Space Station to be Abandoned?

"Jeff Findley" wrote:
Once the shuttle is flying, would it be possible to use the shuttle to
return one of the completely failed Elektron units for refurbishment and
reflight?

What would be the sense of doing this? It's tossing good money after
bad.

Perhaps this could be done on an MPLM flight, since the MPLM
gives you bigger hatches than you get through the docking adapter.

Given that you have to go through an APAS hatch to get *to* the CBM
hatch... There is no 'win' to using an MPLM so far as hatch size
goes.

OTOH, you do cut down on the handling.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

One thing that I read said that part of the problem with the Elektron unit
is that they were pretty much hand-assembled one of a kind things, and that
the guy that really knew how they worked has passed away "taking sone trade
secrets with him". It may not just be a matter of replacing some parts to
get them operational.

Bryan

Furthermore, ESA and Japan are a bit slow (in terms of the ISS
program) in getting their resupply ships operational. It clearly
would have been beneficial to have thier ships flying by now as a
backup to any Shuttle or Progress failure.

This article:

http://www.space.com/spacenews/busin...ay_040419.html

just talks about technical and procurement problems. But wasn't there
also something about the agreements between the partners? That ESA
wasn't obligated to provide ATV until Columbus was launched, and
therefore they delayed the Columbus launch. Or something like that?
(This is kind of a dim memory, so I'm not sure whether it has any
bearing on when ATV will start flying, or how often ATV will fly).

(Derek Lyons) wrote:
John Doe wrote:
Whether Elektron was built that way or not, I am not sure. But Russian
mentality and manufactiring (emphasis on MANU - hand) processes might lead
one to believe that Elektron would be built to be serviced 100%.

Actually, that's bull****.. Any such assumption is based on
handwaving assumptions, not fact.


Day 1: the sun rises in the east
Day 2: the sun rises in the east
Day 3: the sun rises in the east
I predict that on Day 4 the sun will rise in the east.

Using past behaviour to predict subsequent behaviour is a fine
tradition. Of course, as turns up occasionally (Michelson & Morley),
there are times when not enough is known about past behaviour to avoid
a surprise, but then, that's how theories grow.

Oberg, Siddiqi, et alia are probably in a better position than most of
us to comment on the *conclusion* (aka prediction) (and definitely
not an *assumption*) and whether it is based on "handwaving
assumptions", but perhaps some study of more familiar items
manufactured by RSS and subcontractors could add or subtract credence
to the basis of the conclusion.

/dps

bob haller wrote:

Space station may fall into disrepair
Michael Hopkin

Failure to fix oxygen unit could leave orbiting lab crewless.

YEAH! Lets dump that poor excuse for a station and ground the shuttles too
before they ill another crew!!!!
HAVE A GREAT DAY!

You missed the entire point of the article. It was written with the only
purpose to re-iterate that the problematic generator was _russian_
built. The rest is just bunch of largely meaningless sentences added for
volume. The US has resumed its internal BS campaign intended to prepare
the pull out of ISS program, blaming everything on the "international
partners", and this article is nothing else than a small part of this
campaign. I won't be surprised if this "Michael Hopkin" in reality this
is the same person (or group of persons) who's responsible for producing
the recent stream of BS in "Florida Today" and other similar nonsense.

--
Best regards,
Andrey Tarasevich

(dave schneider) wrote:

(Derek Lyons) wrote:
John Doe wrote:
Whether Elektron was built that way or not, I am not sure. But Russian
mentality and manufactiring (emphasis on MANU - hand) processes might lead
one to believe that Elektron would be built to be serviced 100%.

Actually, that's bull****.. Any such assumption is based on
handwaving assumptions, not fact.


Day 1: the sun rises in the east
Day 2: the sun rises in the east
Day 3: the sun rises in the east
I predict that on Day 4 the sun will rise in the east.

That's nice. But in the case of most Soviet and Russian hardware, the
sun generally rises in the south or the east.

Oberg, Siddiqi, et alia are probably in a better position than most of
us to comment on the *conclusion* (aka prediction) (and definitely
not an *assumption*)

It's yet another of his "don't worry, be happy" handwaving assumptions
(definitely an *assumption*.)

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

dave schneider wrote:
Day 1: the sun rises in the east
Day 2: the sun rises in the east
Day 3: the sun rises in the east
I predict that on Day 4 the sun will rise in the east.

In the same vein:

day 1: people predict russian calamity. it doesn't happen.
day 2: poeple predict russian calamity, it doesn't happen.
day 3: poeple predict russian calamity, it doesn't happen.

I predict that the next call for russian calamity won't materialise and the
station will continue to orbit and keep crewmembers alive.

John Doe wrote:
I predict that the next call for russian calamity won't materialise and the
station will continue to orbit and keep crewmembers alive.

Had people been predicting a Russian calamity, you'd have a point.
Instead, as usual so far, you confuse drug addled hallucinations for
reality.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

John Doe wrote:
I predict that the next call for russian calamity won't materialise and the
station will continue to orbit and keep crewmembers alive.

Had people been predicting a Russian calamity, you'd have a point.
Instead, as usual so far, you confuse drug addled hallucinations for
reality.

D.

Lurching along from one make do patch to the next its only a matter of time
till one doesnt make do.

this is akin to accepting o ring seal erosion or foam loss as normal/

hey we must keep the station going, so the electron has disconnected
monitoring, and many other systems are having troubles, and requiring
continious servicing. Sure our environmental sensors are off line, and are
suits are a patchwork quilt of troubles.

It will be fine.....

said before columbia

It will be fine

Said before the ISS disaster.....

The safety investigation will find very similiar troubles...

Congress should appoint a safety board to inspect the ISS operation before
disaster strikes..
HAVE A GREAT DAY!

"fstops" wrote in message
...
One thing that I read said that part of the problem with the Elektron unit
is that they were pretty much hand-assembled one of a kind things, and
that
the guy that really knew how they worked has passed away "taking sone
trade
secrets with him". It may not just be a matter of replacing some parts to
get them operational.

While this is true, there are still ground units that the Russians operate
on the ground (for training, testing, and the like) in addition to the ones
on ISS. I'm sure that there are plenty of engineers that understand these
units to some degree. It certainly makes things harder, but not impossible.
Look at the number of "classic cars" that are still on the road despite the
fact that their manufacturers are long gone...

Jeff
--
Remove icky phrase from email address to get a valid address.