OT japans nuclear plant was known to be at risk

On Dec 31 2011, 11:02*pm, |"
wrote:
On Dec 31, 2:08*pm, Brad Guth wrote:





On Dec 29, 7:10*pm, |"

wrote:
On Dec 29, 5:44*am, bob haller wrote:

Fukushima plant's backup generator failed in 1991

The operator of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant failed to take
preventive measures after a backup generator was inundated by a
leaking pipe 20 years ago.

Former employees of the Tokyo Electric Power Company told NHK that the
problem occurred in October 1991.

They said water leaked from a pipe and entered the basement of the
Number 1 reactor's turbine building. This caused the failure of one of
the two backup generators.

A former engineer at the Fukushima plant said he told his superiors
that tsunami could damage the emergency generators in the basement, as
the turbine buildings are close to the sea.

TEPCO installed doors to block water leaks in the rooms hosting the
backup generators, but did not move them above ground to avoid tsunami
damage.

The plant's reactor cooling system failed when the emergency
generators in the basement were inundated by the March 11th tsunami..
All power sources were lost.

Japan'sNuclear Safety Commission says it will revise the safety
guidelines for designing nuclear plants and require the installation
of additional power sources.

Thursday, December 29, 2011 13:18 +0900 (JST)

It maybe the earthquake nailed the reactor(S) and the wave damage is
little
more than an after thought for use by the utility PR boys.

Bloody memory, I don't recall the details as I
like......................Trig

Lots of stuff went wrong, and the energy mafia in charge wasn't
prepared for squat going wrong.

Others will likely keep reminding us, and those seals will keep dieing
from radiation.

*http://news.yahoo.com/scientists-tes...-radiation-003...

*http://translate.google.com/#
*Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”

Not a proven thing on the seals, but it certainly does raise an issue
of what the seals and other marine creatures use as their range.

Nuclear Reactors last too long or are run too long;
they waste too much steel and leave lasting waste.

Trig- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

tuna migrate fromradiation polluted japan coast across the pacific
every year or two to off the us coast where they are caught.

now some must die along the way, get hit by ships, attacked by sharks
get ill, etc etc.

this ultimately spreads the radiation worldwide.

all fish processors should be required by law to check for radiation.

or we could end up eating it..

so they die and get eaten by other creatures

On Dec 31 2011, 11:21*pm, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:

japan and hopefully everyone else must now realize nuke plants are a
good terrorism target.....

If one assumes that terrorists can produce 8+ earthquakes and huge
tsunamis at will.

--
"Ordinarily he is insane. But he has lucid moments when he is
*only stupid."
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * -- Heinrich Heine

or run a plane into a storage pool, or fire a over the shoulder bomb
at a storage pool, or a ground assault on a plant, or well you get the
picture. storage pools arent in containment and arent hardened against
attack

nuke plants are easy targets, with dire consquences.

one plant near ny city could cause the permanent evacuation of new
york, displacing 8 to 10 million ppeople

On Jan 1, 5:38*am, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:
On Dec 31 2011, 11:21*pm, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:

japan and hopefully everyone else must now realize nuke plants are a
good terrorism target.....

If one assumes that terrorists can produce 8+ earthquakes and huge
tsunamis at will.

or run a plane into a storage pool, or fire a over the shoulder bomb
at a storage pool, or a ground assault on a plant, or well you get the
picture. storage pools arent in containment and arent hardened against
attack

The sky is falling! *THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!



nuke plants are easy targets, with dire consquences.

Yeah, sure. *That's why there have been so many successful attacks
against them.



one plant near ny city could cause the permanent evacuation of new
york, displacing 8 to 10 million ppeople

THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!! * T H E * S K Y * I S * F A L L I N G ! ! !

Hint: *Indian Point has massive containment domes and the cooling
pools are 30 feet deep into the ground. *Not plane, nor bomb, nor even
mob will cause a single hiccup.

Hit it with a nuke and see what you got. I'd bet even one
the jumbo sized soviet cruise missles with added improved navigation
could put a hole at the right part of the Energy Center to make quite
a mess.


--
"Ordinarily he is insane. But he has lucid moments when he is
*only stupid."
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * -- Heinrich Heine

It would just take one event especially late in the fuel cycle.

"The War to End All Wars" was just the Great War and
only the first world war of that century....................Trig

On Dec 31 2011, 8:24*pm, Fred J. McCall wrote:
Brad Guth wrote:

Others will likely keep reminding us, and those seals will keep dieing
from radiation.

http://news.yahoo.com/scientists-tes...-radiation-003...

"Water tests have not picked up any evidence of elevated radiation in
U.S. Pacific waters"

What a Guthball...

--
"Ordinarily he is insane. But he has lucid moments when he is
*only stupid."
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * -- Heinrich Heine

I'll have to admit that McCall is right in that the Pacific has
considerable dilution power. I won't want to eat fish out
of water off Japan but I suspect Alaskan salmon will still
be a pretty good value. And will be more degraded by
the can lacquer, PCBs, and DDE than hot cesium and
hot strontium.

Trig

On Dec 31 2011, 12:47*pm, bob haller wrote:
On Dec 31, 3:41*pm, Brad Guth wrote:









On Dec 31, 11:13*am, |"

wrote:
On Dec 30, wrote:

On Dec 29, 3:05*pm, bob haller wrote:

On Dec 29, wrote:

On Dec 29, 5:44*am, bob haller wrote:

Fukushima plant's backup generator failed in 1991

The operator of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant failed to take
preventive measures after a backup generator was inundated by a
leaking pipe 20 years ago.

Former employees of the Tokyo Electric Power Company told NHK that the
problem occurred in October 1991.

They said water leaked from a pipe and entered the basement of the
Number 1 reactor's turbine building. This caused the failure of one of
the two backup generators.

A former engineer at the Fukushima plant said he told his superiors
that tsunami could damage the emergency generators in the basement, as
the turbine buildings are close to the sea.

TEPCO installed doors to block water leaks in the rooms hosting the
backup generators, but did not move them above ground to avoid tsunami
damage.

The plant's reactor cooling system failed when the emergency
generators in the basement were inundated by the March 11th tsunami.
All power sources were lost.

Japan'sNuclear Safety Commission says it will revise the safety
guidelines for designing nuclear plants and require the installation
of additional power sources.

Thursday, December 29, 2011 13:18 +0900 (JST)

GE did a fine job of configuring those reactors to begin with, and
ever since there has been hardly if any upgrades or logical
improvements. *So,Japangot exactly what they paid for, and GE made a
small fortune.

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- Show quoted text -

just look at the chernobyl cancer rates and realize japans meltdown
was far worse than chernobyl.

chernobyl was a single reactor that was nearly brand new

whilejapanwas 4 40 year old reactors and storage pools

Exactly, and GE always knew the risk and the likely consequences.

Even as of that 40+ year old era, thorium reactors could have been the
norm.

They wanted us electric rate payers to essentially pay for the
production of plutonium, and they honestly didn't give any crap about
the risk.

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*BradGuth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth,BradGuth, BG / “GuthUsenet”

That leaves some thing to extract and in a pinch to use to build a
you know what. No matter the reactor park when wrecked "sinks"
the land of the rising sun.

Of course a nuclear device that goes bang delivered by an oxcart
to a nuclear reactor is something pretty close to a doomsday device.
It wouldn't matter whether the reactor targeted is uranium based or
thorium based. It might matter is the reactor was in a mountian as
opposed to on the surface. But there would be a different set of
risks in the face of in the event of a large quake for a reactor
under a mountain.

The Japanese it seems need to move a huge portion of their population..
Perhaps they can invade Antarctica or buy Greenland from the
natives?

a simple mutant peasant hoeing his potatoes somewhere in
the
Andes............................................. ......................Trig

You obviously know little about using thorium. *Thorium can be safely
delivered by an oxcart, and its spent fuel is practically a non-issue,
as well as any sort of dirty bomb or real nuclear WMD just isn't going
to happen by way of reactors being run with thorium fuel.

Using conventional uranium or worse MOX fuel is not only spendy but
highly problematic from the very get-go. *Those much safer AP-1000
reactor configurations should have been the case as of a decade before
the earthquake, and of course GE as well as our Sandia National
Laboratories always knew this.

Ring seals are among the first significant species to pay the ultimate
price.
*http://news.yahoo.com/scientists-tes...-radiation-003...

*http://translate.google.com/#
*Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth,BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

japan and hopefully everyone else must now realize nuke plants are a
good terrorism target.....

espically those plants with elevated non hardened waste core storage
pools, thats nearly all the GE BWR reactors

That's true, but with the sort of idiots in charge of those reactors
in Japan, terrorist are not required.

On Dec 31 2011, 2:19*pm, bob haller wrote:
fred marks everyone one of his posts to disappear in weeks if not
sooner.....

given freds unstable rants has he wondered what his employeer would
say if they got all his posts history.

he claims to work for a government defense contractor. they might be
very interested in his rants.....

although he might do no more than cut grass at a defense contractor,
or be a janitor spwecializing in toiletelogy, thats cleaning
toilets.......

Fred is Qinetiq-NA and/or Sandia.

On Jan 1, 7:25*pm, Fred J. McCall wrote:
|" wrote:
On Jan 1, 5:38*am, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:
On Dec 31 2011, 11:21*pm, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:

japan and hopefully everyone else must now realize nuke plants are a
good terrorism target.....

If one assumes that terrorists can produce 8+ earthquakes and huge
tsunamis at will.

or run a plane into a storage pool, or fire a over the shoulder bomb
at a storage pool, or a ground assault on a plant, or well you get the
picture. storage pools arent in containment and arent hardened against
attack

The sky is falling! *THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!

nuke plants are easy targets, with dire consquences.

Yeah, sure. *That's why there have been so many successful attacks
against them.

one plant near ny city could cause the permanent evacuation of new
york, displacing 8 to 10 million ppeople

THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!! * T H E * S K Y * I S * F A L L I N G ! ! !

Hint: *Indian Point has massive containment domes and the cooling
pools are 30 feet deep into the ground. *Not plane, nor bomb, nor even
mob will cause a single hiccup.

Hit it with a nuke and see what you got. I'd bet even one
the jumbo sized soviet cruise missles with added improved navigation
could put a hole at the right part of the Energy Center to make quite
a mess.

Once you can do that you don't need the nuke plant anymore. *Just hit
the city.

--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
*territory."
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * --G. Behn

Naw, you kill a chunk the continent if you hit a reactor and its
cooling pools. Plus there are the reactor park were a nuke can likely
get more than one. The combination is likely as close to a doomsday
weapon as I care to imagine.

Naw, you kill a chunk the continent if you hit a reactor and its
cooling pools. Plus there are the reactor park were a nuke can likely
get more than one. The combination is likely as close to a doomsday
weapon as I care to imagine.-

depending on what plant melts down, national effect would be bad.

take a plant near new york city, causing NY to be abandoned, and 8
million relocated.

the economic effects would be unreal, call what it would be a
depression. TALK ABOUT DEFICIT SPENDING

or how about a california coastal plant. the NRC has admited our
plants could be taken out by a tidelwave.

but imagine destroying much of americas heartland, ending food
production. shouldnt eat food grown in radioactive soil.

now before fred j no nothing says the sky is falling............

if the nuke plant in japan were on the other side of their country
prevailing winds could of spread the contamination over much of their
island to the point of making much of japan uninhabitible....

imagine having to relocate a entire country

On Jan 2, 9:46*am, Fred J. McCall wrote:
|" wrote:
On Jan 1, 7:25 pm, Fred J. McCall wrote:
|" wrote:
On Jan 1, 5:38 am, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:
On Dec 31 2011, 11:21 pm, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:

japan and hopefully everyone else must now realize nuke plants are a
good terrorism target.....

If one assumes that terrorists can produce 8+ earthquakes and huge
tsunamis at will.

or run a plane into a storage pool, or fire a over the shoulder bomb
at a storage pool, or a ground assault on a plant, or well you get the
picture. storage pools arent in containment and arent hardened against
attack

The sky is falling! THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!

nuke plants are easy targets, with dire consquences.

Yeah, sure. That's why there have been so many successful attacks
against them.

one plant near ny city could cause the permanent evacuation of new
york, displacing 8 to 10 million ppeople

THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!! T H E S K Y I S F A L L I N G ! ! !

Hint: Indian Point has massive containment domes and the cooling
pools are 30 feet deep into the ground. Not plane, nor bomb, nor even
mob will cause a single hiccup.

Hit it with a nuke and see what you got. I'd bet even one
the jumbo sized soviet cruise missles with added improved navigation
could put a hole at the right part of the Energy Center to make quite
a mess.

Once you can do that you don't need the nuke plant anymore. Just hit
the city.

Naw, you kill a chunk the continent if you hit a reactor and its
cooling pools.

No, you don't.



Plus there are the reactor park were a nuke can likely
get more than one. The combination is likely as close to a doomsday
weapon as I care to imagine.

And that's the only place it will work as you suggest - in your
imagination.

--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
*truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *-- Thomas Jefferson- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

well putting multiple reactors close together is obviously poor
engineering.

take note reactor 4 at fukashima was out of service but destroyed by
reactor 3 explosion

On Jan 2, 9:50*am, Fred J. McCall wrote:
bob haller wrote:

The sky is falling. *THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!

--
"Ordinarily he is insane. But he has lucid moments when he is
*only stupid."
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * -- Heinrich Heine

in fukashima the sky rained radiation.......