How much the project can help the human
race, and how fast? And the icing on the cake would be
to also connect directly to the space program and NASA.

When you compare a colony on Mars for six people at the
end of a very long and expensive forty year project.
To a new, clean and inexhaustible energy source that can
start up in some five years from the check signing.
There's no contest at all.

I can't think of any other project that can do as much as
fast as Space Solar Power. Even if it wasn't limited
to the NASA and the space program, I still can't think
of a better solution to that equation given how far and
wide energy effects the planet.

Jonathan

Nothing wrong with SSP, except the powers that be (above those we
elect) want nothing to do with anything that's operated from a 100%
renewable and clean energy source.

I can give your SSP a tethered platform that'll be at 6r from Earth
(parked just outside of GSO), and it'll have unlimited energy to drive
as much SSP as you'd care to plug in.

http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”