Flowing Space 101 -- Be Nimble Be Quick

Flowing Space 101

All right, please stand up. I'd like to bring your attention to
your feet, specifically, the bottom of your feet. You feel a
pressure there, correct? Could be your feet pressing down
on the floor? or the floor pressing up against your feet?

Now, lift one foot. No more pressure felt by that foot. And
more pressure is felt by the other foot as you constantly
adjust your balance, balance, balance. Okay, you can put
your foot down, now. Ah, that's better. It's easier to balance
when you have both feet on the ground.

What is keeping your feet on the floor? We call it "gravity."

Now, jump up into the air. What brings you back down
again? We call it gravity. Up to now, we have considered
this gravity to be an attraction of one mass for another. The
huge mass of the Earth attracting you and your feet to it. We
see it with magnetism... two masses attracting each other by
an unseen force. Hold two loose magnets in close proximity
to each other and let them go. What happens? Without any
hesitation, the two magnets jump toward each other, seeming
to be glued to each other.

One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does.

So here you are, caught in this apparently tremendous gravity
field. One mass--you--attracted by this other mass--Earth.
And nobody you talk to really knows why. Nobody seems
to know what it is about matter that attracts other matter. Oh
we know about electrical and magnetic attraction, but if you
take away the electric charge, and you cancel out the entire
magnetic field, matter *still* seems to attract other matter. Yet,
does it really? Is Earth really attracting you and your feet? or
is Earth attracting _space_ and you are just along for the ride?

Of the Flowing Space Models which are being proposed by
some, they have this much in common... space flows *into*
matter. But is space attracted by the matter? or is something
*pushing* space into the matter? And just what is space
made of that actually flows into matter?

hd&ssn
Paine
tbc

Painius wrote:

One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does.

Try lifting a 400 pound mass.
There you have that 'sticky sensation'.

--
Karl Heinz Buchegger

Painius wrote:

Flowing Space 101

All right, please stand up. I'd like to bring your attention to
your feet, specifically, the bottom of your feet. You feel a
pressure there, correct? Could be your feet pressing down
on the floor? or the floor pressing up against your feet?

Now, lift one foot. No more pressure felt by that foot. And
more pressure is felt by the other foot as you constantly
adjust your balance, balance, balance. Okay, you can put
your foot down, now. Ah, that's better. It's easier to balance
when you have both feet on the ground.

What is keeping your feet on the floor? We call it "gravity."

Now, jump up into the air. What brings you back down
again? We call it gravity. Up to now, we have considered
this gravity to be an attraction of one mass for another. The
huge mass of the Earth attracting you and your feet to it. We
see it with magnetism... two masses attracting each other by
an unseen force. Hold two loose magnets in close proximity
to each other and let them go. What happens? Without any
hesitation, the two magnets jump toward each other, seeming
to be glued to each other.

One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does.

So here you are, caught in this apparently tremendous gravity
field. One mass--you--attracted by this other mass--Earth.
And nobody you talk to really knows why. Nobody seems
to know what it is about matter that attracts other matter. Oh
we know about electrical and magnetic attraction, but if you
take away the electric charge, and you cancel out the entire
magnetic field, matter *still* seems to attract other matter. Yet,
does it really? Is Earth really attracting you and your feet? or
is Earth attracting _space_ and you are just along for the ride?

Of the Flowing Space Models which are being proposed by
some, they have this much in common... space flows *into*
matter. But is space attracted by the matter? or is something
*pushing* space into the matter? And just what is space
made of that actually flows into matter?

hd&ssn
Paine
tbc
You do get that sticky sensation but the distance is much greater.
Eric

"Karl Heinz Buchegger" wrote...
in message ...

Painius wrote:

One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does.

Try lifting a 400 pound mass.
There you have that 'sticky sensation'.

--
Karl Heinz Buchegger


'Lo Karl --

Interesting slant. I was thinking more like the feeling when you
wade through shallow water in your flip-flops. It's a suction cup
feeling... not difficult to lift, but moreso than just lifting your foot
off the floor.

To be sure, there is no law that i know of which states that if two
bodies attract each other, then there *must* be this gluey,
suctiony, stickiness feeling when you separate them. This is just
a curious side of gravity for me. It seems a little suspicious that
when masses are involved, whether it be an electric or a magnetic
attraction, then to separate them one must apply a little extra
amount of force to get them apart. Whereas with gravity, one
simply lifts one's foot and it readily separates from the floor.
There's no extra effort needed to "break the suction."

hd&ssn
Paine
tbc

"Eric" wrote in message...
news:wtEQc.213607$%_6.131578@attbi_s01...

Painius wrote:

. . .
One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does. . . .

You do get that sticky sensation but the distance is much greater.

Eric

'Lo Eric --

This appears to mean that if a gigantic hand were to reach down
out of the sky and try to separate me from the Earth, the owner of
this hand would experience the suctiony, gluey, sticky sensation felt
with electrically charged or magnetic masses. But why don't we feel
it when we lift ourselves off the ground? Why is it so easy to lift one
foot off the floor without having to "break the suction" each time?

I know there's no law which states that there *must* be this suction
when two masses attract. But to me it's a suspicious curiosity where
gravity is concerned. If Earth is attracting the ball, then why does the
ball easily bounce instead of being sucked in and held fast?

hd&ssn
Paine
tbc

"Painius" wrote in message ...
"Eric" wrote in message...
news:wtEQc.213607$%_6.131578@attbi_s01...

Painius wrote:

. . .
One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does. . . .

You do get that sticky sensation but the distance is much greater.

Eric

'Lo Eric --

This appears to mean that if a gigantic hand were to reach down
out of the sky and try to separate me from the Earth, the owner of
this hand would experience the suctiony, gluey, sticky sensation felt
with electrically charged or magnetic masses. But why don't we feel
it when we lift ourselves off the ground? Why is it so easy to lift one
foot off the floor without having to "break the suction" each time?

I know there's no law which states that there *must* be this suction
when two masses attract. But to me it's a suspicious curiosity where
gravity is concerned. If Earth is attracting the ball, then why does the
ball easily bounce instead of being sucked in and held fast?

hd&ssn
Paine
tbc


Why don't you rig up and apparatus with a spring scale and turn screw
to measure the force of attraction as you slowly separate two magnets.
If the force never varies from the inverse square of the distance,
then that stickiness must be an illusion. Otherwise, you might have a
point.

However, if the force seems to increase when the two magnets are in
physical contact (more force than expected is required to pull them
apart), then perhaps some electromagnetic consequence of their being
in conductive contact may be responsible.

Double-A

"Double-A" wrote in message...
om...

"Painius" wrote in message...
...

"Eric" wrote in message...
news:wtEQc.213607$%_6.131578@attbi_s01...

Painius wrote:

. . .
One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does. . . .

You do get that sticky sensation but the distance is much greater.

Eric

'Lo Eric --

This appears to mean that if a gigantic hand were to reach down
out of the sky and try to separate me from the Earth, the owner of
this hand would experience the suctiony, gluey, sticky sensation felt
with electrically charged or magnetic masses. But why don't we feel
it when we lift ourselves off the ground? Why is it so easy to lift one
foot off the floor without having to "break the suction" each time?

I know there's no law which states that there *must* be this suction
when two masses attract. But to me it's a suspicious curiosity where
gravity is concerned. If Earth is attracting the ball, then why does
the
ball easily bounce instead of being sucked in and held fast?

Why don't you rig up and apparatus with a spring scale and turn screw
to measure the force of attraction as you slowly separate two magnets.
If the force never varies from the inverse square of the distance,
then that stickiness must be an illusion. Otherwise, you might have a
point.

However, if the force seems to increase when the two magnets are in
physical contact (more force than expected is required to pull them
apart), then perhaps some electromagnetic consequence of their being
in conductive contact may be responsible.

Double-A

You're right, AA, this is a good exercise to determine if the
"stickiness" force can be measured. However, don't you find it
to be interesting that this stickiness exists between magnets or
between a magnet and an appropriate unmagnetized metal, but
it does not exist between you and the Earth? and the inverse-
square law applies to both?

Another difference that intrigues me is how a magnetic field or
an electrical field can be blocked, but nothing we know of will
block gravity! To me, this could be dramatic evidence that,
whatever the source, a gravitational field must be short enough
in wavelength to preclude its being blocked by anything. It's
waves have to be short enough to, for the most part, pass
through all types of atoms.

hd&ssn
Paine
tbc

"Painius" wrote in message ...
"Double-A" wrote in message...
om...

"Painius" wrote in message...
...

"Eric" wrote in message...
news:wtEQc.213607$%_6.131578@attbi_s01...

Painius wrote:

. . .
One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation. This is very, very
different from when you lifted your foot off the floor. Gravity
does not produce this sticking sensation that magnetism does. . . .

You do get that sticky sensation but the distance is much greater.

Eric

'Lo Eric --

This appears to mean that if a gigantic hand were to reach down
out of the sky and try to separate me from the Earth, the owner of
this hand would experience the suctiony, gluey, sticky sensation felt
with electrically charged or magnetic masses. But why don't we feel
it when we lift ourselves off the ground? Why is it so easy to lift one
foot off the floor without having to "break the suction" each time?

I know there's no law which states that there *must* be this suction
when two masses attract. But to me it's a suspicious curiosity where
gravity is concerned. If Earth is attracting the ball, then why does
the
ball easily bounce instead of being sucked in and held fast?

Why don't you rig up and apparatus with a spring scale and turn screw
to measure the force of attraction as you slowly separate two magnets.
If the force never varies from the inverse square of the distance,
then that stickiness must be an illusion. Otherwise, you might have a
point.

However, if the force seems to increase when the two magnets are in
physical contact (more force than expected is required to pull them
apart), then perhaps some electromagnetic consequence of their being
in conductive contact may be responsible.

Double-A

You're right, AA, this is a good exercise to determine if the
"stickiness" force can be measured. However, don't you find it
to be interesting that this stickiness exists between magnets or
between a magnet and an appropriate unmagnetized metal, but
it does not exist between you and the Earth? and the inverse-
square law applies to both?


With a magnet the center of the magnetic field is very close, so the
d^2 is very short, and so the force is increasing very rapidly. I
think that is what you perceive as stickiness. We are quite a
distance from the center of the Earth's gravity, so moving your foot
up and down doesn't change the force much, thus no stickiness. Also
note that the Earth's magnetic field has a more distant center of
force, and therefore it is not sticky either.

If you had a tiny black hole to play with on your desk, however, I
think you would find its gravity very sticky!

Double-A

"Double-A" wrote in message
m...
"Painius" wrote in message
...
"Double-A" wrote in message...
om...

"Painius" wrote in message...
...

"Eric" wrote in message...
news:wtEQc.213607$%_6.131578@attbi_s01...

Painius wrote:

. . .
One difference between gravity and magnetism is this "glued"
feeling. Try separating the magnets. When you do this, there
is a, sort of, sticking or sticky sensation.

Take two mar magents and *stick* them together

Try pulling them apart. some difficulty observed.

Now slide them apart to the sides. very much less difficulty observed.

To me this demonstrates the additive effect of the magnetic *lines of flux*,
which I am sure we all remember from Junior High Electricity shop
excersises.

No stickyness involved.

"spam this" wrote...
in message ...

Take two mar magents and *stick* them together

Try pulling them apart. some difficulty observed.

Now slide them apart to the sides. very much less difficulty observed.

To me this demonstrates the additive effect of the magnetic *lines of
flux*,
which I am sure we all remember from Junior High Electricity shop
excersises.

No stickyness involved.

'Lo ****ItIGotMyOrders --

It's the "difficulty" you describe above which i am calling
"stickiness." So as you yourself seem to agree, this kind
of stickiness *is* involved.

And with a little more research you will find that those
magnetic lines of flux have actually been believed to be
more of an illustrative construct than a reality ever since
the times of Michael Faraday. There are still a few
scientists around who think that magnets literally have
these flux lines associated with them, but many have
recognized that the tiny iron filings which line up on these
flux lines in the classical photographs become little magnets
themselves, each with their own magnetic field interacting
with the main magnet's field.

So now, these lines of flux, when shown, generally
represent a certain strength of the magnetic field at a given
distance from the magnet. There are no "lines" where the
field strength is more intense than the areas between the
lines. A magnetic field is a smooth changing of field
intensity, getting weaker as distance from the magnet
increases to the same inverse-square law as gravity.

hd&ssn
Paine
tbc